Update from Ukraine | A new Attack operation on the south | Kadyrov could be in coma

Youtube.com ^ | 9-16-2023 | Denys Davydov

[MadMax, the Grinning Reaper]

Good news tonight. I think that is also the title of a song.I’ll sing it..

[Widget Jr]

Too many tempers on the forum are too easily frayed.

[fieldmarshaldj]

“Frayed” is telling the other person to eff off or “don’t post to me again.” Last I checked, a murder threat online is still a criminal offense:

https://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/crime-penalties/federal/Criminal-Threats.htm

[BroJoeK]

popdonnelly: "What are we supposed to do, let Putin occupy Ukraine?"

Extremely Extreme Extremist: "I don't care.
I don't know how many times I have to make this point.
I don't have a dog in this fight.
If Putin loses, he loses, I'm not going to cry about it.
I don't want endless tax dollars, military equipment, and possible U.S. troops to fight in this war."

Of course, and that was the same opinion of most French, Brits and Americans when irredentists occupied the Rhineland in 1936 (similar to Chechnya) and Austria in 1938 (like Georgia) and Czechoslovakia in 1938 and 1939 (like Ukraine).

By September 1939 the Nazi war machine had grown so large and powerful it eventually took the entire world in a desperate fight to defeat it, with tens of millions killed.

Oh, do you think history can never repeat itself?
I refer you to the Putin state sponsored Russian Imperial Movememt (RIM) and Russian Imperial Legion (RIL).

Here is a primer on those.

[BroJoeK]

popdonnelly: "What are we supposed to do, let Putin occupy Ukraine?"

MinorityRepublican: "No but at the same time we shouldn't give Ukraine a blank check.
If the EU wants to continue to support Ukraine, then they need to do that.
We don't have to take the lead."

It's worth remembering that in every US war since WWII, the US contributed at least 90% of the troops, equipment & money.
In Ukraine we contribute no troops -- zero, nada, zilch boots on the ground -- and only about 50% of the equipment & money.

It's true that Europeans should step up and contribute more, but we are already substantially reduced below levels of US contributions in historical context.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

I still don’t give a feces.
Get your head out of the past.

[BroJoeK]

Extremely Extreme Extremist: "I still don’t give a feces.
Get your head out of the past."

The past is the future for people who do not give a feces.

[Paul R.]

Mostly, I agree. The stipulation on limitation of deep strikes into Russia proper is merely a slight loosening up of present policy. Mostly it just takes away any argument that Ukraine defending itself is some sort of serious offensive threat to Russia proper.

I did say fine tuning was likely needed, so...

"Would you object to the USA providing directly to Ukraine from here on out only physical (not money) humanitarian aid, training, intel, and older weapons we would otherwise scrap or replace in coming(5?) years?"

Ukraine could still of course obtain most anything else through other NATO countries, just not at US' expense. Note that my whole argument is not to supporters of Ukraine defending itself, it is to those complaining about the cost while the US supposedly isn't spending enough on domestic priorities. (That complaint is ridiculous -- the aid to Ukraine is the proverbial drop in the bucket compared to what the US spends (a lot of it misspent or even does damage) on domestic programs, but I digress.) I received no substantive reply from any of these complainers. ;-)

The precedent would mean, China invading Taiwan would be without consequences, Russia invading the Baltic states would be without consequences.

Heck, we've got numerous FReepers who think that's just fine! Basically "Why should I give a ****?". Me, I really don't want to have us retreat back to US shores, quintuple our defense budget, live considerably poorer, and wait for the radioactive fallout* to drift in...

*Granted it might be a bit before Satan gets THAT belly-laugh. :-(

What you're pitching is exactly what Putin and the Kremlin pitched...

My intent would be for Ukraine to beat Russia back, and then remain much too prickly to step on. So, I don't quite understand how you come to that conclusion. Granted it's been a while since I read those demands. Please elucidate / quote. Maybe more fine tuning or detail is needed. I am open to suggestions. ;-)

[Paul R.]

The record for those who do not learn from the past is not too good. Of course, they don’t want to hear that...