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Veteran’s Day Remembrance: The Ball Turret Gunner
self | November 11, 2019 | self

Posted on 11/11/2019 5:37:23 PM PST by Retain Mike

The near certainty the United States would be drawn into WW II prompted creation of an autonomous Army Air Force. Until the war in Europe began, standard doctrine gave an air corps had no mission beyond supporting the ground forces. Now air power advocates received the authority to prove the theory that bombers could win wars. The B-24 Liberator and B-17 Flying Fortress carried 10-13 .50cal machine guns for defense and the Norden bombsight for precision daylight attack. Under combat conditions peacetime accuracy was never realized and bombers suffered horrendous losses until the P-51 Mustang could escort them all the way to the target. Now granted a lot of the men ended up as prisoners of war, but one historian noted that Kamikaze squadrons had a lessor casualty rate until fighter escorts could accompany the missions. Completing 25 missions was so extraordinary in 1942 and 1943, that the aircraft and crew of the Memphis Belle returned to the United States to sell war bonds.

Even though all crew members had to contemplate a dismal fate, that of the ball turret gunner exceeded all others. The man operating the two machine guns on the belly of these aircraft is described by Gregory Freeman in his book The Forgotten 500.

“Nobody really wanted to be in a ball turret. This Plexiglas ball hanging from the bottom of the bomber was one of America’s latest innovations in air warfare. An ingenious piece of machinery built by the Sperry Corporation; the ball turret was a heavily armed bubble just big enough to hold a grown man – but only on the small side. It had room for the gunner and its two fifty-caliber machine guns – and little else. The extremely cramped quarters meant that the gunner was the only crew member on a bomber who did not wear a parachute during a mission. Provided the hoist worked, he was left sitting up in the main part of the plane, where he would have to go to get it and put it on before escaping with the rest of the crew. [Clare] Musgrove always told his students: ‘Stow your chute where you can find it in a hurry. You won’t have much time’.”

“The ball turret was not a place for the claustrophobic. It was a tiny space, though it had a great view of the scenery below – or the fighter plane coming up to kill you. The entire unit rotated around in a circle and also up and down, so that the gunner could fire on planes coming from any direction. Being suspended underneath the plane gave the gunner a sensation of flying free, and that often meant that the attacking fighter seemed to be going after him personally rather than trying to shoot down the bomber itself. Everyone on the plane was riding an adrenaline surge during a fighter attack, but none more so than the ball turret gunner who was furiously firing his fifty – caliber machine guns at the German plane trying to kill him in his little glass bubble.”

“The ball turret gunner sat curled up in a fetal position, swiveling the entire turret as he aimed the two guns. As he moved the turret quickly to find attacking planes and then follow them with his guns, the gunner could be in any position from lying on his back to standing on his feet. The gunner sat between the guns, his feet in stirrups positioned on either side of a thirteen-inch-diameter window in front, his knees up around his ears and very little room for moving anything but his hands. His flight suit provided the only padding for comfort.”

“An optical gunsight hung in front of his face, and a pedal under his left foot adjusted a reticule on the gunsight glass. When the target was framed in the sight, the gunner knew the range was correct and he let fly with the machine guns, pushing down one of the two firing buttons located on the wooden handles that controlled the movement of the ball. Shell casings were ejected through a port just below the gun barrels, pouring out as fast as the beads of sweat on the gunner’s face.”

“The plane carried two 150 round belts of ammunition per gun for the ball turret and fed them down from boxes mounted on either side of the hoist. The ball turret in the B-24, which Musgrove flew, could be electrically raised and lowered, unlike those on the B-17 bombers, which had to be manually cranked up into the fuselage. Musgrove thought this was a great improvement over the B-17 design, because no one wanted to be trapped in a ball turret. There was no way to exit the turret without raising it into the fuselage of the plane, so a turret that could not be retracted was a deathtrap for the gunner. Any system that made it faster and easier to retract the turret was welcomed by the gunners. They had all heard the stories of ball turret gunners who were trapped in their glass bubbles when battle damage prevented them being retracted into the fuselage. Not only was the gunner left out there with no protection, probably with his guns empty or inoperative, but he also faced the prospect of the big plane landing with him hanging from the belly.”

“It was every ball turret gunner’s nightmare, and it became a horrifying reality for some. If the gunner was already dead in the turret and it could not be retracted into the plane, the crew sometimes would jettison the whole apparatus, because the plane was not designed to land with the ball turret hanging underneath. But if the gunner was alive, they would have to tell him that they had no choice but to put the plane down eventually. The ball turret gunner had a long time to contemplate his fate, maybe to say good-bye on the intercom to his crewmates, as the damaged plane limped back to the base or looked for a field in which to crash. All he could do was sit in the glass bubble like a helpless fetus in the womb, watching the ground come closer and closer. When the plane landed, the ball turret was often scraped off the belly, taking the gunner with it. This problem occurred with the B-24. There was sufficient clearance with the B-17 for the turret to be in the lowered position, if the plane could land with the wheels down.”

These bombers were mainly crewed by teenagers and men in their early twenties. Veterans Day provides an opportunity to contemplate the extraordinary hazards some of these young men, become our fathers, grandfathers, great-grandfathers, faced to be considered the “Greatest Generation”.

The Forgotten 500 by Gregory Freeman

United States Army Air Forces https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_Air_Forces#Army_Air_Forces_created

Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_B-17_Flying_Fortress

Consolidated B-24 Liberator https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consolidated_B-24_Liberator

Norden bombsight https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norden_bombsight

The Death of the Ball Turret Gunner by Randall Jarrell https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Death_of_the_Ball_Turret_Gunner

From my mother's sleep I fell into the State, And I hunched in its belly till my wet fur froze. Six miles from earth, loosed from its dream of life, I woke to black flak and the nightmare fighters. When I died they washed me out of the turret with a hose.


TOPICS: History; Military/Veterans
KEYWORDS: aviation; bomber; ww2; wwii
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To: Retain Mike; archy; kunsanhistorian; xzins; 2ndDivisionVet; SandRat; zot; HarleyLady27; ...

Aerial gunner ping. Reminder to me of a member of the church congregation I grew up in, one of whose members, still living, was a B-17 ball turret gunner. Thanks for writing this to you Retain Mike.


21 posted on 11/12/2019 2:32:32 AM PST by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
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To: Retain Mike
The Death of the Ball Turret Gunner

By Randall Jarrell

From my mother’s sleep I fell into the State,
And I hunched in its belly till my wet fur froze.
Six miles from earth, loosed from its dream of life,
I woke to black flak and the nightmare fighters.
When I died they washed me out of the turret with a hose.

22 posted on 11/12/2019 4:18:56 AM PST by Alas Babylon! (The media is after us. Trump's just in the way.)
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To: Chickensoup

The men who returned with PTSD (not a ‘thing’ back then). Dad was on the winter Death March out of Stalag Luft 3 when a fallen airman grabbed his pant leg. Dad couldn’t stop to help or he would have been shot.

When I was a child, I used to kiss my dad to wake him when he was napping. He always awoke with a start, a shout and a horrified look on his face. He once told me that he always saw that airman’s face when he awoke from sleep. The only affliction he was diagnosed with was loss of hearing. At the end of his life, I did ask him if he was tortured in the POW camps and he said no. These conversation were the only things I remember.....otherwise he never talked about his wartime experiences.


23 posted on 11/12/2019 5:42:06 AM PST by originalbuckeye ('In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act'- George Orwell..?)
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To: Zuriel

My uncle was a B-17 waist gunner flying 35 combat missions out of Italy during WWII. During the cold war we were never stationed on the same base at the same time. We did meet by chance around the US, Europe and the far east. He didn’t tell me of his WWII experiences. I never asked. As I handled his affairs after he died I discovered a small notebook that listed those missions. I used that resulting in full details his life during those times. It does not glorify him. He and his fellow crew members did their jobs just like all the others. They finally worked themselves out of a job.

His burial included full military honors. The ceremony ended with a dramatic version of the Air Force Hymn. His story is now in Family History Library in Salt Lake City.


24 posted on 11/12/2019 7:18:55 AM PST by hdstmf (first)
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To: hdstmf

Thank you for sharing that story.

After a couple of dates with my future wife, she mentioned her father’s service (mentioned a few posts earlier). So, to strike up conversation with him, when we got back to their house, I thanked him for his service, and mentioned that my uncle was a gunner in a 24. My future mother in law quickly said: “Cal was awarded the DFC!” To which he replied, “Aww, everbody got that.” And she said, “No they didn’t”.

Tired from a day at work, and probably ready to turn in for the night, he was now perked up and asked where my uncle had been based in England.

I was embarrased, as I wasn’t sure where, but simply said that I didn’t know, but would find out from Mom. Then I told him that, unfortunately, he never made out of his bomber when it went down.

His face turned pale, then he said, “Sorry to hear that. I’m sure he was a good man,.... a lot of good men died,....”.

After a moment, he politely excused himself to bed.
I remember that evening like it was only a week ago, instead of 42 yrs ago last month.


25 posted on 11/12/2019 8:03:39 AM PST by Zuriel (Acts 2:38,39....Do you believe it?)
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To: Chickensoup

One of my Dad’s best friends and golf buddies back in the early 60s was our across-the-street neighbor...I liked “Joe” immensely as a funny, jovial man’s man and for his kindness to all of us kids...

I also remember Joe drank a lot, often way too much and would come home hammered drunk...I asked Dad why Joe drank so much and he explained to the kid I was that a lot of the guys had trouble with alcohol after “the War”...Later on I learned Joe was a Ranger at Pont du Hoc...


26 posted on 11/12/2019 9:54:47 AM PST by elteemike (Light travels faster than sound...That's why so many people appear bright until you hear them speak)
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To: TigerHawk

Thank you. My uncle sent identical cards to his twin sisters, telling them a few things about England, and to read each others card.

My mother guarded that card so well, that none of us kids knew it existed until we were adults. She knew how small children could make a mess of a house, and certainly wouldn’t risk letting one of us taking it to school for show and tell.

His handwriting was certainly better than mine.


27 posted on 11/12/2019 9:55:47 AM PST by Zuriel (Acts 2:38,39....Do you believe it?)
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To: Chickensoup

One of my Dad’s best friends and golf buddies back in the early 60s was our across-the-street neighbor...I liked “Joe” immensely as a funny, jovial man’s man and for his kindness to all of us kids...

I also remember Joe drank a lot, often way too much and would come home hammered drunk...I asked Dad why Joe drank so much and he explained to the kid I was that a lot of the guys had trouble with alcohol after “the War”...Later on I learned Joe was a Ranger at Pont du Hoc...


28 posted on 11/12/2019 9:58:06 AM PST by elteemike (Light travels faster than sound...That's why so many people appear bright until you hear them speak)
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To: Retain Mike

Bttt.

5.56mm


29 posted on 11/12/2019 10:27:25 AM PST by M Kehoe (DRAIN THE SWAMP! BUILD THE WALL!)
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To: elteemike

Fwiw, my dad said that when his Bomber Wing was stationed in England (The B-17 Squadron that he was assigned to was based about an HOUR north of London.) that LIQUOR was so downright cheap that you could “get blitzed for a single dollar”.

Note: A WV squadron also was MAKING “bootleg hooch” & that “slop” was REALLY cheap.

He also said that “We found a local pub that would COOL-DOWN the beer for us.” = FEW American GIs liked WARM beer.

Yours, TMN78247


30 posted on 11/12/2019 11:12:52 AM PST by TMN78247 ("VICTORY or DEATH", William Barrett Travis, LtCol, comdt., Fortress of the Alamo, Bejar, 1836)
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To: Alas Babylon!

Thanks for posting it, I had that on deck to post and decided I’d better check first to make sure.


31 posted on 11/14/2019 11:52:37 AM PST by SunkenCiv (Imagine an imaginary menagerie manager imagining managing an imaginary menagerie.)
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To: TangoLimaSierra

In my opinion the tail Gunner was the most dangerous. The NAZIS fighters specifically targeted the tail gunner so they could get a free run on the bomber. I thought that the causality rate was the highest of any crew member at 50%.


32 posted on 11/16/2019 5:19:48 PM PST by 2001convSVT (Medicare for All = Medical Care for None!)
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