Posted on 05/26/2019 7:53:43 AM PDT by logi_cal869
Link only
I don't have first hand knowledge of the simulator training programs of US based carriers. However, I do believe the above statement from the article is true.
As an FYI, the links below are CBT lessons for the 737 NG autoflight system, which I believe is identical to the 737 MAX autoflight system.
Reviewing the CBTs shows the complexity of the autoflight system and the need for multiple simulator sorties to learn the system. The unknown is how emergency procedures related to autoflight are taught.
. The pilots were confronted with a load of warnings in the cockpit, more than anyone could be reasonably expected handle, he said.
If pilots don’t know to get the wings level and nose where it belongs, first thing, then they are terminally stupid.
Just wait until robots are flying the planes remotely.
Flying commercial airplanes to me, a non- pilot, seems to be the easiest kind of flying. I cannot understand why you need complicated computer systems.
The plane takes off and lands on , to me, an overly long, wide, well maintained runway. Some of these runways are 10-12,000 feet long.
The take offs and landings are very conservative so as not to alarm the passengers.
The plane in fligth makes very few if any sharp turns or dives or ascents when in flight.
When it lands it takes a long approach and the pilots get assistance from the tower telling them what runaway to land on , and what the weather is and whether to land or not.
Why this type of flying would need complicated computer systems is beyond me.
This not flying a fighter jet type of flying.
Or the other extreme ,flying a Pitt Special doing incredible aerial stunts. - Tom
This is pure bullshit. My younger son is a pilot for Delta. He goes through extensive training when changing planes that he flies. He also goes through very tough simulator evaluations every six months in order to maintain proficiency.
He will be starting training next month when he will go through two months of training on the Airbus 330 models before he starts flying routes from Sea-Tac to Asia and Europe. My son is 42 and has been an airline pilot for 21 years.
I've always liked Sc-Fi because it is so often prophetic.
Years ago I read a story which was later turned into a Night Gallery episode (The Little Black Bag). In the future, people are so dumbed down that the intelligence is built into the tools. There's a glitch in time and a surgeon's bag is sent back and found by a loser and his buddy. They discover the secret and go into the cosmetic surgery business (the scalpels cause no pain and automatically do what needs to be done).
The two losers get into a fight over the profits and one guy is killed by one of the the scalpels. A red light goes on in the future and all the surgeon's tools in the are reset to dumb - just like any other of todays tools.
The survivor is hauled before a large audience to prove he does painless surgery, and he displays the scalpel's safety be drawing it across his throat. As the people file out, the express wonder why someone would commit suicide in front of all those people.
I thought it a good, if far-fetched story and went out to a McDonald's. The kid at the register was punching pictures of hamburgers and fries - no numbers at all. Suddenly, the story was not that far-fetched at all.
It's gotten worse, as pointed out by others here.
https://www.satcom.guru/2019/04/stabilizer-trim-loads-and-range.html
“With the 737MAX cutout switches, MCAS runaway is stopped by throwing both switches, losing electric trim altogether. In this case, the flight crew must rely on manual trim via turning the trim wheel/crank. As discussed above, the manual crank can bind up, making flying much more difficult.
“Any hazard classification would distinguish between having electric trim and having to use the manual crank, due to workload and conditions where the crank can become difficult to operate and by managing speed carefully.
“The Flight Standardization Board acknowledged the new cutout switches without making note of the different situations under an autopilot/STS runaway.
“The FSB did not acknowledge MCAS as a difference, it has been entirely vacant regarding MCAS until the FSB has issued draft 17, which does evaluate MCAS).
“Another key feature that would have come out if MCAS were evaluated is that MCAS nose down trim commands are not stopped by aft column cutout. Aft column cutout is designed to stop the stabilizer from a mis-trim. Human factors favor the aft column cutout as that is the natural reaction to a nose down runaway. The FSB recommends review of MCAS malfunction.
If this article were about Delta specifically, or US Air Carriers generally, then I would agree. Given the context of the 2 737 MAX accidents, then I believe the article has some validity.
I have been to Delta's training center in Atlanta and have flown one of their 737 simulators. I have good friends that are instructors at the center. I am confident your son gets the best training there is. However, I have serious doubts about the training programs of "third world airlines," as well as the qualifications required to enter training.
Here's the information on the Ethiopian Air Pilot in Command:
According to Ethiopian Airlines records, the captain has the following flight experience:
Total hours: 8122
Total hours in B737: 1417
Total hours in B737-8 MAX: 103
Flight time in previous 90 days: 266 hours and 9 minutes
Flight time in previous 7 days: 17 hours and 43 minutes
Flight time in previous 72 hours: no flight time
The pilot in command was 29 years old. According to Ethiopian Civil Aviation Authority (ECAA) records, the Captain’s most recent simulator training experience was September 30, 2018, and his most recent simulator proficiency check was October 1, 2018. The captain completed the Ethiopian Aviation Academy on July 23, 2010. A review of the captains training records indicated that he received his 737-800 First Officer type rating on January 31, 2011 and completed his PIC type rating for the 737-800 October 26, 2017. 737MAX differences training on 3 July, 2018.
The pilot in command is type rated as a First Officer of the following types of aircrafts: B737-7/800, B767/757, B777 and B787. As pilot in command, he is rated on B737-7/800 and B737MAX.
The pilot’s ECAA license allowed him to act as pilot-in-command in commercial air transport operations in a Boeing 737-7/800 (dated October 26, 2017) and Boeing 737 MAX (dated July 3, 2018.)
Here's the information on the Ethiopian Air First Officer:
According to Ethiopian Airlines records, the First-Officer has the following flight experience:
Total hours: 361
Total hours in B737: 207
Total hours in B737-8 MAX: 56
Flight time in previous 90 days: 207 hours and 26 minutes
Flight time in previous 7 days: 10 hours and 57 minutes
Flight time in previous 72 hours: 5 hours and 25 minutes
The first-officer was 25 years old. According to ECAA records, the first-officer’s most recent simulator event was listed as a proficiency check and occurred on December 3, 2018. His line training/check (conducted in the B737 aircraft) was completed on January 31, 2019.
The first-officer’s ECAA license allowed him to act as first-officer in commercial air transport operations in Boeing 737-7/800 (dated December 12, 2018) and Boeing 737 MAX (dated December 12, 2018.)
So, the Pilot in Command had over 8000 hours, but how much of that time was spent at the controls? How much time was spent monitoring the autopilot?
The first officer had total time of 361 hours with 263 in the right seat of the 737. He entered training with less than 100 hours flying time.
I will never fly on Ethiopian Air.
Almost all of it.
They set up scenarios and then start throwing system failures and other hazards and/or emergencies at the pilot and SO.
In a crisis due to loss or malfunction of the external angle of attack indicator, one has to defeat MCAS while manually trimming the aircraft. Sure, a good, experienced pilot who has trained for such an emergency can carry it off by disabling MCAS. Unfortunately, Boeing's 737-MAX manual and training glossed over the possibility of an emergency due to loss of the angle of attack indicator. US airline pilots complained to Boeing of this and other safety issues only to get brushed off.
Even worse, Boeing made certain safety features into extra cost options. Plausibly, even with poor pilots, the two crashes might have been averted had the optional safety features been on those aircraft instead of being omitted as costly options that would have strained the budgets of Third World carriers.
Ominously but deservedly for Boeing's corporate management, the SEC has taken an interest in the controversy. There is a fair chance that between the NTSB and the SEC, Boeing will be called to account for business decisions that made for bad engineering choices that led to two major air crashes. The FAA also deserves a going over for becoming so accommodating to America's leading civilian aircraft maker.
You don’t know what you’re talking about.
Once watched a (Saudi, I believe) 747 line up to land on a runway of the decommissioned Floyd Bennett NAS instead of a runway at JFK. The FBNAS runway was at about a 90 degree angle to the JFK runway and about 5 statute miles closer. A rather rapid port-starboard zig-zag got him back on the proper approach. I'm sure the radio traffic from the tower would have been quite interesting.
I would agree on that point. I can appreciate a guy whose profession is to handle a firearm and spends prodigious time at the range not just firing, but scenarios. But I expect that of a pilot (simulator time) responsible for dozens, if not hundreds, of passengers...
Air France 447 is a case study where the computer failed to account for a frozen sensor and the flight system jockeys forgot basic flight. With MCAS the other variable is that Boeing’s designers omitted a basic safety factor: Redundancy.
I’d much rather have a trained/experienced pilot at the controls with a FO backup.
I am not alone.
Here’s what is also not discussed re this subject: The elimination of the position of ‘flight engineer’. The FE was responsible for all of the aircraft’s systems. The pilot and FO flew the damned plane.
Clearly there’s room for a few bucks more per ticket and design a systems engineer back into the cockpit.
We have decades more to go before we can rely upon computers for autonomy. If nothing else, that is the overarching lesson from all of this (plus trained pilots responsible for nothing else but flying the plane).
“Once watched a (Saudi, I believe) 747 line up to land on a runway of the decommissioned Floyd Bennett NAS instead of a runway at JFK.”
Just looked at the relative locations of each. That’s scary, to say the least.
I would have thought that when they modified the plane and had an angle of attack indicator one one side they would have jumped at the opportunity of having another one on the other side of the cockpit in case a bird strike, runway debris strike or icing up occurred so that the pilot would immediately see something was amiss, and explain in detail how to take over control of the plane.
To me it is like selling cars with either front brakes or rear brakes, you do not need both,but if you want both you have to pay extra. -Tom
Boeing also seems to have missed the point that its reputation is at risk every time one of its aircraft flies. They are fools to design to the minimum and to make safety optional.
You make some good points, especially about the long runways. When a pilot is used to landing and taking off at short fields with obstructions to clear on one or both ends, it feels like you are in slow motion when you come into some place with a long and wife runway.
That said... my brother has been an airline captain for decades as are many of my neighbors and airliners are incredibly complicated beasts as compared to small general aviation aircraft. Just a look at the control panel should convince most people. A competent pilot should know what every knob, guage, switch, fuse, and control does and how to use it. The landing, takeoff and cruising speeds are much higher, and those thick manuals are filled with procedures and numbers that competent pilots should know by heart.
But there does seem to be a problem when the basics of flight are so insulated from the pilots that they no longer feel comfortable flying a normal small plame.
One of our neighbors is a 28 year old woman who we have known since she was 6. She, both her parents and her brother are airline pilots. She bought her own T-6, a plane which was originally designed in the 1930s. Her dad told me just her last annual cost her $30,000. It has a big old 600hp radial engine on the front and she flies it in and out of our short field with obstructions on both ends, not to mention sometimes severe turbulence from the surrounding hills. She spent this last weekend in Sweet Water, Texas giving surviving WASP women from WWII rides in the trainers they learned in and flying a P51 Mustang. That young lady is a competent and skilled pilot. I would be very pleased to see her at the controls of any airliner I was a passenger in.
The FARs spell out currency requirements for pilots who want to carry passengers (three takeoffs and three landings within the preceding 90 days), carry passengers at night (three takeoffs and three landings to a full stop during the period beginning one hour after sunset and ending one hour before sunrise within the preceding 90 days). These currency requirements may be accomplished in a Level D simulator.
There are additional rules for when pilots act as pilot in command under IFR or in weather conditions less than the minimums prescribed for VFR. To be able to file IFR a pilot must have performed and logged at least six instrument approaches, holding procedures, and intercepting and tracking courses through the use of navigation systems within the preceding six calendar months. These additional requirements may be accomplished in a Level D simulator, and would normally be accomplished during their 6 month simulator requirement listed below.
Every 12 months, airline pilots must complete the following:
-Pass a medical assessment ensuring they are fit to fly (reduces to every 6 months above a certain age).
-Complete a ‘Line Check’. This is a bit like a driving test, but in the aircraft. An examiner observes you operating the aircraft to ensure you are compliant with company rules and regulations and are doing the job to a proficient standard.
-Every 6 months, pilots must go into the simulator where they practice emergency procedures whilst being assessed by an examiner over a couple of days. I believe the FAA should review this requirement and add simulator training.
-Complete technical testing to ensure they maintain a high level of technical proficiency on their aircraft type.
-Complete Crew Resource Management (CRM) Training. This is where pilots are taught about how human factors can affect flight safety.
-Aviation Security Training
-Winter Operations Course
-Dangerous Goods Examination
If the pilot fails any element of these, he or she is removed from flight duties and could ultimately loose their job.
But I expect that of a pilot (simulator time)...
Only gonna happen if FAA requires it.
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