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To: Cronos
The Nazis were of course socialists first in the authoritarian (as if there's any other) sense. Their view of history was flawed like everything else, preferring to rewrite history rather than acknowledge it. As I understand, the Celts and Saxons came first, overwhelming the indigenous Europeans due to their advancements in iron working, agriculture, as well as physical size. Sort of like what happened in America but much earlier, since Europe wasn't separated by a couple thousand miles of ocean.

Much later came the Huns, Goths, Lombards, Vandals, Slavs, all wanting to get away from wherever they were, to somewhere better. Sort of like what's happening now in America. Not overwhelming them with technology, but with numbers.
41 posted on 04/12/2018 3:41:11 AM PDT by Telepathic Intruder
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To: Telepathic Intruder
As I understand, the Celts and Saxons came first....Much later came the Huns, Goths, Lombards, Vandals, Slavs

That's incorrect

  1. Saxons (or rather the group before Saxons), Vandals, lombards and Goths were all Germanic people. They separated from each other only around 100 AD -- even as late as 500 AD their languages were mutually intelligible and they were essentially different clans or groupings of tribes/clans in the same nation

  2. Saxons appear only around 300 AD. Prior to this, you can find out about the different germanic tribes in the various tribal groups like the Allemannia, Suebian etc. groups -- the Saxons were a group of different Germanic tribes that used the Saxe (scyth like weapon)

  3. Huns were not Indo-European by language or by "race" - they were Xiongnu (at least when they started moving out of Mongolia around the time of Christ

Into Europe you have three main "migrations" of homo homo sapiens:

  1. "Ancient Europeans" or hunter-gatherers that were widely distributed but had largest numbers (in the thousands) in Spain and to some extent Greece (Pelasgians) - Italy was not heavily populated until after 1100 due to volcanic activity)
  2. Middle Eastern farmers who came around 3000 BC with the domestication of wheat/barley and sheep/pigs/goats
  3. Indo-europeans starting around 2000 BC

The different Indo-European people who migrated spoke proto-IE and were the same ethnicity/race/nation.

proto-Celts developed in the Panonian valley at the same time as Proto-Germans developed in the Denmark-Scandia region, proto-Balto-Slavs in the Pripet marshes, Illyrians in the Albanian mountains into north-eastern Italy, proto-Greeks in the Greek valleys and also Indo-Iranians in what is now Central Asia. This was about 2000

Around 2000 BC you have a group of Indian Indo-Europeans go through the southern coastline of Iran into Sumeria, setting up the short-lived Gutian empire before they move to the north-west and set up the Mittani and hittite confederations (both of these worship Vedic gods like Varuna,indra, Agnis)

At 900 BC you have

  1. Greeks (Ionians) in Greece and Western Anatolia
  2. remnants of the Hittites: Phyrgians, Lydians (like Croesus) etc. in what is now Turkey
  3. Illyrians in Yugoslavia-Albania-ne italy
  4. Italic tribes in Italy
  5. Celts in southern Germany and north-eastern france
  6. Germanics (ancestors of Saxons, Suebians, Nordics, Danes, Vikings, Vandals, Goths, Lombards, Burgundians) in Scandia
  7. Baltics in the foggy lands of the Baltics
  8. Slavs in the Pripet marshes
  9. Tocharians in Xingjian/East turkestan/uighuristan Tarim basin
  10. Iranians (ancestors of Medes, Persians etc.) in north-east Iran
  11. indic groups in northern India

all of these people even as late as 900 BC have langauges that are somewhat mutually intelligible (as you can see comparing Sanskrit, Avestani, Old Greek, Old Armenian, SAmnite) and have similar Vedic gods (two "families" of Gods, a god fo Thunder indra/Inder/perun/Thor and Dyaus Pitar (Sky father) / Jupiter / Zeus etc. They have similar culture

But things change by 300 BC - by this time the Greeks have merged with Iranians with Anatolians, with Illyrians and the Celts invaded Italy, spain (forming Celtiberians) and Anatolia. The language branches were solidifed by 500 BC but now get merged

The Germanics only start ("start") to differentiate around the time of Christ and this isn't solidified until 500 AD due to Christianization

Ditto for the Slavs who only really separated around 800 AD into southern Slavs and western-eastern Slavs, thanks to the Magyar creating a separating "band" between them. The East Slavs as we see haven't separated well now. And they themselves separated from teh West Slavs only around the 11th century

As to the "Age of migrations" - they were majority about different Indo-European groups.

But to really see this in the wider picture:


So, it's a wild ride and the fact is that people all over eurasia mixed -- we find continuous interaction between peoples from India to Ireland and including North Africa and the horn of Africa - they exchanged genes, religions, cultures, languages etc. which is why the Ethiopians and Somalis and Arabs and Jews and Berbers all speak branches fo the same lagnauge family and have genetic markers similar to each other.

43 posted on 04/12/2018 5:45:45 AM PDT by Cronos (Obama's dislike of Assad is not based on his brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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