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To: wbarmy; dfwgator; C19fan
wbarmy: "If we had never invaded in the West, the Russians would have eventually won. "

Most unlikely.
First, Germans were consistently victorious before the U.S. invasion of North Africa forced Hitler to withdraw troops from Russia to bolster Rommel in Africa.
By 1944, fully one third of German forces were defending the western front, troops who could well have kept Hitler victorious in the East for years longer.

Second and more important, without the US/UK second front, Stalin would certainly do what he seriously considered anyway: made a separate peace with Hitler, thus locking in Hitler's gains and freeing his forces (as in the First World War) to face any threats the West might pose.

26 posted on 11/09/2017 6:12:59 AM PST by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective...)
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To: BroJoeK

Also, because the US fought the Japanese, Japan was reluctant to engage the Soviet Union and fight at two fronts. When Stalin learned that Japan was not going to wage war against it, he relocated some fresh Siberian divisions to the west, which helped defeat the Germans in the Battle for Moscow. Not to diminish the decisive role and huge sacrifices of the Russian soldiers and civilians in defeating the Nazi Germany.


31 posted on 11/09/2017 6:20:40 AM PST by Mi-kha-el ((There is no Pravda in Izvestiya and no Izvestiya in Pravda.))
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To: BroJoeK
First, Germans were consistently victorious before the U.S. invasion of North Africa forced Hitler to withdraw troops from Russia to bolster Rommel in Africa.

Victorious, but Pyrrhic victories which were draining them.

By 1944, fully one third of German forces were defending the western front, troops who could well have kept Hitler victorious in the East for years longer.

And we were still in Britain, threatening a second front, so those troops would have still been there, not used in the East.

Second and more important, without the US/UK second front, Stalin would certainly do what he seriously considered anyway: made a separate peace with Hitler, thus locking in Hitler's gains and freeing his forces (as in the First World War) to face any threats the West might pose.

Never happen. By that time the antipathy that the Russians and Germans had was at near psychopathic levels and the common soldier, and the people would have never accepted it. Plus, what the SS was doing to the "untermensch" was driving more people into Stalin's camp who had originally looked at the Germans as liberators.

Having lived in Russia, I can tell you the hatred they had for the Germans, and in many places, still do.
45 posted on 11/09/2017 11:26:49 AM PST by wbarmy (I chose to be a sheepdog once I saw what happens to the sheep.)
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