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To: BroJoeK
And there was no civil war even when the Confederacy many times provoked war by forcefully seizing Federal forts, ships, arsenal & mints.

You just gloss right over the fact that all such were in their own Territory. You also seemingly ignore the fact that they tried to talk compensation with Lincoln, but he refused to discuss the matter.

So Lincoln only did what the US Constitution requires him to do: defeated the military power attempting to destroy the United States.

There you go again with that 20% of the population "attempting to destroy" the other 80%. Do you have any idea how silly that sounds?

How about this? Do you have any grasp of a concept known as "objectivity"?

475 posted on 07/27/2015 3:31:01 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
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To: DiogenesLamp
DiogenesLamp: "You just gloss right over the fact that all such were in their own Territory."

As is Guantanamo Bay in Cuba, whose new Communist government has never recognized the US right to be there.
And yet the US continues to man, resupply and reinforce our troops there at will.
No US action in that regard is an act of war against Cuba, but any Cuban military assault on US troops in Guantanamo is an act of war against the United States.

So the analogy with Fort Sumter, and all other Federal properties in Confederate states, is exact.

DiogenesLamp: "You also seemingly ignore the fact that they tried to talk compensation with Lincoln, but he refused to discuss the matter."

The US Constitution clearly gives Congress authority over Federal properties.
If Jefferson Davis was serious about any negotiations, he would have sent emissaries to Congress.
But of course, Davis was not serious.

DiogenesLamp: "There you go again with that 20% of the population "attempting to destroy" the other 80%.
Do you have any idea how silly that sounds? "

The fact that it took four long years to defeat that 20% demonstrates conclusively they were a considerable force.
Had the Confederacy gained the full support of all Border State populations, the ratio of Union/Confederate instead of being 4 to 1 would have been 2 to 1, and if the Confederacy's slaves remained loyal, then the ratio would be almost one to one.
The results would certainly be not just Confederate victory, but Confederate domination over whatever little was left of the former United States.

Of course, Lincoln recognized the strategic-existential threat, and soon found there were many more Unionists in slave states than some had realized.

625 posted on 07/30/2015 12:59:41 PM PDT by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective...)
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