British troops retiring their Hi-Powers, getting Glocks

guns.com ^ | 1/09/13 | Max Slowik

[Berlin_Freeper]

British troops serving in Afghanistan will soon be issued a new sidearm, the Glock 17. The Glocks will replace the L9A1s—Browning Hi-Powers with an ambidextrous safety—in service that have been standard-issue for about 50 years.

The decision follows more than two years of evaluating the Glock for service, and calls for 25,000 Glock 17s to fill the £8.5 ($13.6) million contract. Some troops have been issued SIG P226 pistols to replace their aging Hi-Powers as a stop-gap measure, but it’s the Austrian pistol that has won the hearts and minds at the British Ministry of Defense.

[762X51]

A servicable, somewhat non-durable plastic pistol for non-shooters.

Try this with your Model T HiPower and let us know how it works out. http://www.theprepared.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=90

[spetznaz]

That was my point - that the Glock was a great choice by the Brits.

[AzSteven]

I sure hope we see them on the surplus market!

Based on the ones I saw in the field about 10 years ago, I would probably pass. They are in very rough shape, and some units have been cannibalizing older pistols to make decently working ones. They really did need to get new sidearms - the Hi Power is great but some of the ones I saw had first been issued in the late 1940s and looked like they had been beaten badly since then.

[Chainmail]

Agree with many of your points but you are missing one important element: the combat environment. We never fight wars in vacation paradises (Grenada being the exception) and it's either wet and hot or dusty and hot, or North Korea cold. The Glock is a civilian pistol, made for light duty or desk drawers. The Browning, like its grandfather, the 1911 is made for the severest environments and the toughest duty. I had a radio operator in Vietnam who never cleaned his .45 and told everybody that he'd never fire a round during his whole tour just to prove a point. Ir was covered in scale rust and nasty looking but when a VC came running out of a house straight at our company commander, our radio operater drew and shot his .45 and nailed the bastard. It worked fine, despite all of his abuse.

It is true that you use a pistol in the same circumstances that you'd use a knife but there is no excuse for carrying flimsy item just because it isn't used often or it's cheaper to buy.

As a Vietnam Vet, I'm sick of risking our lives on "least bidder" weapons. If the Brits have to go back to the Falklands, they'd better keep a few Brownings available, just in case.

[Eye of Unk]

They should have went .45acp.

Sure a 9mm works, the .45 works better.

[Chainmail]

A very impressive test. I believe that my Browning HPs would most likely survive that test but mine are too dang valuable to risk. Nonetheless, the Inglis HiPowers that were carried in Malaysia, Korea, the Suez, Iraq and Afghanistan did fine, didn't they?

Agree wholeheartedly with your caliber tag: if you can't nail it with a 7.62 NATO, you shouldn't be in this man's gun club.

[Ruy Dias de Bivar]

Dear British Government...Please send your old Browning Hi-Power to ME!

I promise (wink wink) to sell them as scrap to those interested.

PS Please include the 12 round magazines with them.

[ansel12]

I’ve had my Glock for 26 years, and my understanding has always been that it is tougher and more durable than the other pistols, not the weaker, drawer-gun that you guys are trying to claim.

Most writing that I saw when the US went to 9mm, was that the rules that kept out Glock, kept out the best, toughest, pistol.

[ansel12]

The US Marines went the right way.

I'm pretty sure the Marines still use the 9mm, a lot of people got confused because their Special Ops troops adopted the 45.

[bmwcyle]

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/07/28/marines-pay-22m-to-go-back-to-their-old-guns-colt-45-caliber-pistols/

[ansel12]

August 24, 2012: The U.S. Marine Corps has ordered 12,000 .45 (11.4mm) caliber pistols (for $1,900 each), mainly for use by its SOCOM (Special Operations Command) and recon troops. These MARSOC (Marine Special Operations Command) troops have, like the army, navy, and air force components of SOCOM, quietly replaced most of their 9mm pistols with .45s. For the last few years the marines have been supplying their special operations troops with older M1911 model .45s, refurbished (or built from scrounged up parts) in a marine-run facility.
http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htweap/articles/20120824.aspx

[houeto]

Try this with your Model T HiPower and let us know how it works out.

Good grief! Thanks for the link. Incredible. That could possibly be the most abused pistol on the planet. (that still fires)

[houeto]

Try this with your Model T HiPower and let us know how it works out.

Good grief! Thanks for the link. Incredible. That could possibly be the most abused pistol on the planet. (that still fires)

[houeto]

http://www.theprepared.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=90

[marktwain]

I have read tests of Glock 17s going 200,000 rounds without replacement of major parts. I do not believe it can be done with a P35. I believe the frame will give out long before that. If I am wrong, please tell me of a comparable test with a P35.

The P35 highpower is a wonderful pistol. I would have no problem owning/using one for defensive purposes. But to all practical purposes, a Glock 17 is an updated P35 design using modern materials.

[Dutch Boy]

Had I not lost mine in a tragic boating accident, that’s the one I would continue to carry. That is, had it not been for the boating accident.

[Chainmail]

That endurance test for the Glock is very impressive and it somewhat modifies my opinion about that brand - however the 1911 .45 has undergone even worse testing for a longer period and it too came out beautifully functional. It's not a reach to suggest the Browning P35 is capable of the same or better.

Nonetheless, I won't ever be a Glock fan: ugly, wide, square slide, lots of stamped cheapo parts, and no idea how long the polymer frame will age before embrittling/cracking. Plastic isn't really forever.

[Chainmail]

During the 1978 Joint Service Small Arms Program discussions about replacing the .45, it was really obvious that the Army had "cooked the books" to favor the Beretta 92 and its 9mm caliber. There were lots of theories why but my favorite was because "women had trouble handling the .45". (I never found that to be the case).

During the choreographed presentations at Aberdeen Proving Ground, the Army Colonel in charge asked if anyone had questions. I raised my hand and asked "if this the same 9mm caliber the Germans lost the last two wars with?" and was told to shut up and sit down.

[Eye of Unk]

I bet the SAS will acquire some Glock 18s as well, and having a 33rnd mag for the 17 in some situations is an advantage.

[ansel12]

I remember that era, but as far as the Germans, I wouldn’t complain about their pistols, and they out killed us and the Brits and everyone else they fought, but luckily it was them versus the world, and we overwhelmed them.