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Libertarians = Small gov. democrats? Or what? (vanity)
www.lp.org | Oct. 4th, 2010 | Celtic Cross

Posted on 10/03/2010 5:59:15 PM PDT by Celtic Cross

Recently, I was considering becoming a member of the Libertarian Party. I admit I knew little about the party, except that they are for smaller government. I visited their website, and this is what I found...

This, regarding immigration.

The party's views of gay unions and abortion are as follows;

"Sexual orientation, preference, gender, or gender identity should have no impact on the government's treatment of individuals, such as in current marriage, child custody, adoption, immigration or military service laws. Government does not have the authority to define, license or restrict personal relationships. Consenting adults should be free to choose their own sexual practices and personal relationships."

"Recognizing that abortion is a sensitive issue and that people can hold good-faith views on all sides, we believe that government should be kept out of the matter, leaving the question to each person for their conscientious consideration."

I know that there are many libertarians here on FR, and I would appreciate it if they weighed in. How can you affiliate yourselves with a party that at least appears to disagree with many basic conservative principles?


TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: conservative; homosexualagenda; liberal; libertarian; liebertarians; moralabsolutes; politics
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To: Sakity Yaks
and against your own (that personal preferences are to be imposed by force).

Quote where I stated that.

341 posted on 10/07/2010 2:41:04 PM PDT by DJ MacWoW (If Bam is the answer, the question was stupid.)
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To: Sakity Yaks

You’re a retread, aren’t ya.


342 posted on 10/07/2010 2:42:08 PM PDT by DJ MacWoW (If Bam is the answer, the question was stupid.)
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To: DJ MacWoW

Noob or retread.


343 posted on 10/07/2010 2:58:28 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point.)
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To: little jeremiah
Sakity Yaks
Since Oct 4, 2010
344 posted on 10/07/2010 3:02:04 PM PDT by DJ MacWoW (If Bam is the answer, the question was stupid.)
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To: little jeremiah; Sakity Yaks

Sakity Yaks is a retread. Read the posting history.


345 posted on 10/07/2010 3:04:16 PM PDT by DJ MacWoW (If Bam is the answer, the question was stupid.)
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To: DJ MacWoW

I wonder what his screen name was when he was banned last time. Trolley? or was it “trollie”?

He is also a “faither”.


346 posted on 10/07/2010 3:09:22 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point.)
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To: little jeremiah

It was trolley.


347 posted on 10/07/2010 3:16:28 PM PDT by DJ MacWoW (If Bam is the answer, the question was stupid.)
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To: Dead Corpse
In fact, over turning Roe V Wade to get the Federal government out of the issue, and incidentally keeping States from banning the procedure, is a long standing goal.

That is a pure, pro-abortion agenda, no restraints whatsoever. Unlimited, unrestrained, Abortion for all.

348 posted on 10/07/2010 3:27:00 PM PDT by ansel12
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To: ansel12

Well... Wrong. But you know that.


349 posted on 10/07/2010 3:32:36 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Alarm and Muster)
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To: DJ MacWoW

All these people do is lie.


350 posted on 10/07/2010 3:56:43 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point.)
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To: Dead Corpse

Would you care to to tell us how the most pro abortion platform in politics, is not pro abortion?


351 posted on 10/07/2010 4:10:41 PM PDT by ansel12
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To: ansel12

Liar again. The Dems have pretty much everyone beat on that score.


352 posted on 10/07/2010 5:34:06 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Alarm and Muster)
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To: Dead Corpse

Why must every post of yours include a childish lashing out with a personal attack, you seem in a constant rage.

Why do you ignore the most elemental facts, and just pretend that they don’t exist, for instance an actual party platform statement that is posted, yet you continue on as though you are interested in these subjects, which you clearly are not?


353 posted on 10/07/2010 5:50:24 PM PDT by ansel12
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To: ansel12

Um... Because you are a liar. No rage. Just observant.


354 posted on 10/07/2010 6:19:47 PM PDT by Dead Corpse (III, Alarm and Muster)
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To: Dead Corpse
No rage. Just observant.

Quit messing with the system. You're supposed to get mad and say something intemperate so you get banned.

355 posted on 10/07/2010 8:19:45 PM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: Dead Corpse

I guess that you are doing the best you can, with what you have to work with.


356 posted on 10/07/2010 8:24:28 PM PDT by ansel12
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To: tacticalogic
You're supposed to get mad and say something intemperate so you get banned.

Actually, it's not necessary for him to do anything -- if the tag team doesn't have any actual material, they'll just make stuff up (e.g. Messages 342-347, above).

357 posted on 10/07/2010 8:45:54 PM PDT by Sakity Yaks
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To: little jeremiah

“The Constitutional solution is to wipe away much of the legislation including Federal agencies etc that have accumulated for about 3 generaions and get back to Constiutionally mandated powers.

But this is not the Libertarian philosophy at all.”

Agreed on all points, but especially these too. I’m not a libertarian, which is how the discussion with Ansel started, since I (being a strict constructionist/Constitutionalist), said that I was not libertarian, but he insisted that because I belive in the fundamentals of the constitution, that I’m not conservative, but a liberal. But I agree whole heartedly about the root of the problem, being: “the FedGov is now more or less a totalitarian entity forcing lefitst crap down everyone’s throat.”

A conservative government doesn’t force anything down anyone’s throat, but I think so many people are fed up with the leftist crap, that they just want the pendulum to swing the other way so badly, they forget it can swing to far. That’s why I want it (The FedGov, at the very least) to remain (as much as possible) confined to the constitution, and not swinging much either way. In my heart, I have to believe that if the people are a moral people, extra laws are not needed, they’ll do good on their own. And if the people are bad, no number of laws will change that (as in gun control, only inhibits the “good guys” the “bad guys” disregard them anyway). I think my prayers could use some redoubling in the mean time, I feel as far gone as we are (as a society), it can get a whole lot worse, and I hate the teetering feeling I keep feeling, like the judgement is hanging over our country’s head and could come down on us at any minute.

Thanks for the discussion, and I apologize for the crass, sarcastic response someone gave your well thought and heartfelt post.


358 posted on 10/07/2010 8:53:00 PM PDT by JDW11235 (I think I got it now!)
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To: JDW11235

The thing is, civilization needs laws. No laws mean anarchy, Lord of the Flies. The Fed Gov’s powers are quite limited according to the Constitution. Most laws that affect peoples’ lives are supposed to be up to the individual States - closer to home, with more accountability to the people who are directly affected, and with more say-so by the people.

It is not like that now nor has it been for a few generations. Hopefully it will happen as the disgustingly bloated and corrupt Fedgov runs out of money and is increasingly seen as the enemy of the people that is has become.

Your statements that laws can’t make bad people good, so we don’t need laws, is not logical. Laws are needed not to make bad people good, but to stop bad people from harming everyone else. If they decide to become good, fine and dandy. If not, at least they’re punished enough so maybe they decide out of pure self-interest not to be bad anymore. (As an aside, I am opposed to all this prison time, and am sure that public canings and many more executions will quickly change the social atmosphere to one where far fewer people choose a life of crime. Much cheaper, more effective, and more humane.)

Certainly if most people are living saints, few to no laws are needed. But that is not the case.

Each State should be free from FedGov interference to make the laws its citizens and representatives see fit to enact. If someone doesn’t like their State’s laws, they can try to change them, or move to another State they like better.


359 posted on 10/07/2010 9:08:29 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point.)
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To: JDW11235
but he insisted that because I belive in the fundamentals of the constitution, that I’m not conservative, but a liberal.

Fascinating, will you show me that quote?

Especially the part where I insist that believing in the fundamentals of the constitution makes you a liberal.

360 posted on 10/07/2010 11:42:04 PM PDT by ansel12
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