Missing girl found after almost 7 years

CNN ^ | 7/15/10 | Staff

[MissTed]

A California girl who had been missing for almost seven years was found Wednesday by police in Phoenix, Arizona, authorities said.

The girl had just turned a year old when she was abducted in September 2003.

She had been in the care of foster parents in Norwalk, California, when she was snatched by three of her aunts, a spokesman for the Los Angeles County sheriff's Norwalk Station said.

[MissTed]

Poor girl must be scared to death. :(

[Eagles6]

Dang! It's a scary world out there

In Pittsburgh a 14 yr old girl that ran away a week or 2 ago was found stabbed to death, wrapped in garbage bags and found by a dumpster at a local high school.

[knittnmom]

Definitely. She needs our prayers.

[nmh]

Why couldn’t the three AUNTS legally adopt the little girl?

[fr_freak]

Sounds like yet another story of a child snatched by the government, and her own family had to “kidnap” her to get her away from the government-assigned foster parents. Who is the real villain here?

[CharlesWayneCT]

Not really, or at least it didn’t turn out that way.

Sure, three aunts took the girl. But two of them were arrested immediately.

And according to the article: “The girl somehow ended up with a family in Phoenix that had no relation to her biological family, authorities said.”

So the other Aunt wasn’t trying to raise the girl. You have to wonder how she ended up with this new family, who apparently KNEW about the subterfuge because they were hiding the girl, who wasn’t allowed to go to school.

So you have to speculate that the aunt sold the child to this couple.

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[fr_freak]

So you have to speculate that the aunt sold the child to this couple.

Well, if we are going to invent scenarios out of whole cloth, then mine goes this way:

The aunts rescued the girl from the government appointed foster parents because they were worried about how she would be treated and raised. It was immediately known that the aunts grabbed the girl, and two of the aunts were consequently found and arrested for taking the girl, while the third aunt managed to get away. Once she escaped the government agents, the aunt placed the girl with a family she knew well who would care for the child in a manner she could trust. Let's say that the aunts and the family they placed the girl with were all evangelical Christians in the same denomination, who don't believe in public schools or many of the other anti-Christian elements of modern society. The last aunt knew that she couldn't raise the girl herself, because she was wanted by the law, so she hid the girl with a family she knew while she checked on her from afar.

Sound like a better story? The only thing we know for sure is that the government grabbed a child for an unknown reason and placed her with a family not related to her and unknown to her, while attempting to keep the girl's actual blood relatives from caring for her. We can speculate on all kinds of wild scenarios all day.

[CharlesWayneCT]

Here’s a little more information from various sources:

“Amber was about 13 months old when she was abducted from a Chuck-E-Cheese Restaurant while in the custody of her foster parents in 2003 in Norwalk, California. Three of Amber’s aunts took her. Two of her aunts were caught at the time, but the third was able to get away with little Amber. The three aunts were juveniles at the time of the kidnapping which took place during a non-custodial visitation.”

“The FBI and the LA County Sheriff’s Department went with the Phoenix police to the home. What they found was little Amber in the shower under a pile of clothes, where an unidentified female had hidden her.

Her identify had been changed including her name and date of birth. She appeared to be in good condition. Authorities learned she has not been enrolled in school. A positive match was made from a footprint and DNA.”

“Amber had been in her grandparents’ care after her own mother had given her up, but then removed from the grandparents’ home and put in foster care. “

“Detectives began following several leads that led them to the Phoenix home where a sign outside advertises tarot card and psychic readings as well as a ‘healer.’”

“Phoenix police say the girl abducted by three aunts from her foster parents nearly seven years ago has never been in school and can’t read. The girl spoke English and some Romanian.”

I’m not a fan of CPS.

With what I’ve found, I doubt there was money involved. But I’m also quite certain this wasn’t an evangelical christian family trying to save the child from foster care. Looks more like some ethnic thing to me.

A 7-year-old should have been taught how to read, whether you believe in public school or not. It seems much more likely the child was held out of school for fear of being caught. Although you’d think a pyschic wouldn’t have to worry about getting caught, since they would know ahead of time and all. Could have been one of those Psychic Evangelical Christians though.

[fr_freak]

With what I’ve found, I doubt there was money involved. But I’m also quite certain this wasn’t an evangelical christian family trying to save the child from foster care. Looks more like some ethnic thing to me.

They sound like gypsies or something. However, I see nothing in your new information that justifies the government coming in at all. Certainly, a 7 year old not being able to read is not justification for taking a child, regardless of how we all hate illiteracy (and by the way, putting the kid in public school is no guarantee that she'll learn to read either). It still sounds like the family decided to retrieve the girl from strangers, and are only outlaws because of that act. The ironic thing is that if the government weren't hellbent on snatching this kid from the family, they wouldn't have been afraid to put in her in public school.

[CharlesWayneCT]

I can find nothing from 2003 which would explain why the 1-year-old was taken from the mother’s mother (the child’s grandmother), and put in foster care.

However, the story does suggest there was arrangements made, because the three aunts (sisters of the mother) had a formal visitation arrangement, and they took the kid to Chuck E Cheese, at which point they took off with the 1-year-old without permission.

Obviously they have justification for getting the now 7-year-old from a person of unknown origin, unrelated to the child, and with no legal right to the child. The fact that the child was being hidden in a bathroom, and that the child not only wasn’t allowed to attend school, but wasn’t taught to read by the age of 7, only reinforces the action.

Even if the 7-year-old was being perfectly cared for and trained, the person in possession of the child had no legal right to the child, and was no relation to the child.

I assume though that you are arguing that since we do not know why the child was originally taken from the grandmother and put in foster care with visitation rights for the biological family, we can’t justify getting the child back from this unknown psychic healer who has illegal custody of the child and has been abusing her by keeping her from learning the basic necessities of life in the United States (reading).

[fr_freak]

I assume though that you are arguing that since we do not know why the child was originally taken from the grandmother and put in foster care with visitation rights for the biological family, we can’t justify getting the child back from this unknown psychic healer who has illegal custody of the child and has been abusing her by keeping her from learning the basic necessities of life in the United States (reading).

I'm arguing that having the child hiding with a psychic was probably an act of desperation in order to keep the government from stealing the child again. Likewise the lack of schooling. Likewise the kid hiding in the bathroom while government agents raided the house, most likely very armed (remember Elian Gonzalez?). The government most likely created this entire situation, and are blaming the acts of desperation in response to their actions on the victims.

Also, a 7 year old who hasn't been taught to read is hardly evidence of "abuse" by itself. A 7 year old would be in 1st grade. If the government could classify that as abuse and justify snatching your kids, then they can call anything abuse. You really want to go down that road? Since when did conservatives trust the good judgment of the government so much that they are willing to allow them the power to snatch kids from their homes on a whim?

[CharlesWayneCT]

A 7-year-old should be in 2nd grade. 5 year olds are in kindergarten, and a well-trained child will be reading by age 3.

[fr_freak]

A 7-year-old should be in 2nd grade. 5 year olds are in kindergarten, and a well-trained child will be reading by age 3.

A well-trained child reading by age 3? That would, indeed, be a well-trained child, but certainly not even close to the norm. Most kids can't actually read until 1st grade, at which point they would be 6 - 7 years old in most cases.

However, this is all irrelevant to the question as to whether lack of reading skill in a 7 year old is grounds for the government to kidnap a child. I would think most sane people would say no.

[CharlesWayneCT]

The question isn’t whether a child not reading is grounds for taking a child.

THe grounds for taking the child is clear. The child is being kept by a unrelated, unknown party who had no legal basis for holding the child. The adult in possession of the child was a kidnapper.

My discussion of the child’s abuse was merely to note that the child was NOT being cared for in an appropriate manner, so there was no valid argument to be made that the child was actually better off with this adult who had kidnapped the child.

It is probable that the adult knew the child was kidnapped because the adult kept the child out of school and hid the child when authorities came. So I don’t think you can argue that the adult had no idea there was a problem and thought they had legally obtained the child.

It’s not even the case that the mother attempted to legally transfer custody of the child to this unrelated woman. The mother gave up the child to the grandmother, the state (for reasons unknown) too custody of the child from the grandmother, and the sisters of the mother ran off with the child during a scheduled visitation.

My original argument was that it didn’t seem a typical case of CPS abuse (realising we don’t know the original reason for the child being removed from the grandmother’s care). You argued that it was equally likely (in the sense that mine was conjecture) that the family were evangelicals who were taking great care of the child against the wishes of an evil government CPS.

The further facts I have found I believe clearly show that my scenario is still more likely than your scenario, and that whatever reason they had for taking the child, the child has suffered because of it.

Girls tend to start reading earlier than boys. You are right, it isn’t “normal” for a child to read at age 3, but girls whose parents work specifically on reading skills can often be reading before they turn 4. I know my son took a lot longer to read, but by 5 he was able to read the words in age-appropriate books.

The question is what do they mean when they say she can’t read. Often, that means they don’t recognize words at all. If that is the case, most children by 3 are recognizing individual words, and by 7, teaching basic reading is a remedial step.

I was fortunate that my daughter started reading at a very young age, AND she loved it, so she has been reading all her life.

My son was average, and also didn’t like reading for a long time, so it was always work to get him to finish his reading assignments. But eventually, he became an avid reader himself, and now at 14 is always carrying at least one book with him.

It’s nice having kids who put books on their birthday lists. But I don’t think it was my special parenting skills, I think it’s just normal if you teach kids to read that they will be fascinated with the world of imagination it opens up.

So I guess when I read that a parent has cut their child off from that world, I see it as abusive. A child who is behind in reading will be disadvantaged in everything they try to do in life.

[CharlesWayneCT]

BTW, and again the real story is what happened back in 2003 when the child was taken away, but the kid wasn’t up for adoption, she was in foster care.

If the family was really interested in the best welfare of the child, and this family that had the child was really a good family for the child to be placed with, they should have pursued a legal adoption.

Then the adults wouldn’t have been guilty of kidnapping, the juveniles wouldn’t have had to break the law, and the child could have lived a normal life, not one where they were hidden and kept from school and kept ignorant.

And the child wouldn’t now be taken from another parent-figure that she has had for 6 years. I know that is a tragedy, but that’s what happens when you kidnap a child, the child suffers. We don’t award the kidnapper because we feel sorry for the child.

[fr_freak]

THe grounds for taking the child is clear. The child is being kept by a unrelated, unknown party who had no legal basis for holding the child. The adult in possession of the child was a kidnapper.

It is quite clear from the article that the authorities were searching for the child to seize her again from the moment the aunts took her back. In other words, it was not because this unrelated family had the girl that the authorities seized her; the authorities were intent on seizing her again regardless of whose custody the girl was in. The situation seems to be that the aunt placed the girl with the unrelated family in an attempt to hide the girl and keep her from being kidnapped by the authorities again. The girl could have been living with 10 of her relatives and she still would have been sought by the government the moment she was retrieved from foster care.