Posted on 05/10/2010 2:21:26 PM PDT by LowOiL
Today I was fired because "I wasn't a team player" and "didn't fit in". I worked for an eccentric "Christian" man in his 70's, I myself am Christian also. I will call the owner "Old Mac" for simplicity.
The place I worked as an mechanic was in a fabric mill (no more detail is needed, you know how hard the textile industry has been hit lately). The majority of the mill is illegals and some legals (from Mexico and Guatemala), with about a 30% other population of mostly white fixers and managers.
I worked a second shift and had only met "old Mac" casually before. Stories of his strange behavior ran deep but I never believed them before. Stories of how "old Mac" once saw a fellow on the loading docks lounging around and didn't like it, so he walked up to him and asked him how much he made and was answered XXX per week. Mac calculated the amount in his head, paid the fellow cash and said he was fired. The fellow took the money and left and Mac later found out he didn't even work there, he was just a delivery man.
Anyhoo... my story is one night "old Mac" came in at lunch time (we work 8 and 1/2 hours a day, 30 minutes are suppose to be lunch time and he does not pay us for it). I used to go to my truck and eat lunch in the cab in the parking lot. I would "allow" the "illegals" to go outside too since it was their lunch time too. I didn't see there was any problem, since he wasn't paying them. Old Mac came in and was furious, he did not want "little Mexico" outside his doors and that they were in the mill and he could be fined XXX amount of dollars. They were not in the mill, but they could be he reasoned. I was flabbergassed, I couldn't believe he was doing this. He often ran the air system so the illegals could run their machines during their "lunchtime" but any work they did was not time and a half pay like the law requires. Also us fixers (me and another fellow) were expected to repair the machines during our "lunchtime" and not being paid for it.
I asked "old Mac" if he owned us during the time that he was not paying us, he slowly looked at me and said I was "not being a team player" and that "it set a bad example for the Mexicans" at lunchtime and that they were NOT allowed to go outside whatsoever.
I told "Old Mac" that it was not right to keep me his "slave" during the time he was not paying me. He grumbled off and today I was told I was fired. I was handed my paycheck for the last week and told to leave. I argued that he was not "Christian" what he was doing and that I would bring up the subject to his church on Sunday.
I went to get my supplies and tools and booklets and say bye to everyone and as I left the back door I smelled tire smoke. A police officer had just tore into the parking lot and was waiting close to where I was parked. I guess "old Mac" had called the police on me. I never said a curse word, I never even called him anything more than "Sir". I was Christian about the whole affair, but I was not ran over by him like he wanted me to be.
My question fellow Christian Freepers is this... What is the precedence (protocol) for presenting my case to his church. I do not belong to his church (Baptist) but I am a fellow Baptist of a neighboring church. I have read before somewhere that I am allowed to address their church elders and then I am allowed to address the church next if that fails. I have talked to their pastor (nice fellow) and he said actually I had no Biblical right to talk to their church in that manner since I was not a member.
I seek godly knowledge from fellow freepers.
Please.
I don’t know about Godly advice but if he fired you for what you say and if he has illegals working there, then go get a lawyer. I don’t believe in law suits most of the time but, if you are telling the truth, this sounds like a good case to me. Turning him in to his church will not get you your job back, going to court might or it might get you a few bucks to live on while you hunt for another one.
I’d file for unemployment anyways and state the reason for termination was fired for insufficient work. I’d not hang my hat on a reference from ass hat as it stands. I’d make no bones about the threat pertaining to denial of benefits also. Moreover, even quitting outright isn’t absolutely grounds for denial for benefits.
He’s got to document somehow that your son quit, i.e., witnesses, failure to appear, etc. Furthermore, willful misconcuct likewise has to be documented. The unemployment commission will be able to ascertain his SUI payments. If they suddenly and drastically dissappear, quitting due to not having anything to do is a lame defense.
The employer has to respond to a claim for unememployment credits against the employer by the unemployment board within a certain time (or the default judgement goes against them). If they protest the claim for credits, they have to provide proof. They must submit such proof within a certain period of the judgement goes against them. Once the employer has submitted the documentation an evaluation is made by the unemployment board concerning reason for termination: quit, willful misconduct, unwilling to work, etc. and a denial may or may not be issued.
If the judgement is against the employer, they can contest it but must respond within a certain time (or the judgement goes against them). When a final determination is made, both parties are notified and either can appeal.
If the employer appeals, no benefits are issued until after the appeal. The onus is upon the employer to make their case. If the employee is denied they can appeal. In either case a formal hearing is held and one or the other party must make their case.
If the denial is over-turned, or the employers objection is over-ruled, all benefits held in abeyance are immediately forthcoming in lump sum.
In the meantime a job prospecting employee should stipulate that employer can be contacted to verify employment history but that they’re hostile due to ongoing proceedings. Even if the employee finds another job before resolution of the matter, benefits are still outstanding and will be awarded upon final adjudication.
Quite frankly IF the unememployment benefits ARE denied, I’d lodge a complaint with OSHA and the EPA and Labor Relations board. And IF a bad reference is rendered, I’d file a libel, slander, defamation of character lawsuit.
When and if our OP gets any judicial relief, it’ll be a long time coming. Only the lawyers will ‘win’...lose or win the case. Trust lawyers, or God?
Still on thread mulling my options.
Best Christian option: Trust God; pray. A lot.
Anger, pride, and righteous indignation are snares.
“Love your enemies”
If Mac takes a nickle, offer a dime.
Walk in the Word. Trust God.
Be calm, and listen and watch.
This passage refers explicitely to literally a sin (ingressive aorist subjunctive of hamartanô) being committed by one brother in Christ against another. Moreover, it pertains to discipline within the local expression of the church of which both are members.
First off what specific sin was committed against you? You mention that the issue fundamentally was one of you allowing the illegals out of the building. However, you mention you’re merely a mechanic. From this I’d infer you have no managerial responsibility in that regard. So how can he rightfully fire you? I’d like to see him contest that.
Concerning the matter as it stands, I’d approach him privately and express your disdain for how he treated you (being a faithful servant). I’d also express your disdain concerning he breaking the law. If he fails to repent, return with elders from your church and confront him again.
If he still fails to repent (or listen), then his elders at his church should be confronted by your elders and you. If his elders rebukes all of you (or fails to here you), then your church’s leadership should put his church’s leadership on notice that their congregation will be excommunicated from fellowship and considered persona non-gratia. Only then should all legal remedies be pusued with all vigor of effort and without predjudice.
Excommunication means not only prohibition from partaking in the Lord’s Supper, but personal association of any kind. That means members of your congregation should sever all contact with members of the other congregation (including business association and contracts).
Since it just happened today and it’s still a shock. Don’t regret anything just don’t allow bitterness to enter in. I’ve been there and it’s not easy at first. But it’s the only way.
Get a good night’s rest knowing you are in His Hands. Deliberately smile, deliberately don’t feel sad.
Heb 11:1 (KJV) Now faith is the substance of things HOPED for, the evidence of things NOT seen.
You can’t see a new job, you can’t see what tomorrow will bring but KNOW your faith will bring what you hope to pass. We have the faith, since God gives it to us. But our unbelief stops our faith. Sorta of like - I know God can do it, but will He do it for me. Don’t go there because it’s a lie. Jesus also said, ‘Be not afraid, only believe’.
We can’t see our sins erased/forgiven but we know it by faith because Jesus said it. That’s the same faith you will live by now. HE, also said, “Fear not” and it’s in the bible 365 times! One for every day. How cool.
Jesus also said (John 14:13) And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father.
Just believe and smile.
Anger? One is allowed to be angry, you just don’t let the sun go down on it.
Pride? I don’t see where poster demonstrated pride. He was fired - seems like Mac was the prideful one - he fired him because he could and didn’t want to hear how he was robbing his employee. That’s guilt along w/his pride.
Righteous indignation? He wants to do things the RIGHT WAY and address the issue biblically. That’s not righteous indignation.
You seem to be assigning things that do not apply here. IMO, he is handling it the right way, seeking guidance, weighing his options, praying. I see NO PRIDE or RIGHTEOUS indignation.
Rock on!
Those attributes were not aimed at the OP. But, rather the bent of some of the other advisers.
I don't understand what you read in my posts that caused you to glean from them what you did. I was attempting to convey just about exactly what you said in your post previous.
Walk in the Word. Trust God
I do believe you need to heed your own advice. Walk in The Word and Trusting God doesn’t mean you allow yourself to be robbed and bow to evil by those that are committing crimes, as you suggest.
You need to be calm and not live in fear of a welfare line - those that walk in faith know God’s Goodness.
whatever
Now, you can disagree and obviously it is within your right to do that, but raising a stink among folks of who's concern it is not, WILL NOT BENEFIT YOU. Indeed, it amounts to burning bridges and it would almost certainly guarantee you reduced future opportunities.
If "old Mac" has illegals on the payroll you should report him. Anonymously.
Then drop it.
File for unemployment if you need to. If you think that you were unfairly handled with regard to wages or hours worked, file a complaint with the Department of Labor.
If you feel that you were discriminated against, file a complaint with the EEOC.
If your former employer was using undocumented workers, then he can and should be reported.
There must be a new opportunity for you ahead, God always has an opening when other doors in your life have closed.
That is an exciting place to be if you can hang onto your faith that He is taking care of you.
Those who tout their Christianity in business and then act in a rather un-Christian manner always remind me of what Christ thought about the moneychangers in the temple.
There is always an accounting in the end.
book mark
Thanks for the input, I'm older and wiser but this never gets easier. Worse if it's your kid.
Now you must call INS and turn him and his company in....let the government take this old man down. Isn't it illegal to knowing employ illegals....he's the one who is in big trouble. Without all those illegals working for him...he'll be looking to hire Americans...if he's not in jail.
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