Handgun opinions (vanity)

4/26/2010 | SnakeDoctor

[SnakeDoctor]

Although I own a couple of guns, they are mostly heirlooms or antiques, and don't get much use. I am in the market for a good all-purpose defensive handgun -- for home defense, target practice, concealed carry, and general training. I don't have a CHL at this point, but want to begin training to get one. I have had several models recommended to me -- HK USP Compact (45 or 9mm), Kimber 1911, Walther P99, Sig Sauer P229, Glock 19.

I went out shopping a bit this weekend at a local dealer. I was inclined to go with the Barrett 50 cal, but it isn't quite concealable enough (haha). Based on recommendations and reviews, I am leaning toward the HK USP at this point (though I am undecided on whether to go for the 9mm or the 45). From what I have heard, the HK USP is pretty-well the top-of-the-line for defensive handguns. The dealer also pointed me toward some new HK models that are supposedly upgrades on the USP -- the HK45 (the 45 version) and HK P30 (the 9mm version).

So, for FR gun enthusiasts -- what are your recommendations? Is the USP the appropriate choice for a general all-purpose handgun? Is it an appropriate weapon for beginning a training program? Would the Sig, Glock, Kimber, Walther or another model be a better choice? Would you recommend going with a 9mm or 45? And, for those that have tested both the USP and the HK45 or HK P30 ... are the upgrades on the newer models worth the additional $200-$300 price tag?

Thanks.

SnakeDoc

[SJSAMPLE]

I, too, carry a P32 when I can’t carry my Glock 19.
Now they make the .380 model in almost the exact same size, so I’m a little jealous. I never liked feeding rimmed cartridges from a magazine, and the P32 mag lets the cartridge rim override other cartridge rims.

[Sax]

It’s like a tool box, different tools for different jobs.

But you’re right, you can make a large caliber handgun do all of them, just not ideally. So that’s a solid place to start a tool collection.

I can’t see choosing a .380 for a home defense weapon, and you’re surely not going to conceal a shotgun.

[SJSAMPLE]

I’m not agreeing with it, but I understand it.

I didn’t mind the little S&W and Taurus key lock thing. I even had one on my Springfield 1911, but never used it.

As long as I can be sure the key safety won’t engage accidentally, I don’t care. I unlock it and throw the key away.

[Red in Blue PA]

The following was not written by me, but I keep it as reference, as it is so well written about what one should worry about:

I’ve read through the thread here, and I have seen some things with which I agree, and some I don’t. The one sure thing that has been written here is that no plan survives first contact. It will always be different than you envisioned it to be.

To those who have written that it is not worth shooting someone over $25.00, I ask you this. At what level of money in your pocket is it worth shooting somebody? $100? $500? Do you carry more than $500 in your pocket? Next question for you. How do you know that the bad guy is going to stop bothering you once you give him money? Perhaps you just emboldened him to take more of whatever you have. Maybe he thinks you didn’t really give him all your money. Maybe he wants your watch and your jewelery too. Maybe he will want you to perform an unnatural sex act on him. I’m sure that will draw some snickers, especially coming from me, but I remember years ago when I read in the paper about a guy being carjacked and forced to go down on his carjacker. How far are you going to go so as not to have to shoot him?

Here is my point of view. It is not about how much money I have. It is about someone invading my space and trying to take what I have by force or threat of force. I give a lot of money, time, and other possessions to people freely, but I will not let someone take it. It is that simple. And I am not talking about some drunken stumblebum begging a few bucks so he can buy his next bottle of Thunderbird. Those requests usually come in the form of asking for money to buy food. I have bought food for people like that in the past. But that takes being able to read a person, and even then there is the chance that someone may be playing you for a fool to get close to you. You always need to keep your guard up and be ready for anything.

But the guy who comes to take what I have by force or intimidation? No. He isn’t getting anything but the bum’s rush, and if he gets nasty, he is going to be met with violent hostility. I will be in fear for my life, you can be guaranteed of that. There was a comment made about the worth of a human life, or something to that effect in the early part of this thread. If someone is going to have so little regard for his own life that he will attack strangers (and this is an attack), then why am I responsible to see that he is not hurt? The answer is, I am not. He is engaging in a risky business, and so he is the one who bears both the risk and the responsibility for the consequences to his person.

And pulling your gun does not mean you have to shoot someone with it. I know. I have been there. Twice. It is an amazing thing to look at someone whose attitude has just been radically adjusted with the knowledge that you now have a gun in your hand and appear to be ready to use it. If that doesn’t scare them into retreating, then you are genuinely in danger of your life, since they obviously have no regard for their own.

In the end, it is all about me. I very rarely say that, but if I am in a confrontation with someone who is intent of relieving me of my worldly possessions, I have a judgement to make. I am a steward of the things God has given me. I have the responsibility to determine how best to use those things. Giving them to someone truly in need is one thing, but again, someone who tries to take them by force is going to go home very unhappy, if indeed he ever makes it home again. Rich has pointed out, and rightly so, that there may be an accomplice. Situational awareness is very important, and you need to be paying attention to what is going on around you. I also happen to think that open carry is a huge deterrent to these kinds of things. People who pull this stuff aren’t looking for a fight, they are looking for an easy score. My gun visibly displayed on my hip tells the world that I am armed, and that I probably know how to use that arm, and that I am not afraid to use it. Really, who wants to mess with someone like that? I know I don’t.

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention escalation. I will escalate someone right off the planet if that is what it takes to go home alive and safe. I am not going to be standing there worrying about what some DA or some judge is going to say about what I did. I am going to be concentrating on surviving. All the rest of that stuff can be sorted out later. It really wears me out to see people worrying about escalation. You only need to worry about escalating a situation if you started it, at least in my not so humble opinion. If and when someone confronts me, I am going to respond in such a way as to demonstrate that I am capable of escalating things to the point of his demise in order to protect myself and my family. But the big key here is not to get into situations where it might look like you started something. And the easiest way to do that is, don’t start stuff!

http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-carry-145/42115-when-draw-page-3.html

[LiveFree99]

There’s the Harold Fish case in Arizona. An idiot juror was horrified by his choice of a “powerful” handgun and influenced her to find him guilty.

[SnakeDoctor]

>> Ask yourself *honestly* how large a gun you are *really* going to carry every day, through all your normal activities.

True enough. I'm not a jogger, and don't really wear shorts ... so I only have to conceal in jeans or pants. I usually wear a dress shirt, t-shirt, or long-sleeve thermal shirt, so I have enough clothes to conceal pretty well. I think I could carry a full-size weapon most of the time ... though a smaller Walther P22 or something may be worth having for summer days.

>> But no way it is going jogging with me, or even being carried around in my handbag every time I go shopping.

Can't carry a purse ... but I could always get a "Jack Sack" ... Haha.

SnakeDoc

[elhombrelibre]

Okay, and the reason you sent that to me is to ...rebut something I’ve written? I don’t see the connection.

[Disambiguator]

Applying the "desert island" criteria to the decision, I might consider the new Ruger Redhawk revolver in .45 Colt with a 4" barrel. It's a bit large for CCW, but could be used against two and four legged hostiles. It's beefy enough to handle the hot .45 loads that are available, too.

[Red in Blue PA]

The final paragraph. One should do whatever necessary to protect themselves and their family. Worrying about what a jury “might” do is not on of those things.

[Recon Dad]

It was about that time they made the switch to 1911’s. It's funny they put so much effort into the decision and I can't tell you the last time I saw a picture of my son in combat where he actually has a pistol on him.

[elhombrelibre]

I didn’t suggest that he worry. I’m going to drop this discussion with you. I’m afraid you’re someone who cannot get along well with a person even when that agrees with you if you perceive a slightly different take on things. Have a good day.

[Red in Blue PA]

I get along with everyone!

[absolootezer0]

colt? nah. i got a sig :)

[Filo]

The HKs are nice, but I’m still a Sig fan. There is also a great case to be made for a 1911 which would probably be my next gun since I’ve already got a pair of Sigs.

The .45 is probably your best choice for a defensive caliber but make sure you train and practice. It doesn’t matter how big the holes would be if you miss. . .

[teenyelliott]

hand gun ping

[painter]

She has a good point.I have a 1911a that I use to open carry when my wife has to deliver a dental appliance to an office in a halfway risky neighbor hood at night.

If I were to get my conceal permit and carry all the time I would get a 38 hammerless revolver with the best hollowpoints I could buy. The reason hammerless,It won't catch in my pocket if I have to "pull"it.

[Dan Nunn]

I totally agree. If you feel comfortable carrying a 6 pound stainless steel gun, by all means, but most people grow tired of that - and end up not carrying it when they actually need it.

[Recon Dad]

They all get very good with them, but from what I have observed they use them sparingly. I believe the theory that if you have to use a pistol your enemy is too close applies.

[Armedanddangerous]

My go to guns are a Glock 19, Glock 26 and a Walther P-99..all in 9mm.

My J frame 38 special model 642 is in my pocket most of the time too

[DarthVader]

Hey SnakeDoc,

Check out this neat little package from Sig Sauer which I am considering. It is a great value and can meet a shooter’s needs across a wide spectrum.

http://www.sigsauer.com/Products/ShowCatalogProductDetails.aspx?categoryid=54&productid=281