Replies

I haven’t complained to the mods, so I’m not sure what you mean in that regard, nor am I attacking you personally. I simply asked you for a CFR (Call for reference) on your assertion that the BYU event was a deliberatly orchestrated anti-EV forum. Do you have an agenda for the event, list of speakers and topics? Transcripts? It’s because I want to check the facts that I asked for the reference to back up your claims. I have students who attend BYU I guess they must have forgot to tell me about all the anti-EV, pro Democrat activites at BYU. There has never been such a deliberatly orchestrated event and I am certain there never will be. It is contrary to the gospel as we believe it to attack any church in that manner.

As for voting - you should know as a former mormon that church leaders never tell anyone how to vote for a political candidate. Never. In my 30 years of church experience it has always been very clear that the church goes to great lengths to avoid the impression of endorsing any political candidate.

I think the truth you speak is very relative to you and that you are infering a great deal more than is really there.

Peace.

I have provided enough sourced references for you to investigate for yourself.

If you like I would be more then willing to provide sourced qoutes going all the way back to Joseph Smith regarding the church's stance on evangelicals, which are right in line with Reid's comments.

You know as well as I do that Mormon Bishops were ordered by Salt Lake to organize ward members from thier homes to support Prop 8 in California and other earlier measures there and in other states.

Ezra Taft Benson's "An Enemy Hath Done This" was taught in Preisthood during his tenure.

This whole situation is very much like the Catholic church's inaction with Kerry and the Kennedys. Inaction which led to a steady leftward drift of the voting block.

The leadership of the LDS is drifting to the left with it's embrace of Reid and shunning of Beck and I worry about the political ramifications.

I have students who attend BYU I guess they must have forgot to tell me about all the anti-EV, pro Democrat activites at BYU.

Then they may have encountered THIS fellow:

Professor Robert Millet teaching at the Mission Prep Club in 2004 http://newsnet.byu.edu/video/18773/ <-- Complete and uneditted

Timeline... Subject...

0:59 "Anti-Mormons..."

1:16 "ATTACK the faith you have..."

2:02 "We really aren't obligated to answer everyone's questions..."

3:57 "You already know MORE about God and Christ and the plan of salvation than any who would ATTACK you."

It’s because I want to check the facts that I asked for the reference to back up your claims.

We agree on this!!

I've been trying for YEARS to get some FACTS from MORMONs about a claim that Joseph Smith made very early in his religious carreer; Namely...

What did he 'learn' to be UNTRUE about PRESBYTERIANism.

http://scriptures.lds.org/en/js_h/1/17#17

17 It no sooner appeared than I found myself delivered from the enemy which held me bound. When the light rested upon me I saw two Personages, whose brightness and glory defy all description, standing above me in the air. One of them spake unto me, calling me by name and said, pointing to the other—This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him!
18 My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)—and which I should join.
19 I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: “they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.”
20 He again forbade me to join with any of them; and many other things did he say unto me, which I cannot write at this time. When I came to myself again, I found myself lying on my back, looking up into heaven. When the light had departed, I had no strength; but soon recovering in some degree, I went home. And as I leaned up to the fireplace, mother inquired what the matter was. I replied, “Never mind, all is well—I am well enough off.” I then said to my mother,
“I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true.”