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A Cool Pilot, but the Plane Was Cooler (Sully wasn't a hero, the Airbus was)
New York Times ^ | November 10, 2009 | DWIGHT GARNER

Posted on 11/24/2009 4:03:38 AM PST by tlb

“Fly by Wire” isn’t muckraking, exactly. Mr. Langewiesche doesn’t dispute the events of Jan. 15, 2009, when US Airways Flight 1549 successfully ditched on the Hudson River. Nor does he dispute that the flight’s pilot, Chesley B. Sullenberger III, a k a Sully, is,...a “superb pilot.”

But Mr. Langewiesche does bang a few light dents into Sully’s hero aura. What the public doesn’t understand, he writes in “Fly by Wire,” is the extent to which advances in aviation and digital technology have made pilots almost superfluous, perhaps even “the weak link in flight.” Mr. Sullenberger’s airplane, an Airbus A320, was nearly capable of guiding itself gently to the ground, even after losing both of its engines.

No knock against Sully, he suggests, but almost any decent pilot could have done it.

Mr. Langewiesche, the author of “American Ground” (2002) and “The Outlaw Sea” (2004) and a pilot himself, seems annoyed that Mr. Sullenberger has yet to praise publicly his Airbus plane and its sophisticated design. He seems annoyed, too, that Mr. Sullenberger has spoken of the problems of automation failure since his flight, while his own plane’s automation “had emphatically not failed.”

“He was no Charles Lindbergh, seeking to make history, no Chuck Yeager breaking the speed of sound,” Mr. Langewiesche writes. But he crashed during a slump in the American mood, and overnight he was transformed into a national hero, at a time when people were hungry for one.”

This book’s true hero — this will be an additional insult to some of Sully’s admirers — is a Frenchman, a former test and fighter pilot named Bernard Ziegler

In the 1970s and ’80s, working for Airbus, Mr. Ziegler and his colleagues perfected a revolutionary system known as “fly-by-wire control,”... to make almost perfect flying machines.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Books/Literature
KEYWORDS: airbus; hudson; langewiesche; sully
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To: panthermom

My first guess is a structural failure, though apparently the plane was operating at a corner of its operating envelope (a normal situation not considering weather turbulence).


41 posted on 11/24/2009 7:19:12 AM PST by Paladin2
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To: The Duke
No autopilot could have landed that plane on that river and saved all souls aboard.

Well, in theory one could be made to do that. At least the stick and rudder part, maybe. Might have to add some upgraded sensors though. But the machine could not do the rapidly deciding where to crash part. Only a human could pick a landing site in a split second and be right. I mean... a device could be designed to do that. But who would test it? And if it plowed an airbus into a ferryboat who are they going to blame? It would take decades to write that decision making code and it would still be garbage. Simply put, real artificial intelligence is a myth.
42 posted on 11/24/2009 7:19:20 AM PST by TalonDJ
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To: tlb

A typical NYTimes article about people who are already forgotten, critical of someone who will be remembered.


43 posted on 11/24/2009 7:20:01 AM PST by Moonman62 (The issue of whether cheap labor makes America great should have been settled by the Civil War.)
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To: Sacajaweau

I’m a pilot and I would not have wanted to have had to make a landing like that.
He is the consumate Professional.


44 posted on 11/24/2009 7:28:19 AM PST by Joe Boucher (This marxist punk has got to go.)
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To: tlb

http://www.johnspeedie.com/healy/believe.wav


45 posted on 11/24/2009 7:45:17 AM PST by BenLurkin
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To: tlb

Load of BS. Left to the Autopilot, that plane would have made a ‘landing’ in the middle of the Bronx.


46 posted on 11/24/2009 7:54:40 AM PST by Ditto (Directions for Clean Government: If they are in, vote them out. Rinse and repeat.)
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To: muddler

That was my thought; sounds like sour grapes. He wishes he were the pilot.


47 posted on 11/24/2009 8:16:25 AM PST by Skenderbej (People need to learn that no muhammadan practices his religion peacefully.)
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To: Hulka

http://www.springer.com/engineering/robotics/book/978-3-642-03990-4


48 posted on 11/24/2009 9:11:40 AM PST by Paladin2
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To: Hulka

49 posted on 11/24/2009 9:16:09 AM PST by Paladin2
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To: tlb
commercial planes will be flown remotely in the future)...

...and in the case of an emergency, a pre-recorded message comes over the plane's intercom: "Is there anyone on board that knows how to fly an airplane?" LOL!

50 posted on 11/24/2009 9:21:57 AM PST by Hot Tabasco
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To: tlb

Sure, that’s right. Successful widebody ditchings in water happen all the time, because the planes are so superbly manufactured.

Oh, wait. No, they don’t...


51 posted on 11/24/2009 9:26:17 AM PST by Interesting Times (For the truth about "swift boating" see ToSetTheRecordStraight.com)
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To: TalonDJ
Hey, this ol' STS engineer knows what the technology is capable of. I've implemented plenty of smart avionics and guidance systems.

And sure, a "land on the Hudson" control system might possibly be developed in theory, but it wouldn't be practical to attempt it. Hence, I'm certain that it wasn't done. :)

52 posted on 11/24/2009 4:07:00 PM PST by The Duke (Socialism is cool until somebody loses their paycheck.)
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To: The Duke
“They had no choice,” Mr. Langewiesche writes. “Like it or not, Ziegler reached out across the years and cradled them all the way to the water.”

A few lines ahead you can read

In the 1970s and ’80s, working for Airbus, Mr. Ziegler and his colleagues perfected a revolutionary system known as “fly-by-wire control,” ...

The airplanes that resulted — including the Airbus A320 — are not only easy to fly and filled with redundancies that make mechanical backup systems unnecessary, but they will also not let pilots make certain mistakes. The airplane “will intervene to keep people alive,” Mr. Langewiesche writes.

So the aircraft's fly-by-wire control would have intervened just in case Sullenberger may have stalled the aircraft or reached some other limitations. So I can only imagine the aircraft made the decision to lower the nose automaticly due to insufficient thrust in case Sullenberger’s stomach realized the situation a second to late.

The decision where to land and how was Captain Sullenberger’s decision. Therefore he is a hero. No technique applied by Monsieur Ziegler intervened in that moment.

53 posted on 11/25/2009 3:34:44 AM PST by MHalblaub ("Easy my friends, when it comes to the point it is only a drawing made by a non believing Dane...")
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To: Moonman62

Individual heroism is a danger to the left.

If individuals perform heroic deeds, then people may realize we are all individuals capable of self sufficiency.

Self sufficiency is a danger to the control of the state.


54 posted on 11/25/2009 7:51:41 AM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: The Duke

At the very least you would have to stick some weapons grade ground search radar or ir camera to search for clear landing sites. I would not want to be on the team programing the algorithm that determines which one to use though. The first time one lands on some soccer fields and smashes a hundred 4th graders I might be out of a job. Besides, avionics engineers should not do everything. got to make the pilots feel important, don’t ya know.


55 posted on 11/25/2009 8:06:30 AM PST by TalonDJ
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To: tlb

Sully: The Right Stuff


56 posted on 11/25/2009 8:43:15 AM PST by Edgewood Pilot
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To: Paladin2

I am well aware of DARPA and their annual unmanned ground vehicle competition and research efforts.

Fact is, things are a LONG way off from being fielded. Simply too rudimentary and unreliable to get near, or even on the same planet as, the industry standard for safe operation of unmanned vehicles in a mixed, manned and unmanned environment (10 x -9th power). Very few of the entrants finish the course, let alone do so without complications and failures along the way.

Thanks.


57 posted on 11/25/2009 3:20:59 PM PST by Hulka
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To: dools007
This is pure CYA by the European Airbus cheerleaders to cover up Airbus flaws.

Why does it always have to be either/or? Sullenberger is a superb pilot, but the A320 is a great aircraft, too. Sullenberger made expert use of a great tool, any attempt to praise one side of the equation while dissing the other is BS.
58 posted on 12/07/2009 7:44:17 PM PST by wolf78 (Inflation is a form of taxation, too. Cranky Libertarian - equal opportunity offender.)
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To: Erik Latranyi
(we already know planes can be flown remotely and commercial planes will be flown remotely in the future).

Wait - the pilot is going to remotely fly passengers? We're all up in the air, and he's all safe back on the ground, and hey if something goes wrong, he gets to walk away?

That's a commercial airliner I won't be flying on.

59 posted on 12/07/2009 8:12:20 PM PST by AFreeBird (Going Rogue in 2012)
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To: tlb

I’d want Sully to be my pilot!I’m not terrified of flying but it does make me a bit ill at ease.


60 posted on 02/22/2010 3:14:34 PM PST by POWERSBOOTHEFAN (Blessed Be The Name Of The Lord,For His Name Alone Is Exaulted)
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