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Questions about fighting a traffic ticket (vanity)
self | Not published | self

Posted on 09/14/2009 6:57:41 PM PDT by WayneM

Arrived home from the DC march on Sunday night. Slapped my new FUBO bumper sticker on my car this morning and left for work. Ended up with a state trooper following me for the last 3 miles before exiting the interstate. He pulled me over when exiting.

He told me that he had been following me for several miles, and that 3 or 4 miles back I had failed to signal a lane change. He ended up giving me a ticket for failing to signal a lane change.

Did I fail to signal? Maybe, maybe not. I usually signal but not religously, and honestly cannot state one way or the other.

I suspect the bumper sticker may have played a role, since, statistically speaking, there is a 95% probability he was an Obama voter. I cannot prove this so it really doesn't matter.

Nevertheless I now have been written a ticket and don't want to plead guilty. I have been violation-free since a speeding ticket in 1979, and accident free since 1986 (not my fault), and have no desire for my insurance to become even more expensive for the next several years.

Here is the text of the state code under which I was cited:

Section 32-5A-133 — Turning movements and required signals.

(a) No person shall turn a vehicle or move right or left upon a roadway unless and until such movement can be made with reasonable safety nor without giving an appropriate signal in the manner hereinafter provided.

(b) A signal of intention to turn right or left when required shall be given continuously during not less than the last 100 feet traveled by the vehicle before turning.

(c) No person shall stop or suddenly decrease the speed of a vehicle without first giving an appropriate signal in the manner provided herein to the driver of any vehicle immediately to the rear when there is opportunity to give such signal.

(d) The signals provided for in Section 32-5A-134(b) shall not be flashed on one side only on a disabled vehicle, flashed as a courtesy or "do pass" signal to operators of other vehicles approaching from the rear, nor be flashed on one side only of a parked vehicle except as may be necessary for compliance with this section.

Upon examining the wording of the traffic code three points struck me:

1) the code in section a defines two separate circumstances under which the driver must signal... a) when turning the vehicle, and b) when moving left or right. I did not make a turn so I therefore must have been moving left or right.

2) Section b tells what the driver must do prior to turning (i.e. the driver must signal when turning). However, it does not state what must be done when the action is moving left or right. It only specifies turning.

3) Sections c and d are not at all applicable in my circumstances.

So it appears to me that the law, as worded, does not require me to signal a lane change.

If I am turning, then I must both wait until the maneuver can be done safely AND signal prior to turning. If I am moving left or right (i.e. changing lanes) my only requirement is to wait until it can be done safely, since there is no manner hereinafter provided. The "manner provided" applies to turning but not to moving left or right.

I know free legal advice is worth what you pay. Also - I'm an engineer, not a lawyer, and lawyers seem to think differently than us engineers. So my thinking may not be aligned with the way a judge would think.

Are my analysis and reasoning correct? If it is, why has nobody looked at it this way in the 29 years since the law was passed in 1980? This alone makes me question my own logic, sice I can't believe someone else didn't catch it before me and force a rewrite of the law.

Any good suggestions on how to avoid the points on my license and insurance premium increase?


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1 posted on 09/14/2009 6:57:41 PM PDT by WayneM
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To: WayneM

Demand a jury trial.


2 posted on 09/14/2009 7:00:46 PM PDT by SandWMan ( A riot ist an ugly sing, und, I sink it's about time zat ve had vone!)
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To: WayneM

I’m not a lawyer either but I love carefully constructed words and phrases and it seems to me you have a case.


3 posted on 09/14/2009 7:01:14 PM PDT by Crazieman (Feb 7, 2008 http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1966675/posts?page=28#28)
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To: WayneM

4 posted on 09/14/2009 7:03:23 PM PDT by JoeProBono (A closed mouth gathers no feet)
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To: WayneM

I don’t buy most of you analysis. BUT, the best way to beat a ticket is to show up in court and contest it. More than likely the officer won’t be present. If no officer is present, ask for dismissal for lack of a complaining witness. The prosecutor will ask for a continuance. Object.


5 posted on 09/14/2009 7:04:25 PM PDT by Drango (A liberal's compassion is limited only by the size of someone else's wallet.)
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To: WayneM

If you’re seeking free advice, mine would be that you seek it from an attorney. An attorney could give you an idea of how a judge may feel about the situation.


6 posted on 09/14/2009 7:04:36 PM PDT by cripplecreek (Seniors, the new shovel ready project under socialized medicine.)
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To: WayneM
It is certainly true that some police officers will target vehicles that sport political bumper stickers that are contrary to their own beliefs.

My last two speeding tickets were back in the 1990s when I had an anti-Clinton bumper sticker on my car. I don't think that was a coincidence. I also had my car keyed once or twice during that time (I do live in Massachusetts).

These days, I don't bother with bumper stickers.

7 posted on 09/14/2009 7:05:30 PM PDT by SamAdams76 (I am 5 days away from outliving Judy Garland)
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To: WayneM
. . . an appropriate signal in the manner hereinafter provided . . .

In your State, a turn signal must be used during change of lanes. How much do you have to pay?

8 posted on 09/14/2009 7:06:20 PM PDT by Fester Chugabrew
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To: WayneM

Honestly? If you want to make a point, you can fight and toss $$ away.

I got a ticket the weekend before this. Total BS, was cited going 50 in a 35. Thing is I was before the 35 mph sign.

Can I prove it? No.

This was my first ticket in over 25 years. I called to see what I had to pay. I was asked where I was and what dept (state or sheriff) gave me the ticket. I told the person my side, I have to pay $50. Seems some of law enforcement knows that state troopers are in for a cash grab.

I plan on paying it tomorrow, for $50. why end up paying many times over that to fight it?

Makes me mad, yes. Very much. If I had the extra $ to fight, yes, but I do not.

To fight


9 posted on 09/14/2009 7:07:18 PM PDT by Shyla
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To: WayneM

If you show up at court and the cop does not, you win.

Be prepared to make your case.


10 posted on 09/14/2009 7:07:47 PM PDT by Jet Jaguar (A mob of one.)
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To: WayneM
Sounds like technically, you are guilty, but the three or four mile delay in pulling you over is suspect. I can assume the trooper was running your plates.

From your post, I also assume the trooper was black. I hope that has nothing to do with this stop.

11 posted on 09/14/2009 7:07:59 PM PDT by buccaneer81 (ECOMCON)
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To: WayneM

I can’t speak to that particular state’s state troopers, but in TN, they are notoriously political and are practically the gestapo arm of the Governor/TN Democrat party (and a lot of corruption scandals have arisen, covered up by the media). If MD or VA are anywhere similar, you’re the victim of political profiling. That sounds like a potential civil rights/free speech violation.


12 posted on 09/14/2009 7:08:03 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (~"This is what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps !"~~)
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To: WayneM

Plead not guilty.
Go to the courthouse, and look at the schedule.
Look at who is doing most of the representations in contested traffic cases.
Go to that attorney, and sign up with him.
That was my strategy, and it worked well with me. They didn’t charge a whole lot, and they know the players better than anyone.


13 posted on 09/14/2009 7:08:32 PM PDT by Dr. Sivana (There is no salvation in politics.)
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To: WayneM
Some random ides:

Tell the court that the officer's failure to pull you over at the time you failed to signal is tacit approval of changing lanes without signaling. The police should not selectively enforce laws, that could be construed as profiling, maybe even racially motivated.

The officer should have acted when (he) first witnessed you allegedly breaking the law. If un-signaled lane changes are in fact against the law, presumably it is because they are unsafe. The officer's failure to act immediately in that case could be taken as allowing you to continue to endanger the public. Either the officer is derelict in his duties or un-signaled lane changes are not in fact illegal and dangerous.

His failure to act in a timely manner could lead you to believe it wasn't until he approached close enough to discern your race that he decided to pull you over. Throw racism back in their faces.

14 posted on 09/14/2009 7:08:35 PM PDT by ThunderSleeps (obama out now! I'll keep my money, my guns, and my freedom - you can keep the change.)
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To: WayneM

If you have had no violations since 1979, you should be allowed to plead “no contest”, which requires you to pay the fine but assesses no points against you.

Always plead “not guilty’ at the initial appearance as this allows you consider your options and opens the door to potential negotiations with the prosecutor. Never plead guilty. Also, if you hire an attorney, it is very likely that he can get the charge dismissed, and if not, surely a deal can be reached with regard to points.


15 posted on 09/14/2009 7:08:50 PM PDT by chris37
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To: WayneM

16 posted on 09/14/2009 7:09:03 PM PDT by krb (Obama is a miserable failure.)
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To: WayneM

Kinda like driving an ox-cart in 1937 USSR with a “Stalin Sucks!” bumper sticker. Good luck.


17 posted on 09/14/2009 7:10:54 PM PDT by tired1 (When the Devil eats you there's only one way out.)
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To: WayneM

Why did it take 3 to 4 miles for the officer to pull you over? This raises doubt that the violation actually occurred or that the officer pulled over the correct vehicle if traffic was heavy. What is the normal protocol for traffic lane violations? Can you request a video and audio record of your stop?


18 posted on 09/14/2009 7:12:06 PM PDT by Kirkwood
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To: WayneM

You know, I’ve never seen a state trooper actually follow me...but then, I’ve never seen one drive less than 80mph. I’m too slow for them to follow. They regularly blast by me like I’m sittin’ still.


19 posted on 09/14/2009 7:14:08 PM PDT by SandWMan ( A riot ist an ugly sing, und, I sink it's about time zat ve had vone!)
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To: WayneM

http://www.expertlaw.com/library/traffic_tickets/fighting_tickets.html

Will The Officer Appear In Court?

Much advice on the Internet focuses on how to minimize the chance that the officer who issued your ticket will appear in court on the day of your hearing. The reason for this is simple: If you are charged with a civil infraction and the officer does not appear, in most jurisdictions the ticket will be dismissed. In fact, most victories in traffic court result from the failure of the officer to appear. However, you should still be prepared for the probability that the officer will appear in court, and should either be prepared to work out a plea deal or to defend your case if the officer appears. (Please note that some jurisdictions will adjourn a case when a prosecutor fails to appear, or schedule an initial pretrial where the officer is not required to appear before scheduling a second formal hearing to resolve your challenge to the ticket.)

To reduce the chance that the officer will appear, you can attempt to obtain an adjournment (or “continuance”) of your first scheduled court hearing. The possibility increases that the officer will have other duties on the date of the adjourned hearing, and will not be able to appear in court. An adjournment can be requested by contacting the clerk of the court. ...


20 posted on 09/14/2009 7:15:42 PM PDT by Drango (A liberal's compassion is limited only by the size of someone else's wallet.)
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