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To: BroJoeK; central_va
“you need to be sure you know their sources, and contexts.”

Like this?

Abraham Lincoln “was a racist who opposed equal rights for black people, who loved minstrel shows, who used the N-word, who wanted to deport all blacks,” a veteran journalist and historian says.

“There has been a systematic attempt to keep the American public from knowing the real Lincoln and the depth of his commitment to white supremacy,” says Lerone Bennett Jr., whose new book, “Forced Into Glory: Abraham Lincoln's White Dream,” examines Lincoln's record.

Lincoln envisioned and advocated an all-white West, declaring at Alton, Ill., in 1858, that he was “in favor of our new territories being in such a condition that white men may find a home ... as an outlet for free white people everywhere, the world over.”

Lincoln supported his home state's law, passed in 1853, forbidding blacks to move to Illinois. The Illinois state constitution, adopted in 1848, called for laws to “effectually prohibit free persons of color from immigrating to and settling in this state.”

Lincoln blamed blacks for the Civil War, telling them, “But for your race among us there could not be a war, although many men engaged on either side do not care for you one way or another.”

Lincoln claimed that “the people of Mexico are most decidedly a race of mongrels. I understand that there is not more than one person there out of eight who is pure white.”

“That's the simple truth of the matter”

Really? Y'all forgot to mention that the Union cause was overflowing with known Marxist!

“blacks were by then already voting citizens.”

The North has nothing to do with the Negroes. I have no more concern for them than I have for the Hottentots. . . . They are not of our race. (In Klingaman, Abraham Lincoln and the Road to Emancipation, p. 295)

“Free people of color” were welcome in few places. In the North they were almost universally segregated, excluded from public life, and their children barred from white public schools. In those areas where separate Negro schools were provided they were inadequately financed and instruction was poor. . . .

The situation of the black American when the war ended was ambiguous. . . . Northerners as a whole, willing to concede freedom, were hostile to equality. Many of them dreaded an incursion of black folk after the war—especially among lower paid workers who feared Negro competition and some not so poorly paid who resented possible Negro entry into their crafts. The use of Negroes as strikebreakers during the war and their employment in areas where whites were out of work resulted in agitation and riots and intensified anti-Negro feeling.

Such sentiment, however, was by no means confined to workingmen. Between 1865 and 1867 voters in Connecticut , Wisconsin , and Ohio rejected proposals for Negro suffrage [the right to vote]; in 1868 only 8 out of 16 Northern states permitted Negroes to vote. Oregon even continued its pre-war prohibition against the entry of free Negroes. . . . (The Negro in Reconstruction, New Jersey: Prentice-Hall, Inc., 1969, pp. 6, 12-13)

There can be no doubt that many blacks were sorely mistreated in the North and West. Observers like Fanny Kemble and Frederick L. Olmsted mentioned incidents in their writings. Kemble said of Northern blacks, “They are not slaves indeed, but they are pariahs, debarred from every fellowship save with their own despised race. . . . All hands are extended to thrust them out, all fingers point at their dusky skin, all tongues . . . have learned to turn the very name of their race into an insult and a reproach.” Olmsted seems to have believed the Louisiana black who told him that they could associate with whites more freely in the South than in the North and that he preferred to live in the South because he was less likely to be insulted there. (From Slavery to Freedom: A History of African Americans, New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 2000, p. 185)

“You need to get over it.”

Speak the truth first!

Regards

1,497 posted on 07/15/2009 6:52:08 PM PDT by Idabilly
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To: Idabilly
your post 1497: "Speak the truth first!"

I've spoken nothing but the truth (as best I know it), but you sound like a pretty serious nut-case to me. You may need therapy. The doctor is in. ;-)

Your argument that neither Lincoln nor Northerners in general were paragons of modern racial correctness is absolutely true, but irrelevant. The issue in 1860 was not whether blacks should attend integrated schools, or even whether blacks should be freed from slavery in the South.

The issues in 1860 concerned whether slavery should be EXTENDED to non-slave territories and ENFORCED against fugitive slaves in the NORTH. These are the issues which caused the South to secede. Lincoln's racial opinions had nothing to do with it.

And the Civil War was fought by the North, first and foremost to preserve the Union, only secondarily to abolish slavery.

So all your arguments on this subject are nonsensical. What exactly is your problem?

1,511 posted on 07/18/2009 7:14:46 AM PDT by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective...)
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