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To: BroJoeK
Well, I don't buy for one second that Eden was an idealist, nor do I think that Hitler was going to back down in any case -- it's as if Pitchfork Pat never heard of Von Ribbentrop's and Molotov's negotiations and the non-aggression pact between the USSR and the Third Reich. I suppose he discusses that too. Doesn't seem to understand it though. I guess he's never heard about how Eden brought down his party's government in Britain by his "idealism" in the Suez Crisis -- but of course, Pat hates the Jews and Israel. Too bad such an intelligent guy is so [bleep]in' twisted.

But anyway...Italy wound up being enticed into the WWI alliance. The UK and France figured the A-H empire was at the breaking point (they said the same about Germany, and were dead wrong both times; by the time the US forces joined the fight in Europe, the BEF was wrecked; the larger but still mauled French army had not only learned from its mistakes, it also sent the appropriate personnel to help train the AEF, which went on to literally win the war for the Allies) so Italy was promised a generous slice of postwar Austria-Hungary if it would join the alliance and attack.

It turned out to be a stalemate for a long while (despite some claims made on behalf of Italy, the same kinds of claims made for the UK and France in that war) -- at least on enemy soil though -- then with a slight shift of resources, the Central Powers smashed Italian forces, forced a retreat and loss of some of Italy.

[the UK and France similarly enticed Romania, then screwed Romania when it turned quickly into a disaster during the German counterattack, which lasted about a month and reached the Black Sea]

The UK and France had to shift troops *into* Italy to prevent further loss of territory, then kinda shafted Italy in postwar arrangements. Given that, it's not too likely that anyone in Italy would have supported a second alliance with France and England. And Mussolini could see Hitler was serious, and wanted a piece of the pie Italy had been denied by its erstwhile allies.

The sense in which the war was unnecessary is really on the German side -- Hitler could probably have had it all, if he'd eaten up all the peripheral territories, then turned the Middle East to his own purposes, taken control of the Suez Canal, and taken over the oil supply, before he launched (or instead of launching) a two-front war against powerful European neighbors.

It was interesting to me that the German shifting of resources between fronts in WWII had been done in the same way (and for much the same reason) in WWI, and was even more successful in the earlier war.
26 posted on 10/10/2008 5:25:30 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/_______Profile hasn't been updated since Friday, May 30, 2008)
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To: SunkenCiv
"Well, I don't buy for one second that Eden was an idealist, nor do I think that Hitler was going to back down in any case..."

Just so we're clear, I don't agree with Buchanan, and am not trying to defend him -- only really trying to be fair, and not distort what he actually said.

Here we are talking about Buchanan's chapter 5: "1935: Collapse of the Stresa Front," which begins with two quotes from Mussolini:

"Austria knows that she can count on us to defend her independence as a sovereign state." (1934)

Next fall I am going to invite Hitler to...make Austria German. In 1934 I could have beaten his army...today I cannot." (1937)

In chapter 5, Buchanan explains how Mussolini went from an ally of Britain and France opposed to Hitler's Germany in 1934, to an ally of Hitler in 1937 helping with his expansionist plans.

The critical meeting happened in June 1935 (page 151), where Antony Eden met with Mussolini to work out a deal -- call it "accommodation" or "appeasement."

In the meeting, Mussolini arrogantly insulted and berated Eden. As a result, now quoting Buchanan:

"After this verbal beating, the "tender sensibilities of Eden left him with the impression that Mussolini was 'a complete gangster,' the 'Anti-Christ,' a view which never left him."

"Eden felt personally insulted and humiliated. So enduring was the bad blood between him and Mussolini that when Eden was removed as foreign secretary by Neville Chamberlain, Rome rejoiced.

"After the Eden-Mussolini confrontation, the British press, to whom Eden was the personification of the new and higher League of Nations morality in international affairs, turned on Mussolini, mocking and assaulting him as the world's worst dictator. British socialists, Liberals, and Labour Party members all joined in heaping abuse on the Italian ruler.

"Rome-London relations went rapidly downhill, and in Geneva the League, led by Britain, threatened sanctions if the invasion of Abyssinia [what the Eden-Mussolini meeting covered] went ahead.

"Isolated, Mussolini decided he had to act quickly."

Soon after, Mussolini was firmly allied with Hitler's Germany.

29 posted on 10/11/2008 6:26:09 AM PDT by BroJoeK (A little historical perspective....)
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