Posted on 12/10/2006 6:38:04 AM PST by surfer
How true !!!
This is wrong he did not tell the authorities that he had cleared the road.
Why are you posting this to me?? I refuted it!!!
Those tire tracks were also a week old and it had snowed for two more days after they were made. I'm surprised they could be seen.
The owner of Black Bar Lodge set they were recent tracks and had been covered with recent snow. He could still see the indents. Remember they were driving in heavy snow at the time and it continued to snow.
I think in that type of environment it would be very easy to see even with large amounts of snow...you will still have the original indentations that would be covered and would dip down.
These guys can spot bear tracks and foot prints from helicopters I think tire tracks would be much easier to see while on the ground.
Oh, I didn't have the impression there was snow on the ground at all when they were on that part of the road.
I thought they didn't hit snow until much higher up, so they came back down and *then* it started to snow. Then it snowed and rained for two days after they had gotten stuck from the snowstorm that hit them that first night (the first Saturday, 11/25).
From what I understand there are parts of the road that are covered in canopy type of coverage in addition given the height of the sun many parts of the road are not going to get the direct sun to melt all the snow on the road.
They also traveled a long way on Bear Lake Rd I am sure there are parts that probably still have some snow even now.
Hi Paulat,
One thing that I think needs to be cleared up here...it keeps showing up. I know you didn't say this...but the facts need to straight.
The owner of Black Bar Lodge NEVER told authorities he had cleared his road. In fact it was the opposite he told Sara R. that the road had not been fully cleared - it needed to be thoroughly checked and he DID see recent tire tracks heading that way but he couldn't go any further. For some reason they ignored his statements.
If Sara R. had listened to him they could have been all found on Saturday...this is a real shame.
This is a post from someone named Susan on another blog site. It pretty well sums up the issues on SAR side of things:
1. Wednesday: Detective Mike Weinstein of the Portland police missing persons detail was out sick. So the Portland search did not even start until the next day. How can there not be someone assigned to handle Mike Weinstein’s responsibilities when he is not there? Especially since he heads a missing persons department.
2. Thursday, a Portland hotel refuses to cooperate. And Weinstein can’t make them cooperate and protects their identity?
3. Friday: Sara Rubrecht’s deputies from Josephine county, drive past the fork where the logging road takes off to the right. The logging road that is supposed to be gated and locked and is not. The logging road that the reason it is gated and locked is because its COMMON for travelers to take that wrong turn. So did those deputies not check the gate? Did they see it was vandalized and open and not report it? Did they report it and no action was taken?
4. Friday: Sara Rubrecht is told, in person, by the owner of the Black Bar Lodge that he had seen tire tracks on that logging road and hadn’t been able to follow them in his snowmobile once he hit bare ground. She took no action?
5. Friday: John Rachor, the private pilot that finally located Kati and the girls, also thought they’d turn off on that logging road, a very common mistake, but didn’t go looking that day because authorities said they’d cleared that road.
6. Sunday: John Rachor decides to go look anyway, sees the tire marks in the snow, they had not cleared that road, but he is running low on fuel and has to go back. Did he tell any authority? Did they ignore him as well?
7. Sunday: Sheriff’s Lt. Pat Rowland said his crews asked about the back logging road, but were told — incorrectly — that the owner of the Black Bar Lodge had “cleared” it himself. Who told him that? Shouldn’t there be some way to verify what’s been cleared and what hasn’t?
I realize that many of the above “facts” can be wrong, they came from the media. But Weinstein and Rubrecht are not hard working volunteers, they are paid public professions. I think its reasonable to expect answers.
The Oregon wilderness is NOT Disneyland. You take that road in a snowstorm and you are begging for trouble. Once he was lost it was worse than a needle in a haystack. He gets all the blame for that idiocy.
Attempting to hike out when you haven't the slightest idea where you are or where your going in a blizzard was his last mistake.
Pointing the finger at anybody but him will not help anyone. It was a miricle his family survived thanks to a lucky pilot.
Pray for W and Our Troops
Pointing the finger at anybody but him will not help anyone. It was a miricle his family survived thanks to a lucky pilot.
Sorry Bray...there was no blizzard when he started his hike. The weather had warmed after the storm of the 25th/27th. there may have been sporadic snow but it was melting for the most part. The chopper pilot who found Kati and the two kids saw Jame's footprints in the snow on the road and followed them down to the family. The million dollar question is would the three have been found in time without that clue?
Don't bother TB...people like Bray are short on fact but long in bad opinions.
Attempting to hike out when you haven't the slightest idea where you are or where your going in a blizzard was his last mistake.
TB:
PLEASE ACCEPT MY APOLOGY.
I INTENDED THAT FOR BRAY.
I HIT THE REPLY IN THE WRONG BOX.
SHAME SHAME SHAME IS ME
Send me five pounds of hard Christmas Candy and I ill run your plea by the Tribunal but it may not bring total redemption...
Hold on while I consult Captain Obvious to see if he can come up with a satisfactory means of making amends.
People like that always have the answer.
Regarding bad roads: Where I used to work, I drove a mountain road to get to my assignment. That road would sometimes be impassable from either snow or falling rocks. They used to have one of those freeway-type lighted road signs with changing info. (like the signs used for missing kids) which clearly noted road conditions. They warned people of snow, rocks or the road being closed part way up due to never-ending repairs. The alternate routes were many, many miles out of the way, but we would gladly go around if we knew to expect problems.
If there are so many lost people on the road the Kims took(not an issue on my road due to no side roads to speak of),that type of sign might be best, though probably astronically expensive. With all the boondoggle grants out there and pork projects, their congresscritters could probably get some funding.
It sounds like a good idea to me.
You could put up a huge number of signs and maintain them for what one SAR costs.
If they average 80 per year in that area, they could be spending probably 1/4 that many millions a year depending on how may choppers and other sophisticated equipment is used as well as how many men.
Your right, just because I lived down there for 6 years how should I know anything about those roads? I wouldn't try to cross that road in the summer unless I had a few hours to get lost and would never try it in the winter.
But yeah you guys can blame the SAR for a few mistakes in a desparate situation. Sorry but when you go up into those mountains in the snow, unless you know what your doing you may not come back out. Heartless, yeah the wilderness is.
As for the weather, it was cold for a week when he was gone, if the snow was stopping it was still freezing at night with wind. But yeah, never blame the guy who got lost it wasn't his fault it was the gummit's.
Pray for W and Our Troops
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