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To: SirJohnBarleycorn
She says the boys are lying as to whether the AV was drunk when she arrived...It's clear the AV was able to walk into the house under her own power, and start the routine.

I'm a little hung up here on an obscure bit of testimony that I have staked a lot on. I heard on FOX or MSNBC a few days ago the neighbor making the very explicit and strong claim that he saw Mangum, as she arrived, walk up a driveway -- he emphasized that it was much more than a few steps -- and he was certain that she was not impaired. I don't recollect with certainty whether I was hearing his voice or someone reading what he had said.

I looked through the N&O archive but nothing jumped out at me.

It seems to me important if an objective witness is stating with conviction that he had a good look and Mangum looked sober as she arrived.

239 posted on 04/25/2006 2:22:21 AM PDT by LK44-40
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To: LK44-40

Detective Rod Wheeler said on Fox that his inside sources at the PD have confirmed that witnesses who were with Mangum prior to the lacrosse party have verified that she was intoxicated.


241 posted on 04/25/2006 2:35:19 AM PDT by TruthHurts001
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To: LK44-40
the neighbor making the very explicit and strong claim that he saw Mangum, as she arrived, walk up a driveway -- he emphasized that it was much more than a few steps -- and he was certain that she was not impaired.

I don't discredit what he says he saw, but short of whether she was stumbling drunk, the opinion of any observer from his vantage point isn't meaningful as to whether she was intoxicated.

Someone can be well over the limit for DUI, for example, and still walk in what appears to be a normal fashion.

Take a standard field sobriety test - a police officer typically will not ask an individual to merely walk from point A to point B, but rather will ask that the person do something less natural - such as walk heel-to-toe, or lean back with their eyes closed and touch their nose.

In fact, if you look at those pictures at 12:30 of the AV standing on the back porch, she is by no means "holding up the house." In fact, those pictures cut against the date-rape drug theory, because she is clearly able to stand up, balancing on only one heel, and at the same time fiddle with things in her purse. One would have to take the position that such a drug hit her all of a sudden, just at the next moment in time, right as she was standing on the porch or walking down the steps.

Perhaps she was mildly intoxicated when she arrived, but not stumbling drunk. Kim says she then basically chugged one and a half mixed drinks. If those are college kid drinks, that's probably half cheap rum half coke with a little bit of ice in a beer cup, or the equivalent of 5 or more regular drinks. If she hadn't eaten in a while, that alcohol could quickly hit her (combined with whatever she was drinking earlier) to where she loses her balance a time or two during her routine and loses her shoe.

Then later, when she walks back around to try to get her shoe back, she is intoxicated enough that when she tries to step off the porch on her one shoe, distracted by her bags and cellphone, and steps on that pile of rags on the second step, she ends up taking a nasty fall, hitting her head and sustaining cuts and bruises.

With a mild concussion and the effects of that alcohol kicking in, it could be an hour before she starts really coming out of it.

244 posted on 04/25/2006 4:38:24 AM PDT by SirJohnBarleycorn
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