Case Aganst Duke Student Unraveling Fast

ABC GMA | Chris Cummo

[MindBender26]

Breaking overnight from Chris Cummo at ABC GMA:

Case against at least one Duke defemdant unraveling fast.

Defendant Seiligman went to bank ATM while rape supposedly happening.

12:02 Time stamped photos show girl arriving. Girl leaves, comes back, call friends on cell phone does other things. 12:19 Seiligman calls cab dispatcher 12:24 Seiligman takes cab to bank miles away, uses ATM card (photos show it is him.) 12:42 after walking back to dorm, Seiligman uses security card to enter dorm. Does not leave.

Also, Seiligman was never interviewed by cops. DA seeking reelection simply took "Dancers" word that he raped her.

[Raycpa]

What cries out to me is that it looks like the kid might have realized this was out of line and left the group,

Or maybe he and his friend are gay and not into women. Wouldn't that put a difficult twist in an already twisted story. The MSM would have a meltdown trying to decide what side to be on.

[battlecry]

Paging Greta...

[Mad Dawg]

"Uttering" is proffering a forged instrument, like a cheque. You have two parts to forgery, doing the actual forgery and "uttering" it, namely presenting the cheque at your local... whatever.

[PBRSTREETGANG]

The question is, why did he do it?

He and a friend went to an ATM and then a fast food place. My guess is that he was bored and hungry.

[jiggyboy]

this doesn't add up for me.

Apparently you slept through civics class in high school and any mention of "reasonable doubt" in your entire adult life?

Brief description of our legal process: Prosecutor makes an accusation. Prosecutor must show that it is true. If defendant can show *ahem* "reasonable doubt" that prosecutor's theory is wrong, defendant cannot be convicted.

Defendant is NOT required to prove his innocence in a way that makes perfect sense in every respect.

[cdga5for4]

Yes, it also said he called his girlfriend twice. My guess is his girlfriend is about 1,000 times hotter than the stripper.

[Quilla]

Was he just that lucky?

I don't think so. I can track the whereabouts of my two children (18 and 20) by their cell phone bills, text messages, credit card charges, photos and commentary posted on My Space and Facebook, and countless other trails they leave. Sadly, I can't program my DVD player or add phone numbers into my cell phones memory. But I don't need to learn how as my kids do it for me. I think it just the times - children use technology to the fullest.

[Dante3]

You are exactly right about Tom Wolfe. Didn't some critic complain that these books were "unrealistic"?

[Steve_Seattle]

At what time did the rape allegedly occur? I recall that according to the woman, the rape went on for 10-20 minutes - exactly what time was that?

[Krodg]

Also, Seiligman was never interviewed by cops. DA seeking reelection simply took "Dancers" word that he raped her.

From the article at the top of this thread.

[Alia]

I never said it did "excuse the Duke Boys" (from bad judgement). But you wrote that they EXPLOITED a woman, freely, offering a transaction. This is not exploitation. Exploitation involves some form of co-ersion. Like, as in the illegal immigrant slave trades.

The woman had AMPLE opportunities to jobs and grants.

My word, some of us even work two and three jobs WHILE going to school, etc.. Are you suggesting "discrimination" against her skin color or sex "forcing" her into the sex-trades? Sounds like Jesse Jackson is going to beat you instanter in suggesting that.

[don'tbedenied]

The prosecution will claim the rape occurred at a time during which the defendant has no alibi. Failing that Nifong will simply indict someone else until he finds someone without an alibi.

[Tiberius109]

Wowow sorry for the typos , didnt have my coffee yet !
Tiberius109

[sox_the_cat]

Check the complaint in the smoking gun.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0405061duke1.html

In the complaint she claims they dance a while then they go to the car and are coaxed back into the house by one of the suspects. She claims the dancers were separated and she was raped by 3 of them for about a half hour.

Align those facts with the alibi by Seligmann and the time stamped photos, than there is no way she could have been raped by Seligmann.

Looks like she's 100% wrong about someone she claims she 100% right about. I'd like to see if there is an alibi for the other guy she is 100% sure about.

[Tiberius109]

defendant dosen't have to prove anything .He's innocent until PROVEN outherwise.

[Alia]

Two years ago, I went looking into this "uttering" stuff. Asked the locals, too. You are right about the "forged" stuff. There's more on this criminal "definition" of uttering. But there are also other appelations of the term "uttering" (mostly in UK and Canada):

17. Junger/Whitehead Inquiry: Treatment of Victims The charge was uttering a threat to cause death or bodily harm. Constable G. pleaded guilty to a lesser criminal charge of conveying a false message with ... www.walnet.org/csis/reports/junger_inquiry/chapter... [Found on Google, MSN Search]

So, "uttering" in America is about forged monies or embezzelment. Why call it "uttering"?

Wow. So in US Law: Uttering is using the falsified doc by a second or third party -- kinda like aiding and abetting a crime? Why the heck is it called "uttering". Did they mean stuttering?

[Tiberius109]

Sad part is the guys will hang because they are white. Facts be damned. Did you hear Jacksons statements yesterday . He is such a racist pig and yet so many people , including whites, actually pay attention to his hustle. I had the honor of refusing to shake his hand in NY City 2 years ago . Man , was he pissed. Couldn't believe it

[jiggyboy]

Something still could have occured between 11 and 12. Do we know the girls arrived at midnight and that they were not with the accused before then somewhere else?

Oh Christ we had enough of that BS yesterday. Trying out your material on a new audience?

[Locomotive Breath]

I've been wondering if these guys are going to be tried separately or together. If separately, the DA would first call the guy with the weaker alibi so as to get that first conviction and so that the guy with the strong alibi's acquittal can't be used to discredit the witness for the guy with the weaker alibi.

What's gone on here is the defense has known all along that the DA didn't have a good ID on the purported attackers (because there weren't any!) and that the DA didn't even know who was actually at the party at the time the rape supposedly occurred. The players not talking to the DA was to not do his work for him by narrowing down the possibilities. All the chatter from the defense in the last week was to force the DA to roll the dice and pick two. Can you say "Rope a dope? I knew you could."

I am reminded of two movie scenes from the Indiana Jones series:

1) Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade (with reference to Nifong):
[Bad guy chooses the wrong Holy Grail cup, drinks the water and dies horribly.]
Grail Knight: He chose poorly.

2) Raiders of the Lost Ark (with reference to the defense after they learn who's been charged):
[the old man reveals writing on the back of the medallion, which states that part of the staff must be removed]
Indiana: Balloq's medallion only had writing on one side? You sure about that?
Sallah: Positive!
Indiana: Balloq's staff is too long.
Indiana, Sallah: [Hands clapped on each others' shoulders and dancing a jig] They're digging in the wrong place!

[Steve_Seattle]

It's irrelevant what he was doing at the ATM and what he wanted the money for; the only relevant thing is that he was there at that particular time.