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To: VadeRetro
We see apelike things outside the range of human variation becoming more humanlike until they fall within the range of human variation . . .

When one assumes the history of primates is one from ape to human it is not difficult to make the evidence support the assumption. I know how much I do not know. I also know textbooks on paleontology take what is found in the field and present it in a manner that is in accord with evolutionist dogma; from the simple to the more complex. From an intuitive standpoint this fits nicely and is reasonable and believable.

Give me the fossil record completely and in 3D before it is removed from the field and before it is interpreted. Then let me think for myself. Unless you do this you are asking me to take other people's word for things. Rare is the observer who sets out to deceive himself and others. Common to all is the inclination to fill in the blanks in favor of initial assumptions, and thus miss the mark in determining what is objective reality.

243 posted on 03/24/2006 6:34:28 PM PST by Fester Chugabrew
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To: Fester Chugabrew
When one assumes the history of primates is one from ape to human it is not difficult to make the evidence support the assumption.

So it's all just a figment of our imagination? Why does it look like apes slowly becoming human before our eyes? Why do we find them in the right order in the geologic column?

I know how much I do not know.

Your mistake is thinking it's evidence nobody else knows anything.

Give me the fossil record completely and in 3D before it is removed from the field and before it is interpreted.

Bring me the broomstick of the Wicked Witch of the West and I'll believe in Poofism.

250 posted on 03/24/2006 6:40:53 PM PST by VadeRetro (I have the updated "Your brain on creationism" on my homepage.)
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To: Fester Chugabrew
When one assumes the history of primates is one from ape to human it is not difficult to make the evidence support the assumption.

We happen to have one historical test of this hypothesis of yours, and that one case at least suggests that it not only IS "difficult to make the evidence support the assumption," it's nearly impossible.

That test case is of course Eoanthropus dawsoni, or "Piltdown Man," a completely faked hominid (an engineered fraud combining fairly recent ape and human bones) that was nevertheless accepted as a genuine fossil creature for a number of decades.

If it really is "not difficult to make the evidence support the assumption" of evolution -- whether or not it genuinely does so -- then it should have been easy to work Piltdown into the scheme of human evolution along with actual fossils.

But it was not easy. Indeed no one succeeded in doing so. As real fossils accumulated from Africa and Asia clear patterns in human evolution became apparent. For instance teeth and jaws were reduced in size and became more human-like while the brain remained small and the skull remained apelike. Piltdown showed exactly the opposite pattern. (Unsurprisingly since it was an ape's jaw combined with human skull fragments.)

No one could ever "make" Piltdown fit. Textbooks and research papers began to ignore it or openly declare it an unsolved anomaly. If an attempt was made to include it in an evolutionary scheme it was inevitably shunted off onto a lonely side-branch.

273 posted on 03/24/2006 7:09:55 PM PST by Stultis (I don't worry about the war turning into "Vietnam" in Iraq; I worry about it doing so in Congress.)
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To: Fester Chugabrew
Give me the fossil record completely and in 3D before it is removed from the field and before it is interpreted.

Go for it! The whole world is out there waiting for Uncle Fester to overturn 140 years of biology ...

Then let me think for myself.

On the slim chance that you'll ever think for yourself, the only one that's stopping you is you.

Unless you do this you are asking me to take other people's word for things.

Did you ever do the microwave experiment?
No? If not, then you'll have to take the word of those that have. Unless, of course, you plan to continue demonstrating your ignorance.

Maybe you should consider why those that have science experience hold a different opinion from those that don't.

336 posted on 03/25/2006 1:43:30 AM PST by dread78645 (Sorry Mr. Franklin, We couldn't keep it.)
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