Why I Support President Bush and the ZOT!

[Das Outsider]

Therefore, even if I believe another person's faith is totally erroneous, I still respect him or her as a "person of faith," with the same inborn capacity to engage with the Divine as I have.

But don't you see? By that reasoning, faith is more powerful than truth, or else the truth cannot be known beyond something that is divine and honors what man honors. A man may have the capacity to believe--fervently, I might add--that he is a six-foot tall glass of orange juice. I would be as crazy as he to commend him for his faith. Rather, I should recommend him to the county mental health facilities!

Your general idea is right, though. We should accept people where they are right now, but not hesitate to speak to them of Truth, in love and genuine concern.

[Chode]

and you too Monkey Face... this year i truly feel reborn.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

My forsythia has been in bloom for a couple of weeks now. Gorgeous. And tulips and other early spring flowers. And fruit trees in bloom all over the place. Lovely.

Our back yard already needs mowing. But we need several days of dry weather so we can get our new roof up!

[Das Outsider]

There are some terrible bigots on this site - both Catholic (aka "One True Church") and Protestant (aka "Pope is the AntiChrist") - such sectarianism is utter nonsense.

That is misstating a particular Reformation view. The teaching is that the papacy is Antichrist--not the current Pope or any other past pontiff.

[Lady Jag]

You sound like you are heading toward joining PETA.

[Irish_Thatcherite]

Sorry, you are right, my mistake.

[Monkey Face]

LOL!

Ahyes! I remember that, now! OK.
Instead of Vlad the Impaler, we have Vlad the Spitter...I'm anxious to see his new stats.

[NicknamedBob]

"And didn't you write a "letter" about who we are, as Denizens of the UT?"

"I did ... it's linked on Sionnsar's U.T. pinglist graphic, which it's quite beyond me to duplicate."

It's also the first link on my about page. What's this thread all about?

[Monkey Face]

That's a great feeling, isn't it?

:o]

[Monkey Face]

Utah was the only place outside of Puget Sound where I saw forsythia thrive. I love that bush along with bridal wreath. And of course, Utah would not smell as good without the lilacs.

OK...I'll stop doing the Rain Dance!

[Monkey Face]

Of COURSE!

How silly of me to forget something so important.
*blushing*

[NicknamedBob]

I've been trying to keep a running link page there.

It now includes our landing on Mars.

[Das Outsider]

Sorry, you are right, my mistake

It's ok. That is the perception that some have, partly because of genuinely unbiblical fanatics that bear the Protestant name, and partly because of an inability to--and I never thought I'd hear myself say this!--discern nuances. Luther said that the office of the papacy was Antichrist, based from a few passages regarding the role and character of Antichrist, because of the Pope's presumed ability to permanently excommunicate and forgive sins. That would be taking the role of Christ and perverting it, since He is the true head of the Church.

There is a tendency today to read Luther as a radical reformer instead of a good catholic (intentional lowercase 'c').

[Monkey Face]

I know...I try not to go there because I have trouble navigating on most days. I have to do things in "dribs and drabs" (as my mother used to say.)

If there are a lot of links, I get overwhelmed very easily.
It's not your fault, of course. It's mine.

[Irish_Thatcherite]

discern nuances

That was probably were my misunderstanding occured - some here on FR weren't able to do that!

Thanks for that read!

[NicknamedBob]

"But don't you see? By that reasoning, faith is more powerful than truth ..."

I caught a glimmer of hope for logic in this statement. But then I realised that Faith is not antithetical to Truth, nor is it coincidental.

Truth is a single immutable gnomon, around which Faiths like shadows pool. At any particular time one Faith may seem to be illustrative of Truth, but times change.

Truth and Logic are primordial concepts, having little to do with more advanced constructions such as Salvation. Still, even though we stumble blindly through the unknown territories, we recognize the solid reality of Truth, and the cool respite of Faith.

[TASMANIANRED]

No indeedie.

Meat eater to the bone.

It's a question of images. A cow is neither ugly or cute, neither is a pig or a chicken.

The thought of their faces doesn't disturb me when I eat their flesh.

On the other hand the image of a doe, a lamb or a lobster does disturb me.

Too cute on the first two. The later is the stuff of nightmares.

[Das Outsider]

If being a Sign of the Cross making, traditional Church calendar following, consubstantiation believing, St. Augustine reading, sola fide, sola gratia, solus Christus, sola Scriptura proclaiming, medieval hymn singing Lutheran makes me a Protestant fanatic, then would you kindly purchase me a ticket aboard the Crazy Train? ;)

[Tax-chick]

By that reasoning, faith is more powerful than truth, or else the truth cannot be known beyond something that is divine and honors what man honors.

No, that's not what I meant. I believe that truth is absolute and can be known, by reason and revelation. However, the fact that a person believes something in error does not diminish that person *as a person*. He still has the capacity to know the truth, and to engage with the truth through faith, according to his personal conditions.

We should accept people where they are right now, but not hesitate to speak to them of Truth, in love and genuine concern.

I think we should hesitate, long enough to consider the circumstances and the potential benefit or harm. My discussion of "Undead Thread Religion Etiquette," so to speak, was situation-specific. In this immediate situation, we have a gentlemen's-and-ladies' agreement to avoid religious disputes, because there are other places for that, while this is "a space apart."

We know we have differences, but when we discuss them, it's in the way of exchanging information, rather than attempting to persuade. For example, a person with a question about Catholic belief or practice can ask it here, and get an answer from several informed parties, and then disengage, without being asked whether he accepts what the Catholic Church teaches. The same with a Protestant, any type; a Jew, any variety; an Asatru (that's Dead Corpse, I googled it!), or anything else.

[Tax-chick]

We had wonderful Forsythia in Virginia. My mother planted several, and they'd have eaten the house, without aggressive pruning.