Posted on 01/21/2006 3:25:50 PM PST by Reily
History Channel show on Camp Douglas, so far not bad. Whats really interesting is the references to those non-existent Black Confederates. Just a handful but an interesting and matter-of-fact admission of their existence.
What is the issue?
The fact that any network would talk about Union POW camps is a giant step forward. Andersonville was a terrible place, but the Southern people around them were suffering terribly too. Massive casualties, little food, watching their country lose a major war, totally. Times were not good here in Georgia.
I salute History Channel for presenting the facts as they rest in history. Although this wont roll back any of the anti Southern history so acceptable these days, it is moving in the right direction
There are many African Americans who are extremely proud of the south, don't buy into the fact that the South is a racist place, and also do not dislike the mere sight of the Rebel Flag, as many Northern liberals and conservatives alike do.
no issue ...just pointing out that here is an admission of the existence of Black Confederates by a source of 'popular history'. If you have followed some of these past discussions about whether Black Confederate soldiers existed or not, you would think it was a discussion of whether Confederate Martians existed !
"If you have followed some of these past discussions about whether Black Confederate soldiers existed or not"
I haven't followed any thread on this.
I do know that both sides had about 10% black. But if you think about it 10% is about the right proportion of the population of black in that era.
So the number of blacks enlisted in the right % of the population. If there were affirmative action people they would be happy.
in the past there were some really heated discussions about whether Black Confederates existed or not !
If it is a "fact" then people who don't "buy into it" are ignorant. Do you really believe that 1, the MSM,etc description of the south is true and that people who believe otherwise are ignorant? A fact is a real event or thing. People who use that phrase-"the fact that" about something they believe to be untrue are negating their own argument in the same sentence that they are trying to support it. Rush uses that phrase a lot and it grates every time. If something is a FACT it is TRUE and should be believed.
One of my GGGF died at Camp Douglas. The difference between Union and Confederate Deaths in the prisons was 25% to 22%. The Union camps were hellholes also.
True, it is a confusing phrase. But are you agreeing or disagreeing with my point?
My gggf served in illinois 55th infantry. Were you ever able to find your GGGF grave site? 6000 men died. Yes, you're right the prison conditions were horrid on both sides.
GRAVEYARDS of CHICAGO
Oak Woods Cemetery
One section of Oak Woods is known as the "Confederate Mound". A 46-foot monument stands alone, surrounded by cannon and cannonballs. Buried around it are an estimated six thousand soldiers and sailors of the Confederacy.
Camp Douglas was a prisoner of war internment camp near the 35th-street estate of Stephen Douglas, named for the late senator. Like all P.O.W. camps of its day, it was rife with communicable diseases - smallpox and dysentery. Conditions were appalling, and thousands died. A group of prisoners plotted to escape the camp and capture Chicago for the Confederacy, but were thwarted by Allan Pinkerton. By the end of the war, thousands had died and been buried in the North Side's old City Cemetery.
A SOLDIER'S DEATH DREAM
Upon the closing of City Cemetery, the bodies interred there were moved to the new cemeteries - Rosehill, Graceland, Oak Woods. The federal government purchased a section of Oak Woods in 1867 to accomodate the 4200 known casualties of Camp Douglas. The coffins were placed in concentric circular trenches. Although the government only had 4200 names, cemetery records indicate that closer to 6000 coffins were buried here. In addition to the unknown number of Southerners, twelve Union soldiers are buried here as well, guards from the camp. Their markers, reading "Unknown U.S. Soldier", stand in a single row behind one cannon.
The 46-foot monument was dedicated on Memorial Day, May 30, 1895. Over 100,000 people attended the ceremonies, including large numbers of men from both armies. President Cleveland and his cabinet were there as well. In 1911, bronze panels were added to the base, with the soldiers' names, ranks, units, and home states.
The Confederate Mound at Oak Woods is the largest Confederate burial ground in all the North.
This Confederate Ring Site
is Owned by graveyards.com - copyright 1996-2002 Matt Hucke
graveyards.com - copyright 1996-2002 Matt Hucke
I saw it. Made me spittin' mad.
The victors write the history books.
You state as fact that the South is a racist place and say that there are blacks who do not accept a true description-to wit, a fact. I do not agree with either assertion. What you wrote is not confusing though you may be confused about what you wrote. Diagram your sentence and look up the meaning of the word "fact."
Noticed you said you GGGF died at Camp Douglas. My GGGGF died there also. His name is listed on the monument. Do you know if there are any records that the public can access?
I too was glad to see the history channel give a relatively balanced report on Camp Douglas. To me there is a similarity between Andersonville and slavery. Very few confederates had anything to do with the problems at Andersonville. Likewise very few confederates had slaves. Somehow ALL confederates got treated like the lowest common denominator. It's about time, albeit 160 too late, that the confederate slave monster was put to rest.
Any black prisoner brought into the camp wearing a Confederate uniform was promptly shot to death by guards. One of the Union commanders of the camp systematically had prisoners tortured and murdered for any infraction, real or imagined.
Now the documentary is revealing that the next commander, after the one who introduced torture, deliberately stopped prisoners from receiving vegetable or fruit rations so they would die an agonizing death from scurvy. Lincoln topped this by giving this maniac martial law command of the entire city of Chicago. Any person even suspected of criticizing the camp commander could be arrested. This was done with full authorization from Sec. of War Stanton and Lincoln. Finally, the real Lincoln is gradually emerging from the whitewashed history as the most anti-Constitutional President in American history--a dictatorial monster, imposing far worse atrocities on Americans than the British ever did. Tojo was no more deserving of hanging than Lincoln.
The imperiousness and over-reaching of todays Federal government bears little resemblance to the government our forefathers set up. The colonies would never have joined a union from which they weren't convinced they could voluntarily withdraw [secede].
The South should have restrained its hot-headedness, and brought a test case on secession to the Supreme Court, instead of firing on Ft. Sumter. Also, had Jeff Davis and others set in motion a phased end to slavery, as many Confederate Generals like Lee, Jackson and Cleburne favored, the moral veneer masking the greed and power of the Northern Industrialists hand-picked candidate, Lincoln, and their "cause" would've had the supposed high ground yanked out from under them. The country at large would not've been so supportive of Lincoln, and the British would not have been hesitant to help the South because they, the Brits, had already outlawed slavery.
All True
However please realise that the Clintons are the South's revenge on the North !
The ulitmate secret service sleeper operation !
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