Becky
Posted on 01/11/2005 6:18:33 PM PST by malakhi
| Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. |
After a nine month hiatus, The Neverending Story, the granddaddy of daily threads, has returned to Free Republic. Originally begun on March 24, 2001, as a religious discussion thread, the NES evolved over time into a daily thread spanning a wide variety of topics. The new and improved Neverending Story will feature conversation on religion, politics, culture, current events, business, sports, family, hobbies, general fellowship and more. We welcome you to hang your hat in our little corner of FR. We ask you to abide by the FR posting rules and, even in the midst of serious debate, to keep the discussion friendly and respectful. Those who wish to "duke it out" are asked to take it over to the Smoky Backroom. I placed this thread in "General/Chat" for a reason, so play nice and have fun! :o)
It isn't?
And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life
What do you think this means, then?
Over here, fyi.
Since I broached a religion topic for the first time on this new thread, I have something I came across that I'd be interested in getting your take on.Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation. (John 5:28-29, KJV)It seems pretty clear that in this passage the author is stating that the rewards and punishments of the afterlife are based upon works. See also Matthew chapter 25. How do you reconcile this passage with others which emphasize faith/the role of Jesus?
Well ... off the top of my head, ... I would mention that, if you equate "done good" to having done good works ... and "done evil" to having done evil works ... then most, if not all of us would fit into both categories.
Therefore, the way that I would look at it is in terms of one's direction in life.
IOW ... is one's direction in life to the good or ... to the evil ?
I would note that God would reasonably desire (for everlasting life in His kingdom) ... those who show promise of continuing to become more like Him (in regard to to His goodness) ... while it also makes sense that those whose life direction is to the evil really wouldn't have a place in His (good) kingdom.
Therefore, I believe that the passage is, essentially, saying that those who, in their lives, take the steps necessary to grow in their goodness (i.e. done good) will be rewarded with continued life, ... while those which have refused to take those steps which are necessary to grow in their goodness ... and, who are even growing in their tendency for evil (i.e. done evil) ... will be doomed to damnation.
Becky
Mack posted those for me but forgot to say:), JP and Kristy stopped by to look at a horse panel, and JP discovered the joy of water puddles:) His little teeth were chattering tho, by the time we got him out.
Becky
NCs also make an error in Romans on this same issue. It says you must follow the Law. They think Romans 2&3 lay out two different "plans" for salvation. 1) obey the law perfectly or 2) Christ obeys it for you... so you need to get grafted in to Christ. Since "1" is a "null set" (nobody obeys the law) in their estimation... plan #2 is the only way.
In reality.... there is only ONE PLAN.
What is lacking, both from their assumption, and from your question is an understanding of what is meant by "does good" or "obeys the Law".
The short answer (all you're going to get right now) is that there is no such thing as someone who truly "does good" apart from Christ's work in them. You CAN receive rewards in Heaven (or "OF Heaven") by doing "good works"...
...BUT, there is no such thing as a "good work" in God's eyes that is done apart from being His adopted child. OUR "righteousness" (our best acts done on our own) is nothing more than a creature's behavior seeking favor and is worthless. But the smallest act done out of a return of the love the Father has given us is of incalculable worth.
Cute!
Clear as mud as usual.
BigMack
Expected it to be over your head :-)
You're a little rusty. Wait until the thread gets going and someone else can help you.
I'm waiting for Dave to clear it all up for me.
BigMack
... there is no such thing as someone who truly "does good" apart from Christ's work in them.
NC's believe this as well, based upon ...Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Close. But I guess it depends on the NC. The "righteousness is as filthy rags" thing still sticks with them. Perhaps the disconnect is between "does good" and "pleases Him". That's not quite a unified concept. The "no one is righteous... no not one" misunderstanding also sticks in their craw.
You think you're going to live that long?
Close. But I guess it depends on the NC. The "righteousness is as filthy rags" thing still sticks with them. Perhaps the disconnect is between "does good" and "pleases Him". That's not quite a unified concept. The "no one is righteous... no not one" misunderstanding also sticks in their craw.
I think that you're misunderstanding the NC position.
The "righteousness is as filthy rags" and the "no one is righteous ... no not one" refers to the pre-faith condition.
Once one has believed in what God has done and accepted the power of Christ into one's life ... one can perform works which are pleasing to God.
One's salvation is not based upon these works (the grace of God accomplishes one's salvation) ... but they (good works) naturally flow from the person of faith (he/she who has connected/plugged-in to God).
I think vs 24 explains. Do we hear and know who we belong to? Yeah we are going to make mistakes but if we belong to Him we are going to want to do good in His name. I've had my hands full and didn't write anything down this morning but one of the cross references uses the rightous and we see examples of men in the bible that were rightous but still sinners.
You think he's playing us? :')
Interesting, I see what you're saying. Thanks for giving me your take.
LOL, how cute! :o)
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.