Posted on 09/23/2004 10:05:25 AM PDT by GIJoel
Darkwaters, thanks for bringing some balance and civility to this thread. I was really starting to think that the majority have no manners on this site. All these people have "Jesus this and Jesus that" tagged to their posts, and yet many of them come across as the meanest, most off-puting, screw-thy-neigbor, hypocrits I have ever had the displeasure of meeting. Is that standard faire on this forum? What gives?
Well now you are just being plain nasty. I no longer know what the numbers are, but I know from past experience they are way off.
Wow, that was hard to figure out.
You are putting a whole lot more effort into being abusive than intellegent. If you have nothing more interesting to add to this discussion than "I can google but am too lazy, do it for me or your stupid" I think I will go snore somewhere, it will be more engaging for my brain.
Goodnight.
Pointing out that your statements are mutually inconsistent is "just being plain nasty?"
I no longer know what the numbers are, but I know from past experience they are way off.
Which you merely assert with a (nuanced) wave of your hand--i.e., you've been caught out, and you have no evidence. You also have no credibility.
You are putting a whole lot more effort into being abusive than intellegent.
You're putting a whole lot more effort into pounding the table than actually substantiating your claims.
You've been caught out.
You took on the pajamahadeen armed only with your wits. Unfortunately, the pajamahadeen fight with facts, and you were woefully unprepared for battle.
Hey, you really are in Israel aren't you. I lived there for almost a year just after the first Gulf War. Hated at first, and then I absolutely fell in love with the country. I'd love to hear you observations about the goings ons over there. Man I miss that place!!! I'm leaving to go home right now, so I wont be able to repond to you for about an hour or so. Looking forward to your comments.
So, you knew them before you didn't know them?
If you didn't know them, why did you say you did?
What gives is that you are posting decade-old documents of dubious provenance, dubious veracity, dubious value, and proving yourself unable to argue effectively for the provenance, veracity, and value of these postings. That may seem "rude" to someone who was expecting hinge-head agreement with their every word. Free Republic is a virtual conservative think tank. We sort through a lot of information and separate the fact from the fiction at lightning speed, as Dan Rather found out to his misfortune. If you are not prepared or willing to back up your arguments with no-kidding facts, then you are wasting everyone's time.
I think that's the nuanced version...
Yep, ol'schwartzy just doesn't get it.
He's an old-media kind of guy in a new-media kind of world.
Poohbah, you crack me up. You haven't added one bit of new information to this thread. You have never proved a single one of your so-called "counterarguments." In fact, now that I think about it, I can't remember you ever venturing to prove anything except a bunch of statistical poppcock about unverified missile totals. Everything I have posted is thoroghly footnoted so anyone can check the validity of ISWR's sources and come to their own conclusions. If, as the articles I posted clearly demonstrate, the Soviet Union really did fake its own collapse, it wouldn't matter if the article was published in 1994 or 2004. Would it make you FEEL any better if the article was published with today's date on it? Are you maintaining that the Soviets originally faked their own demise and then somehow lost control and collapsed for real after 1994? What's your point? You have no point, you are all inuendo. I post sources open to inspection for anyone to check. Moreover, Anatoly Golisyn predicted almost all of the changes in the "former" Soviet Union nearly 10 years before the events themselves (94% percent of them according to author Mark Riebling). Every other Soviet analyst was completely taken by surprise by the events leading to the USSR's "collapse." That is, everyone EXCEPT Golitsyn and Angleton. They had consistently maintained that the Soviets were about to fake their own death for almost a decade. Moreover, Golitsyn provided specific details and sequences, even naming the names of future leaders and the role they would play to make the whole thing look convincing. But I bet you have never read any of Golitsyn's books have you. Nor have you read any books by authors who support Golitsyn. So it is you who are coming across devoid of any substance. Why don't you put forward your version of what happened during the lead up to and after the "collapse" of Soviet Communism, and I promise you I will take your argument apart bit by bit, using open sources, until you realize that your argument has been reduced to the residual puddle it always was. Indeed, if I only proved you wrong on a single point, it would be an infinitely greater accomplishment than anything you have accomplished here. But don't worry, I will destroy your entire argument. There will be nothing left of it when I am finished with you. What do you say, Poohbah, ready to accept the challenge. Put up or shut up.
Pot, kettle, black. This stuff is almost a decade old!
You have never proved a single one of your so-called "counterarguments."
You haven't proven a single one of your arguments to begin with. Arm-waving with self-referential documents is not proof.
Everything I have posted is thoroghly footnoted so anyone can check the validity of ISWR's sources and come to their own conclusions.
Footnoting does not prove validity. Many of the footnotes are references to other documents produced by ISWR, and those documents in turn refer to other documents prepared by ISWR. In short, these articles are self-referential.
If, as the articles I posted clearly demonstrate, the Soviet Union really did fake its own collapse, it wouldn't matter if the article was published in 1994 or 2004.
That is the problem: the articles do not clearly demonstrate that.
You haven't clearly demonstrated a damn thing. Please do so before doing anything else.
Are you maintaining that the Soviets originally faked their own demise and then somehow lost control and collapsed for real after 1994?
I am asking you to prove your arguments. You have refused to do so. When pressed for additional information, you have provided one non-ISWR article...from a source of legendary non-credibility.
Moreover, Anatoly Golisyn predicted almost all of the changes in the "former" Soviet Union nearly 10 years before the events themselves (94% percent of them according to author Mark Riebling)
When a man like Golitsyn makes Kerryesque predictions (first one thing, then the opposite), he's going to be right a fair amount; all you have to do is ignore where he was wrong.
And perceptive observers of the USSR were few and far-between in the 1980s, being mostly recruited from an academia that regarded the USSR as a great, noble, and successful experiment.
I am unsurprised that Golitsyn got the events somewhat correct, although he got the underlying causes absolutely wrong. I knew people who'd been assigned to the embassy in Moscow in the 1970s and early 1980s (I was in the Marine Corps during the 1980s), and they openly wondered how in the hell the USSR kept itself from imploding. Answer: it didn't, in the long run.
Every other Soviet analyst was completely taken by surprise by the events leading to the USSR's "collapse."
Because they never understood the nature of the Communist system. The factory floor manager lied to the factory manager, who lied to the ministry representative. That much we understood. But we never understood until after things collapsed that the ministry representative lied to everyone above him, and so it went, right up to the Politburo.
So it is you who are coming across devoid of any substance.
You haven't provided anything except a bunch of self-referential articles with theses that are downright silly; the "proof" of the theses is in footnote references to other articles by the same entity.
You asserted; you must prove. You have failed to do so.
Why don't you put forward your version of what happened during the lead up to and after the "collapse" of Soviet Communism, and I promise you I will take your argument apart bit by bit, using open sources, until you realize that your argument has been reduced to the residual puddle it always was. Indeed, if I only proved you wrong on a single point, it would be an infinitely greater accomplishment than anything you have accomplished here. But don't worry, I will destroy your entire argument. There will be nothing left of it when I am finished with you. What do you say, Poohbah, ready to accept the challenge. Put up or shut up.
After you put up or shut up, good sir. Prove your arguments. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. Provide said extraordinary proof, or go elsewhere.
Footnotes from "We Are The Next Target." What is the ratio of self-referential versus no self-referential footnotes? Like I said, you just invent "facts" to deride and mislead.
Footnotes
1 Fritz, S. and Jackson, R.C., "Federal authorities expect additional arrests in trade center bombing." Los Angeles Times, Sat., 3-13-93, p. A16.
2 Goldman, J.J. and Jackson, R.L., "Eight suspects seized in plot to bomb U.N., other N.Y. targets." Los Angeles Times, Fri., 6-25-93, p. A1; Neumeister, L., Associated Press, "U.S. charges sheik with terrorist plots." Orange County Register, Thur., 8-26-93, p. 1.
3 Newsday, "Palestinian reportedly questioned in N.Y. blast." San Francisco Chronicle, Thur., 5-6-93, p. A11.
4 "N.Y. bombing tied to international plot." San Francisco Chronicle, Fri., 7-16-93, p. A12.
5 Turque, B., Waller, D., Cohn, B., and Beachy, L., "An Iranian connection?" Newsweek, 3-22-93, p. 33; Neumeister, Op cit.
6 "N.Y. bombing tied to international plot," Op cit.
7 Reuters, "IRA blast injures 27." San Francisco Chronicle, Wed., 12-2-92, p. A10.
8 "Bomb injures 17 in Northern Ireland." San Francisco Chronicle, Tues., 7-6-93, p. A8.
9 Schmidt, W.E., "Bomb tied to I.R.A., the 8th in 6 days, injures 5 Londoners." New York Times, Tues., 10-13-92, pp. A5-6.
10 "8 people wounded by two bomb blasts in Northern London." New York Times, Fri., 12-11-92, pp. A3, A9.
11 New York Times, "Anti-terrorist roadblocks set up in Central London." San Francisco Chronicle, Tues., 7-6-93, p. A8.
12 Protzman, F., "Head of top West German bank is killed in bombing by terrorists." New York Times, Fri., 12-1-89, p. A1.
13 "German official is fatally shot in Dusseldorf." Wall Street Journal, Tues., 4-2-91, pp. A17, A21; "Berlin city official is killed by letter bomb at his home." New York Times, Fri., 6-14-91, p. A9.
14 "Turkey says Kurd rebels killed 35." San Francisco Chronicle, Wed., 5-26-93, p. A14.
15 Hoffman, D., Washington Post, "Gunmen attack Israeli bus--4 die." San Francisco Chronicle, Fri., 7-2-93, p. A16.
16 Kelly, D., "Egypt tries to suppress fundamentalists." San Francisco Chronicle, Tues., 2-16-93, p. A7.
17 New York Times, "South African group vows more attacks." San Francisco Chronicle, Wed., 12-2-92, p. A12.
18 Shenon, P., New York Times, "Another ambush by Khmer Rouge--13 die on train." San Francisco Chronicle, Fri., 5-7-93, p. A10.
19 de Villamarest, P.F., Histoire secrete des organisations terroristes. Famot-Beauval, 1976; Sterling, C., The Terror Network. Holt, Rinehart and Winston, New York, 1981.
20 Farah, D., Washington Post, "'Terrorist' arsenal uncovered." San Francisco Chronicle, 7-14-93, pp. A1, A15.
21 U.S. Senate Committee on Foreign Relations, "Nicaragua Today." Republican Staff Report, August, 1992, 138 pp.
22 Associated Press, "Czech revolution: A secret police plot?" Los Angeles Times, Fri., 6-1-90, p. A10 (about "Czech-Mate: Inside the Revolution," aired on BBC-TV 5-30-90).
23 Ellison, B.J., "Behind the facade." The New American, 5-21-91, pp. 21-30.
24 Micheletti, E. (translated by McColl, A.), "Puppet Revolution," Soldier of Fortune, July, 1990, pp. 48-55.
25 Golitsyn, A., New Lies for Old. Dodd, Mead & Co., New York, 1984, p. 331.
26 McAlvany, D.S., "Russian strategic deception: The 'new' Communist threat." The McAlvany Intelligence Advisor, Jan., 1994, p. 9.
27 See, for example, Ellison, B.J., "Behind the facade," Op cit.; Epstein, E., "Spies who still haven't come in from the cold," (World Insider), San Francisco Chronicle, 3-30-90, p. A25; Epstein, E., "Some spies won't quite their old ways," (World Insider), San Francisco Chronicle, 6-15-90, p. A19; Emerson, S., New York Times Magazine, "Keeping watch on the Stasi machine," San Francisco Chronicle, Wed., 8-15-90, pp. Briefing 1,4,5; Fisher, M., Washington Post, "Spies keep popping up in Germany," San Francisco Chronicle, 10-11-90, pp. A1, A22; Tagliabue, J., "Secret-police scandals outlive East Germany," New York Times, Sun., 10-28-90, International; New York Times, "New links to East German secret police," San Francisco Chronicle, 3-28-91, p. A19; and others.
28 McAlvany, D.S., "Russian strategic deception: The 'new' Communist threat," Op cit., pp. 7-9.
29 Ibid., p. 12.
30 Ibid., p. 14; Klebkinov, P., "Prizewinner's ways," Forbes, 1-7-91.
31 Personal communication with Avraham Shifrin, director of The Research Center for Prisons, Psych-prisons, and Forced-Labor Concentration Camps of the USSR, based in Jerusalem, Israel; Zalman Shoval, former Israeli ambassador to the U.S., confirmed that most Jews still cannot leave the Soviet Union (speech at the University of California, Berkeley, 12-8-92).
32 Sinai, R., Associated Press, "Cold war over? Not for spies," Contra Costa Times, 3-5-92, p. B1; McAlvany, "Russian strategic deception: The 'new' Communist threat," Op cit., pp. 20-22.
33 McAlvany, D.S., "The rebirth of an empire: What is really happening in the Soviet Union," The McAlvany Intelligence Advisor, Sep./Oct. 1991, pp. 18-22; McAlvany, "Russian strategic deception: The 'new' Communist threat," Op cit., pp. 15-18.
34 Cheung, T.M., "China's buying spree: Russia gears up to upgrade Peking's weaponry," Far Eastern Economic Review, 7-8-93, pp. 24-26; Washington Post, "Soviets offer to keep sending Nicaragua aid," San Francisco Chronicle, 2-28-90, p. A13; Collier, R., "Chamorro tries to hold onto Communist aid," San Francisco Chronicle, Wed., 3-7-90, pp. A13, A15; "Czechs rebuff U.S. on Syria arms sale," San Francisco Chronicle, 5-9-91, P. A20; Gordon, M.R., New York Times, "Russians flew N. Korea arms parts to Syria," San Francisco Chronicle, Sun., 12-12-93, p. A15; McAlvany, "The rebirth of an empire: What is really happening in the Soviet Union," Op cit., pp. 21-22; "Islamic fundamentalism: The threat to peace," American Jewish News, Thurs., May 6, 1993, p. 7.
35 "Poland won't allow Red Army through," San Francisco Chronicle, 1-11-91, p. A21; "Soviet army starts on the long way home," San Francisco Chronicle, 3-13-91, p. A11; McAlvany, "The rebirth of an empire: What is really happening in the Soviet Union," Op cit., p. 21; Kinzer, S., New York Times, "A bitter good-by to Germany," San Francisco Chronicle, 3-4-94, p. A14.
36 Associated Press, "Russia preparing to join new NATO partnership," San Francisco Chronicle, 3-18-94, p. A16; McAlvany, "Russian strategic deception: The 'new' Communist threat," Op cit., p. 10.
37 "NATO opposes repositioning of Russian troops," San Francisco Chronicle, 4-4-94, p. A10; Cooperman, A., Associated Press, "Yeltsin OKs bases in ex-Soviet Union," San Francisco Chronicle, 4-7-94, p. A12.
38 McAlvany, "Russian strategic deception: The 'new' Communist threat," Op cit., p. 10.
39 Golitsyn, Op cit., Chapter 25.
40 Lenin, V.I., "What is to be done?", 1902, in Connor, J.E., Ed., Lenin on Politics and Revolution, Pegasus, Indianapolis, 1968, pp. 61-72.
41 Ibid., p. 73.
42 Lenin, V.I., "Left-Wing" Communism, an Infantile Disorder, International Publishers, New York, 1940, p. 9.
43 Ibid., pp. 31-32.
44 Ibid., p. 82.
45 Goodman, E.R., The Soviet Design for a World State, Columbia University Press, New York, 1960.
46 Lenin, "Left-Wing Communism, an Infantile Disorder, Op cit., pp. 12, 18-19.
47 Ibid., pp. 14, 20-21, 34, 37-39, 42-48, 62, 65, 76-77, 80, etc.
48 Stalin, J., Marxism and the National Question, International Publishers, New York, 1942, p. 38, passim.
49 Foster, W.Z., Toward Soviet America, Elgin Publications, Balboa Island, CA, 1961 (originally published 1932), pp. 39-40.
50 Petrenko, F., and Popov, V., Soviet Foreign Policy: Objectives and Principles, Progress Publishers, Moscow, 1985, pp. 285-287.
51 Golitsyn, A., New Lies for Old, Op cit., pp. 341-342.
52 Foster, W.Z., Toward Soviet America, Op cit., pp. 272-273.
53 Gromyko, A., Africa: Progress, Problems, Prospects, Progress Publishers, Moscow, 1983, pp. 41-51.
54 Agwani, M.S., Communism in the Arab East, Asia Publishing House, New York, 1969, pp. 9-20.
55 As quoted in Sterling, Op cit., pp. 21-22.
56 Sterling, Op cit., pp. 151, 171.
57 Reed, D., "South Africa: Glimmers of hope?", Reader's Digest, Aug., 1987; McAlvany, D.S., "Revolution and betrayal: The accelerating onslaught against South Africa," The McAlvany Intelligence Advisor, July, 1986, pp. 10-11; Bureau for Information, Talking with the ANC..., Government Printer, Pretoria, South Africa, 1986, p. 24.
58 For example, see Sterling, Op cit.; Batista, F., Cuba Betrayed, Vantage Press, New York, 1962; Weyl, N., Red Star Over Cuba, Hillman Books, New York, 1961; Smith, E.E.T., The Fourth Floor, Random House, New York, 1962; Clark, M.K., Algeria in Turmoil, Grosset & Dunlap, New York, 1959; True Aspects of the Algerian Revolution, French Interior Ministry, Paris; Kai-shek, C., Soviet Russia in China, Farrar, Straus and Cudahy, New York, 1957; Welch, R., Again, May G-d Forgive Us, Belmont Publishing Company, Belmont, MA, 1952; Somoza, A. and Cox, J., Nicaragua Betrayed, Western Islands, Boston, 1980; Pahlavi, M.R., Shah, Answer to History, Stein & Day, New York, 1980; Pike, H.R., A History of Communism in South Africa, Christian Mission International of South Africa, Germiston, South Africa, 1985; de Villamarest, P.F., The Strategists of Fear, Geneva, Switzerland, 1981; and many others.
59 Marx, K., "On the Jewish Question," in Tucker, R.C., ed., The Marx-Engels Reader, second edition, W.W. Norton & Company, New York, 1978, p. 49.
60 Lumer, H., ed., Lenin on the Jewish Question, International Publishers, New York, 1974, p. 47.
61 Agwani, Op cit., pp. 9-13; Webster, N.H., The Surrender of an Empire, London, 3rd ed., 1931, pp. 360-365.
62 Sterling, Op cit., pp. 14-15.
63 Livingstone, N.C. and Halevy, D., Inside the PLO, William Morrow & Co., New York, 1990, pp. 68-70.
64 Sterling, Op cit., pp. 272-276.
65 Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., pp. 201-211.
66 Ibid., pp. 67, 73.
67 Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., pp. 64-65; Rees, J., "Why Americans must oppose the P.L.O.," The Review of the News, Oct. 17, 1979, pp. 31-44 (p. 41); Parry, A., Terrorism, From Robespierre to Arafat, Vanguard Press, New York, 1976, p. 131.
68 Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., p. 67; Sterling, Op cit., p. 277; Israeli, R., ed., PLO in Lebanon: Selected Documents, Weidenfeld and Nicolson, London, 1983, pp. 34-73.
69 Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., pp. 77-78.
70 Sterling, Op cit., pp. 272-285; Israeli, Op cit., p. 7; Alexander, Y. and Sinai, J., Terrorism: The PLO Connection, Crane Russak, New York, 1989, pp. 126-127.
71 Sterling, Op cit., pp. 272-285; Israeli, Op cit., pp. 74-157; Rees, J., "Why Americans must oppose the P.L.O.," Op cit., pp. 42-43; Alexander and Sinai, Op cit., pp. 121-136.
72 Rees, J., "Why Americans must oppose the P.L.O.," Op cit., p. 33.
73 Ibid., pp. 31-44; Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., passim; Israeli, Op cit., passim; Sterling, Op cit., pp. 113-130, 272-285; Laffin, J., The P.L.O. Connections, Corgi Books, London, 1982, passim; Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs, The Threat of PLO Terrorism, Jerusalem, 1985, pp. 17-22; Merari, A., PLO: Core of World Terror, Jaffee Centre for Strategic Studies, Tel Aviv University, Carta, Jerusalem, 1983, pp. 10-21; Alexander and Sinai, Op cit., passim.
74 Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., pp. 158-160.
75 Ibid., p. 159.
76 Sterling, Op cit., p. 121.
77 Ibid., p. 122.
78 On Algeria, see Clark, M.K., Algeria in Turmoil, Op cit.; editorial staff, "If you want it straight," "Testimony of Raoul Salan," and du Berrier, H., "The opposition," American Opinion, Sept. 1962, pp. 1-45, 49-58, 59-62; on Libya, see Sterling, Op cit., chapter 14, especially pp. 268-269, and ElWarfally, M.G., Imagery and Ideology in U.S. Policy Toward Libya, 1969-1982, University of Pittsburgh Press, Pittsburgh, PA, 1988, chapter 3; on Syria, see Hopwood, D., Syria 1945-1986: Politics and Society, Unwin Hyman, London, 1988, especially chapter 4 and p. 56; Syria completed its invasion and annexation of Lebanon in October, 1990, as recounted in Bard, M.G. and Himelfarb, J., Myths and Facts, Near East Report, Washington, D.C., 1992, p. 106; the takeover of South Yemen by Habash's Arab Nationalist Movement is mentioned in Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., p. 202, and its final conversion to full Communism in Sterling, Op cit., pp. 89-90, 253-254; Communist influence over, and attempts to conquer, North Yemen are referred to in Davis, L.J., Myths and Facts 1989, Near East Report, Washington, DC, 1988, p. 36, in Bard and Himelfarb, Op cit., pp. 238-239, in Sterling, Op cit., p. 257, and in Alexander and Sinai, Op cit., p. 116, and the final merger with South Yemen is mentioned by Carapico, S., in Middle East Report, Nov./Dec. 1992, pp. 43-44; on Iraq, see Darwish, A. and Alexander, G., Unholy Babylon, St. Martin's Press, New York, 1991, especially pp. 20-24, and al-Khalil, S., Republic of Fear, University of California Press, Berkeley, CA, 1990, especially pp. 12-13, 66, 183-184ff, 226-227, and chapter 7 passim.
79 Rees, J., "How Jimmy Carter betrayed the Shah," The Review of the News, Feb. 21, 1979, pp. 31-48.
80 Taheri, A., Holy Terror: Inside the World of Islamic Terrorism, Adler & Adler, Bethesda, MD, 1987, p. 79; Alexander and Sinai, Op cit., pp. 72-73; Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., pp. 150-154.
81 "Islamic fundamentalism: The threat to peace," American Jewish News, Op cit.; McAlvany, "Russian strategic deception: The 'new' Communist threat," Op cit., pp. 11, 20; "Gorbachev's gulf, too," The Economist, Oct. 24, 1987, pp. 13-14.
82 Sterling, Op cit., chapter 12.
83 Davis, Myths and Facts 1989, Op cit., pp. 134-135; Alexander and Sinai, Op cit., pp. 11-14, chapters 6-7.
84 For examples of Shi'ite opposition to the Ayatollah Khomeini, see Taheri, Op cit., p. 163, and Pahlavi, Shah Mohammed Reza, Answer to History, Op cit., chapter 11.
85 Taheri, Op cit., p. 217.
86 Rees, J., "How Jimmy Carter betrayed the Shah," Op cit., pp. 39-47; Taheri, Op cit., p. 175.
87 Taheri, Op cit., pp. 95-99.
88 Ibid., pp. 100-102.
89 Ibid., 177; Laffin, J., Holy War: Islam Fights, Grafton Books, London, 1988, p. 79.
90 Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., pp. 212-216, 267-275; Alexander and Sinai, Op cit., p. 186.
91 Taheri, Op cit., pp. 76-84.
92 Schiff, Z. and Ya'ari, E., Intifada, Simon and Schuster, New York, 1990, pp. 56-57; Black, I. and Morris, B., Israel's Secret Wars, Grove Weidenfeld, New York, 1991, p. 468.
93 Abu-Amr, Z., "Hamas: A historical and political background," Journal of Palestine Studies, XXII (4), Summer, 1993, pp. 5-19 (pp. 16-17).
94 Netanyahu, B., A Place Among the Nations, Bantam Books, New York, 1993, pp. 220-221.
95 Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., p. 84.
96 Davis, L.J., Op cit., pp. 90-93.
97 Israeli, Op cit., pp. 281-288.
98 Davis, L.J., Op cit., p. 92.
99 Emerson, S., The American House of Saud, Franklin Watts, New York, 1985, chapter 14.
100 Rees, J., "Why Americans must oppose the P.L.O.," Op cit., pp. 43-44; National Lawyers Guild, 1977 Middle East Delegation, Treatment of Palestinians in Israeli-Occupied West Bank and Gaza, National Lawyers Guild, New York, 1978.
101 Bard and Himelfarb, Op cit., pp. 117-118; "U.N. Council condemns Hebron killings," San Francisco Chronicle, 3-19-94, pp. A1, A15.
102 Journal of Palestine Studies, XXII (3), Spring 1993, pp. 157-159.
103 Davydkov, R., The Palestine Question, Progress Publishers, Moscow, 1984, pp. 23-24.
104 Ibid., pp. 233-248.
105 Arafat, Y., "We are optimistic," World Marxist Review, Sept. 1987, pp. 47-50; "Stronger solidarity with the Palestinian people's struggle in the occupied territories: Statement by the Communist and Workers' Parties of the Arab East," Information Bulletin, Feb. 1988, p. 37; "Israeli actions are state terrorism: Statement by the Central Secretariat, Communist Party of India," Information Bulletin, March 1988, p. 25; "For speeding up a Middle East international conference: Joint statement by the Communist Parties of Jordan, Palestine and Israel," Information Bulletin, March 1988, pp. 25-26; "Gus Hall: The Middle East--the moment of truth," Information Bulletin, March 1988, p. 26.
106 Tamari, S., "Left in limbo: Leninist heritage and Islamist challenge," Middle East Report, Nov.-Dec. 1992, pp. 16-21; Cobban, H., "Palestinian relationships inside and outside the occupied territories," American-Arab Affairs, Winter 1989-90, pp. 38-42; Sosebee, S.J., "The palestinian women's movement and the intifada: A historical and current analysis," American-Arab Affairs, Spring 1990, pp. 81-91; Lockard, J., "U.S. aid: Subsidizing collective punishment of palestinians," American-Arab Affairs, Summer 1989, p. 68; Schiff and Ya'ari, Op cit., passim.
107 Schiff and Ya'ari, Op cit., chapter 2 and pp. 101-105, 198-202.
108 Ibid., chapter 7; Cobban, Op cit., p. 40; Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., pp. 44-45.
109 Abu-Amr, Z., Op cit., pp. 14-15; Bard and Himelfarb, Op cit., p. 171.
110 See, for example, the number of PLO-affiliated professors in the delegation to the peace talks, "The Madrid peace conference," Journal of Palestine Studies, XXI (2), Winter 1992, pp. 122-123.
111 Bard and Himelfarb, Op cit., pp. 170-172; "Israel reopens West Bank university," San Francisco Chronicle, 8-22-91, p. A21.
112 "Israelis blow up homes," Orange County Register, 10-13-88, p. A22; "Arabs demand U.N. protection," San Francisco Chronicle, 3-27-92, p. A19.
113 Rosenthal, D., "The geography of fear," San Francisco Examiner Image, 10-6-91, pp. 8-15, 32; Schiff and Ya'ari, Op cit., passim.
114 Tamari, S., Op cit., p. 18.
115 Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs, The Threat of PLO Terrorism, Op cit., p. 21; Rees, J., "Why Americans must oppose the P.L.O.," Op cit., pp. 35-37.
116 Emerson, S., "Meltdown," The New Republic, Nov. 23, 1992, pp. 26-29; Bard and Himelfarb, Op cit., pp. 168-170.
117 Emerson, "Meltdown," Op cit., p. 26.
118 J.H., "Intrafada violence continues," Near East Report, Dec. 14, 1992, p. 229.
119 Rosenthal, D., "The geography of fear," Op cit., p. 14; Los Angeles Times, 1-20-88, pp. 1, 8.
120 "The war of stones," Simon Wiesenthal Center Response, May 1988, pp. 5-7.
121 New York Times, "Rights group lays blame on PLO for Arab deaths," San Francisco Chronicle, 1-10-94, p. A9.
122 Netanyahu, Op cit., p. 224.
123 Abu-Amr, Z., Op cit., p. 17.
124 Emerson, S., "Meltdown," Op cit., p. 26; Bar-Illan, D., "Israel's new pollyannas," Commentary, Sept., 1993, pp. 27-32 (p. 30).
125 Rubin, B., "How low will we stoop for Arafat?", Los Angeles Times, 3-22-90; Emerson, S., "The Bush administration's PLO cover-up," The Wall Street Journal, 3-22-90.
126 Williams, D., "Likud blames U.S. for Shamir's downfall," Los Angeles Times, 3-22-90, p. A6.
127 "Christopher leans on Israeli, Arab negotiators," San Francisco Chronicle, 4-28-93, p. A11; Washington Post, "U.S. makes proposal on palestinian self-rule," San Francisco Chronicle, 5-13-93, p. A12.
128 Ibrahim, Y.M., New York Times, "Israel-PLO deal for mutual recognition," San Francisco Chronicle, 9-9-93, pp. A1, A13; Broder, J.M. and Kempster, N., Los Angeles Times, "Israel, PLO give peace a chance," San Francisco Chronicle, 9-14-93, pp. A1, A13.
129 Kempster, N. and Parks, M., "Israel, Syria near accord, negotiators say," Los Angeles Times, 9-3-93, pp. A1, A15; "Rabin reaffirms Israel's offer to withdraw from Lebanon," San Francisco Chronicle, 9-17-93, pp. A1, A18.
130 "U.N. Council condemns Hebron killings," Op cit.
131 Lockard, J., Op cit., pp. 65+.
132 Goshko, J.M., Washington Post, "U.S. issues global call to help palestinians," San Francisco Chronicle, 9-21-93, pp. A1, A13.
133 Bard and Himelfarb, Op cit., p. 241.
134 Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., pp. 167-169.
135 New York Times, "Saudis asked to aid palestinians again," San Francisco Chronicle, 4-29-93, p. A14.
136 Sutton, A.C., The Best Enemy Money Can Buy, Liberty House Press, Billings, MT, 1986.
137 Bard and Himelfarb, Op cit., pp. 120-121.
138 Alexander and Sinai, Op cit., pp. 182-183; Viorst, M., Reaching for the Olive Branch: UNRWA and Peace in the Middle East, Middle East Institute, Washington, DC, 1989.
139 Alexander and Sinai, Op cit., pp. 182-183; Schoenberg, H.O., A Mandate for Terror: The United Nations and the PLO, Shapolsky Publishers, New York, 1989, chapter 9; Laffin, The PLO Connections, Op cit., pp. 57-58; Israeli, Op cit., pp. 294, 296.
140 Schiff, M., "How U.S. tax dollars pay for PLO terrorism," Soldier of Fortune, Winter 1977, as quoted in The Review of the News, 6-16-82, pp. 37-38.
141 Compare the current budget, nearly $250 million (Viorst, Op cit., p. 60), with one estimate of PLO annual spending, at about $400 million (Livingstone and Halevy, Op cit., p. 171).
142 Schoenberg, Op cit., chapters 7, 9; Alexander and Sinai, Op cit., pp. 183-186; Lockard, J., Op cit.
143 Schoenberg, Op cit., chapter 8; Laffin, The PLO Connections, Op cit., pp. 58-59
144 "Arafat urges U.N. to prevent 'extermination'," San Francisco Chronicle, 5-26-90, pp. A1, A20; "Arabs demand U.N. protection," San Francisco Chronicle, 3-27-92, p. A19.
145 "New plan to put foreign force in Israel territories," San Francisco Chronicle, 3-23-94, pp. A1, A13.
BTW, as far as I'm concerned you chickened out on my challenge. Now stop bothering honest people and go peck on some other people.
Last post meant for Poobah, not GIJoel.
By the way, I've noticed that every time you post to me you throw out a lifeline to all your fellow flamers. What's the matter, can't you stand on your own two feet?
Forget it, I'm done with you. You have revealed your committment to the truth, and you have been found wanting.
Source #1: Golitsyn. Unfortunately, Golitsyn is extremely non-credible. His claim that every defector who would follow him would be a plant should've raised warning flags all over Langley. Actually, it did raise those flags. Unfortunately, James Jesus Angleton chose to not heed those warning flags. Any competent intelligence officer would conclude that the defector making that claim was either (a) engaged in self-aggrandizement, or (b) a plant.
Incidentally, I find it interesting that this article makes absolutely no reference to Mitrokhin's archive, which was known of at this time. Then again, Mitrokhin's archive tends to discredit this article's line of argument.
Source #2: Edward Jay Epstein. Unfortunately, he's a big leftie with a longstanding hard-on for the CIA.
As for the other article: the support for the main thesis is from a single source: the McAlvany Intelligence Advisor. The rest is window-dressing; citing newspapers for references to specific events that were not central to the article's thesis.
BTW, if I'd invested in the manner McAlvany recommended from 1991 to 2001, I'd be broke.
However, many of ISWR's other articles are self-referential, particularly their AIDS work.
This is the prime method of attack in discussion forums--it is an attempt to make a discussion of stupid ideas (like yours) into some sort of physical fistfight.
Who I choose to ping is my business. If you don't like it, then don't post anything in public to me.
Provide real proof, sir. Until then, you should not comment on anyone else's commitment to the truth.
Poohbah wrote: "This is the prime method of attack in discussion forums--it is an attempt to make a discussion of stupid ideas (like yours) into some sort of physical fistfight."
Apparently you have that effect on a lot of people. Perhaps you should modify the way you interact with people who believe honor actually means something. And as usual, you twisted what I said. No one challenged you to a fistfight (although, I bet that happens to you alot). I was challenging you to a debate on the merits of our mutually exclusive positions re: collapse of the Soviet Union. You declined. And then you resumed spewing innuendo and outright falsehoods. You also failed to address the 145 footnotes I posted above from "We Are the Next Target." And then you had the unmitigated gall to repeat your spurious claim that "Soviet Moles" is mostly a self-referential document. And BTW, Inside Story: World Report never ever published a single article on AIDS. Do you just invent your sloppy "facts" as you go along?
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