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1 posted on 03/26/2024 8:59:16 PM PDT by jfd1776
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To: jfd1776

Well stated. Makes a great deal of sense.


2 posted on 03/26/2024 9:04:45 PM PDT by ChildOfThe60s ("If you can remember the 60s....you weren't really there")
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To: jfd1776

Numerous people here have said that ‘bumper’ barriers surrounding the piers could have avoided this. I don’t know if they protect against every eventuality, but bridges like this shouldn’t be built without something like that.


3 posted on 03/26/2024 9:12:05 PM PDT by Jamestown1630 ("A Republic, if you can keep it.")
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How about a tunnel to replace it, and set the bureaucrats to work building it?


4 posted on 03/26/2024 9:15:07 PM PDT by Olog-hai ("No Republican, no matter how liberal, is going to woo a Democratic vote." -- Ronald Reagan, 1960)
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To: jfd1776

My dad professionally restored high end cars for many years. I saw several Benz’s come through his shop growing up. There was a couple of 300 SL Benz gullwing coupes in town. My dad was the only guy who could actually work on one without messing them up. I remember them as a very fast and beautiful car that required a lot of maintenance.


8 posted on 03/26/2024 9:34:43 PM PDT by wjcsux (On 3/14/1883 Karl Marx gave humanity his best gift, he died. )
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To: jfd1776

Let BiXiden ship peeps through Baltimore on Amtrak.

Freight on NS.


9 posted on 03/26/2024 9:38:22 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: jfd1776

Oh, logic and reason, again./sarc
Wait...What?🤔


22 posted on 03/27/2024 12:07:46 AM PDT by Eagles6 (Welcome to the Matrix . Orwell's "1984" was a warning, not an instruction manual.)
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To: jfd1776

Sure, sure, sure... It’s a “shovel ready job” that will “build back better” A 100% democrat slush fund that will last for decades.


23 posted on 03/27/2024 12:51:14 AM PDT by outofsalt (If history teaches us anything, it's that history rarely teaches anything.)
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To: jfd1776
This is a good article in that it asks the right questions, but the author seems to lack a basic understanding of how these decisions are made.

The benefits of a bridge that is used by 30,000+ vehicles every day are enormous. If the danger of ships striking the bridge is so severe that decisions about the bridge itself must be considered, then a more likely scenario for the residents of the Baltimore area would be to close or move the PORT instead.

This great scene from the movie "Margin Call" illustrates the benefits of a bridge perfectly:

Margin Call: "Do you know I built a bridge once?"

29 posted on 03/27/2024 3:55:19 AM PDT by Alberta's Child (If something in government doesn’t make sense, you can be sure it makes dollars.)
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To: jfd1776

Mercedes “think” remained glued to the notion, “Some engine leaks are to be expected.”

Some others think otherwise, and some of them devoted years of trials . . . working out the kinks, per vehicle.


30 posted on 03/27/2024 4:00:57 AM PDT by linMcHlp
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To: jfd1776

.


31 posted on 03/27/2024 4:03:05 AM PDT by sauropod (Ne supra crepidam.)
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To: jfd1776
Some good points but some in regards to risk are much incomplete. There is no life free of risk. In the consideration of risk is also that of moving trucks with hazardous materials through a crowded and congested urban setting such as Baltimore for example. A billion for a bridge or a billion for a thoroughfare, the risk of a bridge / ship collision or multiple highway accidents or even worse?

I will easily concede that bureaucrats and politicians are much less or not at all likely to evaluate alternatives in cost and risk objectively as private enterprise does in making investment decisions. It is very easy to throw all caution to the wind when you are spending OPM and making that to your advantage. Everybody in the public sector has a profound conflict of interest, no accountability to speak of and scarce background in things they preside over. The engineers they hire usually do consider many options and risk but they usually are not listened to or say little if they are in conflict with the politicians dreams if they want repeat business.

I have a cynicism about gooberment that comes from experience. Gooberment, politicians and bureaucrats seldom do anything right. "If the government were put in charge of the Sahara Desert in five years there would be a shortage of sand." I believe it. Owing to politicians gooberment is inherently flawed because of the kind of people politics attracts.

The bridge will be rebuilt but without the classic lines of the overhead through truss that was knocked down. In all likelihood it will be one of the cable stayed eyesores that are now economical and popular. What a shame. Hopefully this time they will not build such spindly angular hollow piers, space them further apart and in water so shallow a ship can't pass by them How about that for an idea? Maybe a 2,000 foot main span instead of 1,200 feet? The deepest water at the location is only about 50 feet and you can see the bottom at the last approach span piers. Much better protection structures could be built without much drama.

The state's estimate for the original structure was right at $60mm, the bids came in considerably higher with the ultimate cost of $110mm or so. I'd bet a lot that there were lots of conversations about just what parts of the original design were necessary. I'd bet those main span piers being angled and hollow and poorly protected was design-cost compromise. Upon first sight those piers struck me as odd and odder when I saw they are hollow reinforced concrete; downright spindly for such a large structure.

If there is concern about critical infrastructure bridges the one on I-20 and the old highway 80 bridge just upstream of it at Vicksburg is a lulu. I don't know how many times they have been hit by massive strings of barges at high water with high velocity. The old highway 80 bridge somewhat protects the main I-20 span. Somehow they have survived but it beats me just how that has been possible. There are NO pier protection cells upstream of either bridge on that one. Every hit on the bridge is a direct one. These are just one example of probably thousands of bridges across the nation and world at risk.

BTW, the Key bridge was hit by a ship shortly after the Sunshine Skyway bridge failure. This isn't the first time it has been hit but it is the last.

34 posted on 03/27/2024 5:31:31 AM PDT by Sequoyah101 (Procrastination is just a form of defiance)
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To: jfd1776

A tunnel would seem to definitely be an option.

I believe I895 right up the road goes under harbor.

I’d think a tunnel costs more to build, but Biden has already said the taxpayers will foot the bill.


35 posted on 03/27/2024 5:34:04 AM PDT by CodeJockey
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To: jfd1776

I know plenty of people who build in those flood and hurricane zones that have made big bank on damages paid for by the US Gov’t.

Yep, a very small price to pay for a fantastic return.


37 posted on 03/27/2024 7:02:19 AM PDT by Racketeer
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To: jfd1776
An earlier post pointed out that the bridge was originally intended to transport highly flammable or dangerous chemicals that our economy depends upon instead of sending them through the only other fast route, the Baltimore Harbor Tunnel.

Without understanding that purpose and the danger of cramming them through the Tunnel, this article is incompletely thought out.

38 posted on 03/27/2024 7:54:58 AM PDT by Albion Wilde (Either ‘the Deep State destroys America, or we destroy the Deep State.’ --Donald Trump)
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To: jfd1776
The author does a good job of pretending to be smarter than he really is, but he gives away the game right here:

We now know the risk is too great.

No, "we" don't know that ... and a professional blabbermouth in CHICAGO is just about the last person I'd ask to assess the viability of a bridge in BALTIMORE.

40 posted on 03/27/2024 8:06:00 AM PDT by NorthMountain (... the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed)
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