Posted on 08/17/2018 11:43:17 AM PDT by Sean_Anthony
That's good and it makes sense. But it still doesn't answer my question. As the head of the CIA I would guess that Brennan had "access" to pretty much everything, right? So even though he may now not have access, would the clearance he still retained allow him to access, somehow, previous information that he had seen and possibly stored on say, a hard drive, in a secure location?
And with all the leaks and free flow of classified information I find it hard to believe anyone who once had access cannot find a way around the "need to know" standard.
Is it unreasonable to believe that part of the reason Brennan et al are really upset is the lack of "heads up" info on the progress of ongoing investigations?
Yes I was trained on how to handle the information and I did not release any of the information. I talked about the PROCESS and used proper titles to explain the process. Clearance levels are well known and in the realm of public information.
Does this mean I still have my “secret” clearance from the Air Force, after all, I got out in 1968?
All the missile guidance systems I worked on are now obsolete (Falcon). Most of the aircraft that could launch the air-to-air missiles are obsolete (F101, F102, F105, F106, etc), as well.
They told us the only “secret” in the tech order (user manual) was the operating frequencies, none of which I remember from over 50 years ago.
They assembled several of us together just before we mustered out of the service, and explained that we were still under the laws covering what we knew as “secrets” still applied, just clearance to anything further, or new, was now classified, as we lost out clearance upon discharge.
Good comments, but Brennan could have signed a contract with any number of “beltway bandits” and this would have establisned his need to have his clearance remain active. Any one with a clearance can do this and then if a “need” to see classified material comes up in the context of this “consulting contract” the beltway bandit can apply to use the employee’s clearance and it becomes part of their job to maintain it. (In other words Brennan would not have to go back into government service to maintain the clearance if he took this route.)
Your comment about revocation makes a lot of sense, perhaps Brennan did have some consulting firm maintaining his clearance and the revocation would have severed this relationship.
No - the clearance is good for a period of time - I believe the time is dependent on the level, but I’d have to investigate that.
I had TS when I got out in ‘94 and was told it was good for 5 years from when it was last updated. Since that was about 9 months prior I’d have been good through early ‘99. I didn’t drill for a few years as I got reestablished stateside. Then I started drilling reserves and they redid it for just a Secret so it would have been from that time.
I never worked for anyone that required it in the civilian world so when I got out of the reserves I never followed up on it.
It may have been that clearances were handled differently in the 60s since the draft was in effect at the time, but I’d have no way of knowing.
I agree that revoking Brennan’s clearance was the right thing to do. It keeps him and his tell all nature out of the circles of power. Further, it cuts off an arm of the Dem’s influence into the halls of government.
Correct. A revoking wouldn’t be such a big deal if he just had the deactivation after leaving govt. Clearly there was some contractor relationship giving Brennan access.
Questions which will be answered soon:
- What contractor, and what access did he have?
- What did he do to cause the revoking?
Shethink13 wrote: “That’s good and it makes sense. But it still doesn’t answer my question. As the head of the CIA I would guess that Brennan had “access” to pretty much everything, right? So even though he may now not have access, would the clearance he still retained allow him to access, somehow, previous information that he had seen and possibly stored on say, a hard drive, in a secure location?”
A clearance doesn’t allow access. Only a Need to Know allows access and then only to those with the prerequisite clearance. Think of it as a safety deposit box. Takes two keys to look inside. Clearance and Need to Know.
Shethink13 wrote: “And with all the leaks and free flow of classified information I find it hard to believe anyone who once had access cannot find a way around the “need to know” standard.”
The idea behind keeping the clearance active for high level personnel was to streamline bringing them aboard to answer questions. For example, suppose something comes up and you would like a retired persons opinion, perhaps have they seen something similar? Rather than wait many months, you could bring them in, read them on, and ask your questions, and send them home.
Perhaps some kind of “Need to Know” could be justified but taking the clearance closes that door. Have to have both.
Shethink13 wrote: “Is it unreasonable to believe that part of the reason Brennan et al are really upset is the lack of “heads up” info on the progress of ongoing investigations?”
Brennan shouldn’t have on-going access to the investigations. The media is only using this as an excuse to be ‘upset’.
Bottom Line: No one has a right to a clearance. Totally within the chief executives power to remove. Even as a company commander, I could remove a persons clearance.
Shethink13
The most important thing to remember is that even if Brennan had a “Need to Know” and retained his clearance, he doesn’t have a “freedom of speech’ right to discuss classified information with anyone. Not even CNN or the ladies on The View.
One of the reasons the “clearance” lingers but the access expires is because it is expensive and time-consuming to perform a clearance. I had a Q clearance more than 25 years ago. It required several months to clear. However, if I had already passed a clearance within the previous few years (I don’t remember how many) I could have gotten my Q clearance much more quickly. So the “clearance” stays with you for a while, to save time and money. That is, the fact that I had been cleared, stayed with me for a while, but I did not retain my Q clearance after my employment finished. And, as many have said, clearance was always on a need to know.
OK so no access but still cleared to know. This means anyone of his swamp buddies could “access” and then tell him everything they found out because he has ”clearance”.
No. Suppose you and I both have the same clearance level. You have access to the nuke codes, I have access to the satellite codes. If I tell you and you do not report me, we both can go to jail .... because access is more specific.
So, to clarify, the clearance means, “this person can be trusted”, where access is, “We can tell him about THIS”. Is that about right?
Yep pretty much. Access is based on the role your in and also only on a Need to Know basis.
So you may have a TS clearance and be working in a planning department that is working on multiple projects. If you aren’t assigned to a specific project you aren’t provided access to it because you don’t have a Need to Know.
When I was doing op planning for my ship - I had to go to the destroyer squadron staff to get specific information because it wasn’t specific to my command. But I needed to know the info in order to plan the op properly. In some cases, they would reach out to my CO and say ‘ya know on this one I think we’re going to take op planning back’ on others they handed it over what I needed right away. Used to tick my CO off to no end - especially since we would see it when the op plan came out anyway.
Usually it had to do with ship movement timing that they were keeping under hard wrap.
Had to have the TS to enter the Wing CP. Other than current mission info, wasn't much else there that was so highly classified.
It took us one alert to work things out. I stayed in the Wing CP from start to finish, allowing the BC to run the show up top. It wasn't all that bad, I'd catch an hour or two of Z's during the night. The worst part was hearing complaints from the zoomies griping about having to work 12 hour shifts...lol.
Wing Cdr liked having me there. On my first tac eval, I spoke up when the Base Disaster Preparedness Officer overreacted to an NBC input. You should have seen the initial reaction when an Army 2nd LT spoke up in the Eagles Nest.
I was the NBC officer at my battery, so I knew my stuff. When the Wing Cdr approved my recommendation, I saw the NATO team chief nod his head in agreement. A short while later, I overheard the Wing Cdr say, "as long as I'm in command, I want that Army LT up here whenever there's an NBC input!" So it went for the next 18 months...good times.
And yes, my TS/NATO Cosmic reverted to Secret the day I left Germany.
that’s a cool story... BZ
Every time you change position to a position that does not require a clearance it should be rescinded. But because DC is a town where when you leave government service it is only temporary there was an unofficial policy that your clearance would not be pulled unless it was absolutely necessary.
That way they would not have to go though all the process when, not if but when, you were moved back into a position of power.
Woo-hoo! Someone else who understands the clearance deal....thanks!
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