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Myth: You Must Be Highly Trained for Successful Handgun use
Gun Watch ^ | 21 February, 2015 | Dean Weingarten

Posted on 02/23/2015 4:38:31 AM PST by marktwain


Gun people love training.  They revel in expertise.  They gush over the incredible feats that expert gun users, from Annie Oakley to Jerry Miculek, can accomplish.  Do not mistake me.  I approve of training.  Training is good.  I have trained a lot of hours... and days... and years... and decades.  I have trained military, police, and civilians.  But large numbers of people use handguns very successfully with little or no training.

A case in point occurred recently in Ohio.  From 10tv.com:

“She was armed and apparently fired multiple shots at him,” said Sgt. Dave Sicilia.

The woman’s son says he bought the gun for her a week ago to keep her safe now that she is living alone, but he never thought she would actually have to use it.

Police believe the suspect also broke into neighboring homes.

Nearby residents heard the shot.

"I got up and looked into my kids’ room and made sure they were all right,” said one person.

The burglary suspect was rushed to the hospital with serious injuries. He was pronounced dead shortly before 7:00 a.m.
While we cannot be sure that the armed homeowner had no training, the article does not mention any.  It is implied that the son never expected his mother to actually fire the firearm.   I have read numerous accounts of how people have not handled a gun for decades; then pick it up and use it effectively.   Guns are designed to be easily used and to point naturally at the target.

A large group of people who use guns effectively without training are criminals.  Most criminals are not allowed to legally handle guns, so using public ranges for training is difficult and dangerous for them.  Similarly, most criminals are inner city urban dwellers who do not have a back 40 or a hunting cabin in the mountains where they can practice all day and not be considered out of place.  They do not have an Uncle Sugar who provides ammunition for free.  Criminals mostly use guns for intimidation; it does not require training to be intimidating with a gun in your hand. 

The biggest reason that most people can use firearms effectively without training is simple.  In most defensive firearm uses, as in most criminal uses, the firearm is never fired.   I have seen estimates of guns used to stop crime and for self defense, without being fired, at ratios of 20 to 1 or more.  It is not an easy number to measure.

I recommend that people be trained, that they practice once a month, and that they take courses in self defense.  Once a basic level of firearms proficiency is met, from a purely practical standpoint, training time for self defense is better spent on situational awareness, avoidance techniques, and tactics.  

If you wish to reach a high level of shooting proficiency for hunting, self defense, competition, or war, then lots of time on the range will pay off.  However, most people who successfully defend themselves are not highly trained.


©2014 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice is included.
Link to Gun Watch


TOPICS: Government; Hobbies; Politics; Society
KEYWORDS: banglist; handguns; selfdefense; training
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To: marktwain

In all honesty, if you have the hand and eye coordination to use a blowdrier, and you had a squirt pistol as a kid, you can use one to your benefit in most cases.
The more training the better, but the shooting world shoots itself in the foot when they scoff at people who have little interest in making it a hobby.
We shouldn’t make people feel like using a pistol is like learning the Samurai sword and becoming a karate man.


21 posted on 02/23/2015 6:29:53 AM PST by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: beancounter13

While your are doing your one eye Annie Oakley aiming the bad guy just pumped out 5 rounds in your general direction. No thanks.


22 posted on 02/23/2015 6:51:07 AM PST by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va
...the bad guy just pumped out 5 rounds in your general direction.

And probably missed all of them. You think I'm going to be standing up-right and in the open?

Meanwhile, that's 5 fewer rounds he can fire at me when the going get rough!

23 posted on 02/23/2015 6:56:55 AM PST by beancounter13
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To: beancounter13

What if you don’t have the option of concealment? Are you going to Annie Oakley while the are throwing lead at you?


24 posted on 02/23/2015 7:08:57 AM PST by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Redbob
Shooting accurately and quickly under stress is obviously a much different thing than carefully squeezing off shots at paper targets.

One exercise the wife & I had during an introductory tactical training class was used to illustrate that.

After target shooting exercises, we then each had to draw, put 5 rounds into a torso target. Score was based on a combination of time and accuracy. Less accuracy added to the time. Best time wins of course.

Once people felt the pressure of having to get off 5 shots as fast as possible, accuracy went down dramatically. We each did it multiple times. I got the best time/score because after one horrible round, I settled down and concentrated on making it 70% accuracy / 30% speed rather than the other way around. A smooth draw is better than a fast draw.

Their point was an extra second that gets double the center mass hits is going to be the life saver. But it also brought home how even a little stress can have a significant effect on accuracy.

25 posted on 02/23/2015 7:09:23 AM PST by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s, you weren't really there....)
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To: beancounter13

You should practice both well aimed shots and combat shooting. Both are necessary skills.


26 posted on 02/23/2015 7:10:02 AM PST by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: baltimorepoet
I am and always have been a fair shot. Both my female offspring took to shooting like they were born with a gun in their hand. My oldest pissed off some guy at the range (so bad he packed up and left) when she was center ringing a 50 yard (yes, 50 yards) man size target with a S&W 6 inch barreled revolver - first shot low the next five all inside the ring. She was 16 at the time. I believe in natural talent and ability. My son who was Army Tier One can engage multiple targets in a fast walk and three tap four of them in about 7 seconds. He has fired over 500,000 rounds through pistols.
27 posted on 02/23/2015 7:25:31 AM PST by mad_as_he$$
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To: central_va

Maybe we just have to agree to disagree. I see no long-term advantage of a ‘spray and pray’ method of shooting.

It goes to the original question, “What happens when the ammo runs out?”

I do not see myself as Bat Masterson or Wyatt Earp out to quick draw myself to safety. I think that enables me to focus more on situational awareness and tactical positioning.

The bad guy can take me out in the first 20 seconds, but if I survive that, I think I will be just fine. Meanwhile, I do not present a threat for those 20 seconds (deep concealment) so I think that initial survival will be quite possible.

People have to know their limitations and be prepared to respond accordingly.


28 posted on 02/23/2015 7:33:27 AM PST by beancounter13
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To: King Moonracer

**I would expect a trained carpenter to hit the head of a nail 90% of the time,**

I’m good for 99%! If I can’t hit the iron nail I hit the thumb nail!


29 posted on 02/23/2015 7:53:22 AM PST by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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To: Nifster

The USAF gave me exactly 1/2 day of training. Four hours was good enough once a year.


30 posted on 02/23/2015 7:55:56 AM PST by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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To: beancounter13

***It goes to the original question, “What happens when the ammo runs out?”***

That was answered in the movie ZULU DAWN. “The bullets run out! The bloody spears don’t!”


31 posted on 02/23/2015 8:01:12 AM PST by Ruy Dias de Bivar
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To: marktwain

Articles like this one are dangerous and reckless, not giving the entire picture. Yes, most of the time if the attacker knows/sees the ‘prey’ is armed they stop. IOW youre relying on the attackers lack of backbone for protection. In all other cases youll need to shoot or flee. Most seem unaware they own each shot whether it goes into the attacker, a bystander or something not living. If you own it then youll have to give an account if you kill or wound a bystander. That and most criminals are terrible markkmen...perhaps only marginally better than someone unpracticed/trained or perhaps not. Here again youre relying on the attackers lack. It seems pretty sketchy that a defense strategy revolves around something someone else has/hasnt done....ie your safety is out of your control.

Then theres the idea of what youll do in an emergency situation. Theres a long list of studies/evidence showing that no strategy results in no affirmative action. Frankly, anyone carrying a weapon w/o training is lazy having the wrong mindset and endangering himself and those in the area.


32 posted on 02/23/2015 8:04:57 AM PST by 556x45
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To: marktwain

The original “point and click”.


33 posted on 02/23/2015 8:12:24 AM PST by WKUHilltopper (And yet...we continue to tolerate this crap...)
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To: beancounter13

If you are caught out in the open don’t try to place your shots. Just a little advice. Practice shooting with both eyes open and on the target. Get as much lead down range as fast as possible then find cover.


34 posted on 02/23/2015 8:13:00 AM PST by central_va (I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: beancounter13

For most people who are not familiar with firearms suppressive fire is generally the way to go. Remember the criminals are not usually there to risk their lives for something they believe in; just to steal, or rape in the case of women.
Suppressive fire hopefully will drive the criminal off and when he is retreating the victim can shoot them in the back, much safer.


35 posted on 02/23/2015 9:06:38 AM PST by 5th MEB (Progressives in the open; --- FIRE FOR EFFECT!!)
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To: beancounter13

dad taught me to hold my breath. I read somewhere to take a breath and let it slowly out as you squeeze the trigger...that works best for me...


36 posted on 02/23/2015 5:26:56 PM PST by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar

I know that most gun training courses are not lengthy. I was just being snarky because of the choice of words.

Most folks take a course maybe two. It is rare for someone to take lots and lots of courses....Those folks are the true pros or in competition


37 posted on 02/23/2015 6:14:54 PM PST by Nifster
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To: marktwain
The most important firearms training is not about mechanical skills, it's about the will and determination to use one at need. The rest is a matter of practice.

Nevertheless, a trained shooter is nearly always going to out-perform an untrained one. You don't want to have to be subvocalizing "Let's see, tap, rack, what was it now?" in the middle of a fight for your life.

38 posted on 02/23/2015 6:26:22 PM PST by Billthedrill
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To: marktwain; All
My husband and I are members of a topnotch shooting range in Charlotte. He goes three times a week for practice and we go together with another couple once or twice a week. I have really enjoyed target shooting and I'm working on my 3, 5 and 7 yard accuracy for a CCW class I'll be taking. My range gun is an H&K 9mm. Really like it but it's way too big for me to carry.

I'm not sure which gun I will carry but I'm leaning between a Sig P238 and a Ruger LC9S. I also tested a Kahr and didn't like it all. Any advice?

39 posted on 02/26/2015 8:11:56 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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To: ThunderSleeps

I agree. Though I sincerely hope and pray I NEVER have to shoot someone, I see a gun as the great “equalizer”. It won’t matter if my attacker outweighs me by a hundred pounds, having a gun gives me leverage to either stop the attack in its tracks or at least even the odds and have a way to protect myself.


40 posted on 02/26/2015 8:21:21 PM PST by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
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