Posted on 02/11/2015 8:40:02 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet
I’m a Southern girl. Born in the South, raised in the South, and have rarely lived anywhere BUT the South. I actually love the South. I’ll die in the South. Being a Southern girl, I have more than my share of right-wing friends, neighbors, and family members — and some of you have in recent years crossed the line into nut-jobbery.
The fact is — I love you guys and that will never change.
I’ll admit that I’m disappointed and disturbed to see intelligent and/or educated people who are willfully ignorant. But while it does change my opinion about you on some level, more than anything I’m embarrassed for you. It hurts me to see you post conspiracy theories on your Facebook timeline, only to have them debunked with a quick Snopes link. It hurts me to see you expressing unapologetic and blatant racism and ignorance. It absolutely tortures me to see you being on the wrong side of history on so many issues.
Although I’ll always love you guys, I have had to quit — for my own sanity and for the sake of our relationships — attempting to engage in intelligent conversation about politics and social issues with most of you. From now on, we’ll talk about the weather, recipes, our mutual friends, our children, our illnesses, thrift shop finds, and our old memories. I want to know what’s going on in your lives. What books are you reading? What home improvements are you planning? Hell, I’ll even follow you on Pinterest!
I very much appreciate those of you who can still have an intelligent conversation and listen to another point of view. Hopefully this small group of sane conservatives never changes.
Here is why I have to abandon attempts at intelligent conversation with most of you.
1. You support revisionist history.
When I was in a high school history class, I’ll never forget one thing our teacher taught us: what you read in history books isn’t always accurate. The example she used was history books in the Soviet Union, now known as Russia. She informed us, to my shock and horror, that the Soviets pretty much included what they liked in the history books and left out everything else. As a result, she said, there were generations of Russian students who were misinformed.
Oh we were dismayed, my classmates and I! Those poor little Russian kids who were being taught false history. But wait….you guys on the right are trying to do the same thing right here in the Good Old U.S.A.
Last year, I wrote an article about Texas’ plan to revise history and include Moses as a Founding Father. When I shared the article with an educated Texas adult and asked “is this OK with you,” his response was:
“Why teach our children at length regarding the horrors of slavery as we have eliminated that curse from our society? We don’t deny it occurred here or anywhere else in the world, but, why dwell on a segment of our past that has been corrected? I don’t think it is appropriate to drag our dirty laundry through our history lessons at length.”
Because it’s HISTORY. You don’t get to just rewrite history books if it’s unpleasant. What are you thinking? Shall we rewrite the Revolutionary War? “A minor disagreement with Great Britain.” How about the bombing of Pearl Harbor? “A spat with the Japanese.”
2. You cite Jesus as your reasoning for rejecting marriage equality.
Yet the Bible only mentions homosexuality six times. Six. Times. 6. This many:
So why is this one of the biggest issues on your agenda? Why are you putting so much energy and hate into an issue that clearly wasn’t one of God’s major concerns?
As Christians who are pro-family, why would you deny people the right to the sanctity of marriage? If marriage strengthens families, why would you not want everyone to have this, even if you disagree with their choice of mate?
YOU (we) have destroyed the sanctity of marriage. There is no possible way that gay marriage can do more harm to marriage than heterosexuals have done. Yet we seldom hear a sermon bemoaning the divorce rate or people living together before marriage. Why is that? Because the pews would be empty.
3. You use Biblical scriptute to excuse yourself from feeding the hungry.
There is nothing you do that makes me more disgusted with you than your abuse and misuse of 2 Thessalonians 3:10.
For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, If any will not work, neither let him eat. 2 Thessalonians 3:10
You are deliberately taking the scripture — ONE VERSE! — out of context when you use them to justify your own hatred of poor people. And again, you’re showing your ignorance.
From Liberal America reader Eric Susee: “2 Thessalonians 3:10. are NOT the words of Christ. They are the words of Paul of Tarsus, a man who never met Christ.”
Biblical scholars have pointed out that the author of 2 Thessalonians was referring to Christians who stopped working in anticipation of Christ’s return.
4. You lie when you say you value “freedom of religion.”
I had lunch with some conservatives a while back, and the topic of freedom of religion came up. They expressed concern at the “war on Christianity.” I cited a recent event that had occurred in which protesters interrupted the U.S. Senate’s first Hindu-led prayer. The response from my fellow diners? “Good.”
I don’t know how educated people can be so ignorant. Seriously. You can’t even see your own contradictions.
5. You claim God speaks to you and tells you to do things.
Over and over and over, we see right wing nutjobs in the news saying they’re doing this horrible thing or that horrible thing because God told them to. This is, to quote the Christian Courier, “a very convenient method of authenticating what you want to do.”
He does NOT do that.
God, having of old time spoken unto the fathers in the prophets by divers portions and in divers manners, hath at the end of these days spoken unto us in his Son. Hebrews 1:1
But conservatives believe these nuts. Here is what I think: not only should sensible conservatives not believe these nuts, you need to start speaking out against them. These are the false prophets that the Bible warns us about, in my humble opinion. Most of you lack the courage to take a stand against these idiots even when you know they’re nuts.
6. You question my faith.
“Christian Left is an oxymoron.”
Oh my, I’ve heard that so much from the right, and believe it or not, I often hear it from my “friends.” First of all, your questioning of my faith genuinely means very little to me. What it does is destroy my opinion of you; I now view you as self-righteous hypocrites.
Recently, I found out that a woman from my church questioned her teen son for spending time here at my home with my children. I believe her words were “why would you want to be around someone so liberal.” I’ve never had a conversation with this lady. We’ve never even made eye contact. But alas, her comment (and more that she said) has forced me to now see her differently.
Keep questioning my faith, though, my people, because you can be sure I’m questioning yours. One thing I won’t do, however, is accuse you of not being a believer as you do me. What I will suggest to you is that my faith may be stronger than yours. I’ve educated myself, dared to question all things, and STILL believe. Most of you are too afraid to even learn. It may, after all, test your faith.
I’ll pray for you! :)
7. You care more about your guns than you do about children.
After the Sandy Hook massacre, and following other similar tragedies, I asked many of you if you loved your guns more than you do children. I made the statement of “I’d give up my gun forever if it would bring back even one of those children.”
I asked you if you’d do the same. You admitted that you would not.
8. You get excited about people dying.
You really, really like to see death. And not just to terrorists. You love the death penalty. You love war. You love seeing kids like Trayvon Martin being shot. They deserve it, you say. But his murderer has shown — again and again — since his acquittal that he is a dangerous person.
9. You assume that everyone who needs help are losers and parasites who refuse to work.
Approximately 47 million people receive food stamps, and most of them are children or the elderly, in addition to people who are employed. The numbers, from a 2012 USDA report: •45 percent of SNAP recipients are under 18 years of age •Nine percent are age 60 or older •More than 40 percent live in households with earnings
10. You weren’t concerned about uninsured people– including me.
Most of you know that when I made the decision to become self-employed that I would be giving up my employer subsidized health insurance. I’m 47 years old, and like most people my age, have at one time or another had preexisting conditions that would cause insurance companies to deny me a private policy.
I didn’t want a free ride. I was eager to pay for my own insurance. Obamacare opened that door for me and millions of other hard-working Americans and disallows insurance companies from rejecting millions of Americans who were previously rejected. But without even knowing fully what the Affordable Care Act is, you chose the path of ignorance. You didn’t care.
11. The Creation Museum — that is all.
You think this is OK. It’s not. These people just make stuff up. Do you really think kangaroos floated from Africa to Australia on rafts? Why are you condoning this ignorance?
12. You’re liberal in youth, yet grow conservative in age.
I call this the Dead Peter Syndrome in men and/or the Formerly Hot Syndrome in women.
A couple of years ago, a man confronted me on Facebook about my liberalism. I knew him when I was growing up; he was a friend of my parents and his children were my playmates. He called me a stupid, misguided, amoral, liberal. Yes, those were his words. I had one question for him:
“When I was a little girl, didn’t I sit on your lap while you smoked a joint and drank beer?”
I’m afraid I burned the bridge of that friendship — and good riddance.
Similarly, many women who embraced the sexual revolution are now taking a stance against women’s rights and suggesting that I’m killing babies with my IUD.
You don’t get to live it up as a young person and then try to take a moral high ground when you get old and aren’t interested in living anymore.
13. You don’t want people who disagree with you to vote.
Oh, Gerrymandering, you ugly devil, you. But do we question why this is so common and seldom questioned by people on the right? It’s because you, my conservative voter loved ones, agree with it. You think it’s perfectly acceptable (and necessary) to suppress the vote. It’s for the “good of the nation.”
I once heard someone tell his wife to not inform her Democratic friend how and where to vote. “She’ll cancel out your vote.”
There you have it.
14. Some of your best friends are black. Or Mexican.
A conservative I know professes that “my best friend is black” and balked when I called him and his wife racist. Why did I call him racist? Because my little girl — at that time about 12 — went to a movie with one of her African American friends and his mother. The conservative and his wife were “very concerned” about me allowing my little girl to consort with “blacks.” But oh, no, they’re not racist, are they?
I don’t care how many black or Hispanic friends you have. If you think that mentality is OK, then yes, you’re racist.
15. You scream about undocumented immigrant children at the border, but you hire Mexicans to do your dirty work.
I live in Texas. Duh! Every single upper-middle-class or wealthy person I know has at one time hired cheap labor to do their menial tasks like home repairs, yard work, housekeeping, and childcare. They actually seek out Hispanic people because they know that they do good work and that they’ll work for cheap.
16. You insist on calling undocumented immigrants “illegals” and “aliens.”
They are human beings. They are undocumented immigrants. Many of them are children. It reallyyyyy makes me furious to see you deliberately depersonalizing these human beings who are doing nothing but seeking the American Dream that you are so proud of.
And you do this on purpose. You know what you’re doing. You’re proud of your very unethical and un-Christian attitude towards these human beings.
17. You don’t mind using force against “lesser” groups to get what you want.
Case in point, protesting outside of abortion clinics.
Or protesting at the funerals of gay people. And yeah, I know that is Westboro Baptist Church and not you, but if you refuse to speak out against them, then you’re a part of the problem.
18. You love war, death, and destruction.
And why do you love war, death, and destruction? Because ‘Murica. Because you think this somehow makes us superior. We may be militarily superior, but we are ethically inferior.
Even when confronted with the lies, now confirmed officially, that got us into the Iraq war, you don’t care. You like for America to be the world’s largest terrorist organization and the world’s most formidable bully.
19. Speaking of war, you think draft dodging is OK and military service is for the little people.
Why doesn’t it bother you that Dick Cheney et al are draft dodgers? Or that Mitt Romney has an entire baseball team of sons and not one of them served in the military? Or that none of the current generation of Bush children have served in the military. Let me tell you in one sentence, as was told to me personally by a wealthy draft dodger:
“Wouldn’t you get out of it if you could?”
Dying for your country is such a noble cause — if you’re not one of the elite. Right?
20. You claim to care about the Constitution, but in reality you don’t.
Oh yes, you scream “CONSTITUTION” at the top of your lungs, but when idiotic Sen. Ted Cruz (R-Texas) recently tried to strip the Constitution of the 5th and 6th Amendments, where were you? Where was your outrage?
You love the parts of the Constitution that please you personally — NOT the entire Constitution.
21. It’s impossible for you to see your privilege.
If you were born into a family and a place that allowed you to thrive, you’re blessed and fortunate. This isn’t the norm. A lot of success and stability depends on the structure that we have during our formative years. The vast majority of young Americans have not had your advantages and I can’t seem to make you understand that. I’ve stopped trying.
22. You don’t care about children.
You care about fetuses. Once those fetuses begin to breath outside the womb, your concern is gone if they’re born into a poor family that needs help.
Or how about poor children who are in school? Most of you want to do away with free and reduced lunches, for God’s sake. And let’s not even talk about free breakfasts for kids. What is wrong with you people??? There is no better investment that we can make as a nation than in the early childhood health of our children.
23. You’re greedy and miserable.
You spend more time bemoaning what is being taken from you that you do in being thankful that you have enough to share.
24. You think our religion is the only one.
I’m a Christian — a proud follower of the most amazing man I’ve ever studied. Most of what is good about me comes from the teachings of Jesus. I love my religion and my Holy Book. I use the Words in Red as a compass. But who am I to look at other people who feel exactly the same way about their own religions and judge them?
We’re all on this earth doing the best we can, making the best decisions that we can.
And we’re all taking our best guess. The evidence for and against their religion is no different than the evidence for and against ours.
25. You are lazy and you refuse to read.
I provide sources for you that will debunk most of your BS, or at least help you to see it a little differently. You refuse to read it. You stick to Fox News, World Net Daily, etc…You refuse to ever entertain another point of view.
I have a conservative friend who I adore. He and his wife grew up with me. I think he’s awesome because he did something amazing for me: he recorded Rachel Maddow for a week and watched her show. Did he agree? Meh, not really. But him being willing to even listen to another viewpoint won him favor in my book. Thank you, Michael.
26. Your misfortune is God’s blessing.
When something bad happens to you, you sanctimoniously think it’s God testing you and making you stronger. When something bad happens to me (or gay people or atheists or etc…), you think it’s God punishing them.
Really?
27. “Everyone has their lot in life.”
Except you, of course. Well, no….you do have a lot. Your lot is to have every privilege and entitlement and make sure your children have the same.
28. You think you’re the only one working and paying taxes.
“My tax dollars….” Here’s a clue: you’re not the only one paying taxes. Liberals pay taxes, too. Just how far do you think your $2,000 a year in income taxes goes? Or your $10,000, or even your $50,000? No matter how wealthy you are and how much income tax you pay — and most of those complaining aren’t paying that much — you’re actually probably paying more for wars (that you love) than for food stamps for children in poverty.
So anyhow….tell me, my loves, what are you cooking for dinner tonight?
All of this said, let me say this: I’m very grateful and appreciative of my sane conservative friends who can actually participate in an intelligent and respectful discussion. To name just a few (and if I leave anyone out, I’m sorry — these are just the ones I interact with the most on these issues): Michael, Laura K., Whitney, Laura M., and my pastor, Brent.
Thank you, my dear ones, for being sane. For understanding that things aren’t always black and white. And for disagreeing with me without belittling my very existence. And for not rubbing midterm losses in my face. And for never once calling me stupid or amoral for being a liberal.
Click here to buy Tiff a clue.
Unfortunately I know someone just like her....
I do agree with her on one thing and that is I will not waste another breath or another second of my life 'debating' anything with any of these people.
Dear 2ndDiv,
1. You support revisionist history.
History is history, good and bad, clean and dirty. Learn it all, and you are empowered for a better decisions and wariness.
2. You cite Jesus as your reasoning for rejecting marriage equality.
I use historical content, social impacts, the lack of contribution to the societal fabric, i.e., not contributing to the population to continue the race, and personal experiences in this matter.
3. You use Biblical scriptute to excuse yourself from feeding the hungry.
Somebody at the bus station asked for money ... I’d counter with, “are ya hungry?” If that person kept up with me, i’d buy them lunch, even if it put me at a little less.
4. You lie when you say you value “freedom of religion.”
I saw that moment on TV. I wore the uniform of my country, killed Communists, so that guy could do that, without all the hoot and hollers! I wonder what those same idiots thought when military veterans’ families sued the V.A., because the ‘freedom of religion’, meant yeah, but not that one.
5. You claim God speaks to you and tells you to do things.
Not me, dear, not me.
6. You question my faith.
I don’t. You’re a vet! You earned the right to believe what and how, worship where and how and when, as you please, and it ain’t none a my bizness what you do, to whom you do, or how you do, whether that is one of The Abrahamic Faiths, the spaghetti god. Chthulhu, or the Church of Elvis - which is located in Portland, Oregon, or HooDoo! (Blessed Be.)
7. You care more about your guns than you do about children
1. As to children, I never got that far myself, but i do think that they should ALL have that wonderful, magickal, mystical time of being a child, and growing up with no family members to give them nightmares (and you might know what I mean), safe and sound, with caring parents.
2. As to guns, it is the responsibility of THE PARENTS, to train the kids right, and to instill the correct and proper respect towards firearms, NOT ‘The State’, NOT the neighbors, NOT the preachers, and darn well NOT the elected so-and-so’s.
8. You get excited about people dying.
I’ve seen a public execution in Thailand. I’ve seen Otis Redding’s aircraft being pulled out of the lake. I’ve been in firefights. I do look at ending a very bad criminal’s life as a means of reciprocation for their actions. It is not something to hold a party over, for it can never recover the life or lives of those who were killed. Death is not a trivial thing, for it will come to all of us, in our determined moment, so why be a dick about it?
9. You assume that everyone who needs help are losers and parasites who refuse to work.
Not I, dear. I have worked, and been out of work, and down to my last dollar at more than one time. I’ve had to go get that ‘charity pays my utility bill’ check a few times. I’ve been on food stamps. I’ve been on unemployment. i’ve been one of the many who have been laId off, in various company positions, in my life. I was one of those laid off, after Hurricane Katrina destroyed the V.A. hospital in New Orleans, when they restructured.
10. You weren’t concerned about uninsured people– including me.
All i have is my V.A. coverage.
11. The Creation Museum — that is all.
I agree.
12. You’re liberal in youth, yet grow conservative in age.
Winston Churchill said the same thing!
13. You don’t want people who disagree with you to vote.
Again, something else that I defended, while in my country’s uniform! I can HOPE that folks vote, ‘for the good of the nation’, as ye each define that.
14. Some of your best friends are black. Or Mexican.
I donj’t use that, because I don’t do that.
15. You scream about undocumented immigrant children at the border, but you hire Mexicans to do your dirty work.
I live in an apartment complex. If the management does, yes, by my paying the rent money, i did that.
16. You insist on calling undocumented immigrants “illegals” and “aliens.”
I’m a Nativist, and have been since the ‘70’s. No apology there.
17. You don’t mind using force against “lesser” groups to get what you want.
I take no part, nor lend support to either of these actions.
18. You love war, death, and destruction.
The lies that got us involved in the Vietnam War were no different. Not excused, just not different. In my time, we had a thing called The Soviet Union, and it was a manifold chess game with them, called The Cold War, which I participated in. You are here, able to say what you say, because of that.
19. Speaking of war, you think draft dodging is OK and military service is for the little people.
My dear, I enlisted, with my parent’s signatures, in the years when the draft was the law, my father having a military career spanning 24 years in different services, and my draft number was 3.
20. You claim to care about the Constitution, but in reality you don’t.
All or nothing. no less, no more.
21. It’s impossible for you to see your privilege.
What ‘privilege’??? I was raised a GI brat! i didnt have much till i graduated high school, and went in the military. I didnt learn to drive, till I was 24, since my folks could not afford a car, so i did not have that ‘gotta git my own wheels’ idea. Oh, btw, I’m a half-breed, so what privilege?
23. You’re greedy and miserable.
How can i be miserable??? I’m alive!! Vietnam, cancer, congestive heart failure, diabetes, bad leg circulation, a woman who cares about me, my mind is still ‘present’ and not on vacation, and i can, when i wish, put a few cogitive words together! I live on a fixed income. I owe no debts. I pay my bills on time, and have food in the fridge. Might not be a steak, but it’s food, and the pans to cook it myself. I watch the sun rise with my coffee and my rocker. I feed the birds, and at times take a number of what and how many. I listen on radio to my favorite morning show, read one of many novels, write a few articles, and enjoy.
24. You think our religion is the only one.
I don’t. But that is me., not y’all.
‘Nuff said.
I was just getting over some sort of sinus headache, but then I tried to read through her justifications.
She epitomizes why I rarely talk politics, religion or life theory with people very much these days, especially not with women.
Oh my poor aching head...where did I leave that bottle of Advil?
I can’t believe I actually read that entire thing. I wouldn’t want her talking to me either.
Bless her heart. :-)
Thanks for the, uh, clarification. I can’t see Obama as a Christian, no matter how he defends his philosophy.
People have redefined the christian philosophy freely. How many of sects of Christianity do we have now?
She sounds like a true believer alright, in all that made up crap
what about the creation museum? She accused others of questioning her faith and she goes on to diss other peoples faith.
Amazing hypocrisy
Poor thing.
5.56mm
I .. w a s .. b e i n g .. S A R C A S T I C !
I’ve felt since I first heard of the idea of this ‘creation museum’ that it was not, a good idea, and not something that folks should be putting their hard-earned money towards.
Besides, America already has A museum. It’s called The Smithsonian Museum.
It is not a matter of ‘faith’. It is an idea, to separate folks from their money, towards the idiotic cause of attempting to debunk science, and put us back in the days before Copernicus.
You're going to catch a lot of FLAK for that.
Stand firm, because you're RIGHT.
OK, I read the whining little girl’s screed, she has the depth of thought of a three year old. There are two points I would like to address:
#14 My beloved hubbie was born in Mexico, has been a proud citizen of the USA for almost 40 years now, and my beloved son-in-law is black. So I can say that I have Mexican and black friends. What little Tiffany doesn’t understand is that most conservatives do what Martin Luther King wanted. We judge by content of character, not color of skin.
#24 This one proves to me that she is a ‘churcharian’, not a Christian. Jesus is far more than an ‘amazing man’. He is the Son of God. She says she loves her religion, but does not say Jesus has the Lordship of her life. Wonder what she does with the scripture that says NO ONE comes to the Father except thru Jesus? She equates her belief to ‘her best guess’ on which religion is real and says there is evidence for and against the other religions which is ‘no different than the evidence for and against ours’
She doesn’t have a basic understanding of what it is to be a Christian. I doubt her pastor has an easy road trying to teach her what it actually means, that is, if he is actually a Christian and not also a ‘liberal’.
The rest of this screed is so poorly thought out, poorly documented, that it can only be taken seriously because there are so very many of these ignorant people, not because there is any value in the article.
LOL
there are a thousand museums in this country and if they want to spend their own money on one, that is okay
GeronL wrote:
“there are a thousand museums in this country and if they want to spend their own money on one, that is okay”
Since the original story, which is what i responded to, was about a for-christians, paid-for-by-christians, museum of a retort to modern science, do me the favor of defining ‘their’.
My very shy father who was in his early 70s with a colostomy was traveling up to visit us. He was accosted in a rest stop mens room.
He was so upset, angry and embarrassed he nearly cried.
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