[Gen.Blather]

“Nobody WANTS a civil war. But some people are starting to think about the circumstances under which it might happen. Where do we draw the line? “

I don’t think there’s any reason a state can’t leave the union. I always thought the “reason” for the Civil War was the firing on Ft. Sumter. But, if that hadn’t happened, and there was apparently no real reason for it, then I’m certain Lincoln would have come up with his own version of the Tonkin Gulf incident. I think it was Lincoln who wanted the war. But, think about it, if the flyover states left the union, then the union of takers only could not survive. But the union would have most, if not all, of the nukes. They’d use them too. Would Lee or Grant not have used nukes to bring a quicker end to the war? They’d have been remiss in their duties if they hadn’t. If there were a war, it would kill half the population, mostly due to starvation and disease.

[cornfedcowboy]

The difficult part is deciding who the enemy is.

[central_va]

But the union would have most, if not all, of the nukes. They’d use them too. Would Lee or Grant not have used nukes to bring a quicker end to the war?

Did we nuke Vietnam. No. Did we nuke Korea. No. What makes you think FedGov™ would ever use nukes in a civil war? Franky the "union" wouldn't lay waste to the real estate it wants back....

[Michael.SF.]

Would Lee or Grant not have used nukes to bring a quicker end to the war?

Not sure about those two, but Sherman would have.

[Paladin2]

"Where do we draw the line? "

The line should/a been drawn well short of the incandescent bulb ban.

[2ndDivisionVet]

What Good Can a Handgun Do Against An Army?
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-backroom/2312894/posts

[johngrace]

I have a Civil War Almanac by day of every day of just before and after Civil War. The southern states were attacking Federal Installations long before Sumter. In think Sumter was the last straw. I found this shocking compared to what I was taught in School. Just amazing.

[BroJoeK]

Gen.Blather: "I don’t think there’s any reason a state can’t leave the union."

Our Founders Original Intent was that secession should be by mutual consent (meaning Congress approves), or by some "usurpation", "injury" or "oppression" amounting to the same thing.

For examples of what, exactly, they meant by those terms, we have only to review their Declaration of Independence:

• "He has plundered our seas, ravaged our coasts, burnt our towns, and destroyed the lives of our people."

• "he has waged cruel war against human nature itself, violating it’s most sacred rights of life & liberty in the persons of a distant people who never offended him, captivating & carrying them into slavery in another hemisphere, or to incur miserable death in their transportation thither." -- proposed by Jefferson, later deleted.

• "In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury.
  A Prince, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people."

Gen.Blather: "I always thought the 'reason' for the Civil War was the firing on Ft. Sumter.
But, if that hadn’t happened, and there was apparently no real reason for it, then I’m certain Lincoln would have come up with his own version of the Tonkin Gulf incident."

"No real reason"?
The Confederacy demanded Sumter's surrender, and when it's Union commander refused, Confederates assaulted and seized the fort.
As for Lincoln's inventing some reason to start a war, that was hardly necessary -- the Confederacy was itching and eager to, in Davis' inaugural words (February 18, 1861), "appeal to arms".
For examples: secessionists lost no time seizing dozens of major Federal properties, and even supporting rebellion in non-Confederate states.
On May 6, 1861 the Confederacy formally declared war on the United States.
Compare: the first Confederate soldier to die directly in battle was June 10, 1861, at Big Bethel.

Gen.Blather: "I think it was Lincoln who wanted the war."

Meanwhile, Lincoln's first inaugural address (March 4) said:

"In your hands, my dissatisfied fellow countrymen, and not in mine, is the momentous issue of civil war.
The government will not assail you.
You can have no conflict without being yourselves the aggressors.
You have no oath registered in Heaven to destroy the government, while I shall have the most solemn one to 'preserve, protect, and defend it.' "