Posted on 10/26/2009 4:01:28 PM PDT by Ryde
Freepers: I occasionally work as an adjunct (I'm retired) for a local college. This college has just initiated a policy where they require their students to work for 75 hours for a third-party for free. That is, they require that a student give 75 hours of work to a non-profit, a charity, and so forth. The college will provide the list of organizations from which a student can choose. This strikes me as being pretty shaky legally and ethically. We seem to be providing a pool of unpaid labor for groups in our community--regardless of whether they want to work for free (which I am certainly opposed to.) The idea is supposedly to teach the students the value of serving others. Does any one out there have any comments or advice on this?
They have a list from which they must choose and it must be an organization. Helping, say, someone who is impaired would not count.
Yes, I would guess that almost all organizations will be religious or left. Our partners so far have been the usual suspects—many of them undertake quasi-political actions.
I just checked—advisors will have nothing to say about which organizations the students choose. In fact, it appears to me that a member of the president’s family may be the one who does the choosing.
If you don’t like it, drop the class. I did, back when my professor wanted me to log in “community service” hours. I had better things to do, like work (for personal profit[gasp!]).
Though I could imagine learning, in some sense of the word, while doing whatever it is volunteers do, I didn’t see what it had to do with liberal education.
They have been doing it for years under internship programs.
Is it a public or private college?
“people agreeing to give up their rights as part of a contract”
They give up certain liberties and privileges, but never their rights. Remember, rights are “unalienable,” which means they cannot be sacrificed, transferred, or seperated in any way. For all rights that are alienable, I suggest we stop calling them “rights,” for clarity’s sake.
Simply remind them that YOU paid THEM for an education and if THYE want YOU to do work to obtain a degree then THEY need to pay YOU for those hours worked.
Just because you’re in a school doesn’t mean that asnine rules and regulations take effect.
You are their boss!
“Should be illegal unless it’s one of the tiny handful of US colleges that do not accept any federal financial aid”
I don’t at all understand why it should be illegal if federal money is involved. Whatever the case may be, public or private, colleges are still voluntary. You are perfectly free not to take the class.
Which are another of the great rackets of higher education. It used to be you got a job, got paid, and learned something.
Now, you get an "internship", don't get paid, and learn something. But, here's the kicker. At some universities the company who "hires" the intern pays a fee to the university, and the student pays tuition while he is "interning". Now isn't that a deal for the university, they get paid while you work!
What groups are on the list?
“You are their boss!”
Yes, in a sense, and I “remind” them of my control over my own pocketbook by dropping classes. The problem is, there isn’t very much of a free market in education, even if you go the private route. The best most people can do is attend or not attend, shirk their duties if they do attend, or generally grumble and whine and hurt class morale until Teach’ gives up.
Private—though heavily financed with public funds.
Actually, I am a lowly adjunct who needs the money to help with my retirement. I do not have a leg to stand on . . . .
It is not a class—it is a graduation requirement. It is not even slightly related to a class. I am told it used to be, but no more. It now looks like straight work for no pay.
“It is not a class—it is a graduation requirement. It is not even slightly related to a class”
Okay, that is a higher bar, and much less justifiable. But it’s still voluntary. If you don’t like it, transfer schools. People do it all the time.
College is voluntary. If you don’t want to take on a service project, you don’t have to go.
“Rights cannot be given up as part of a contract.”
The last time you bought a piece of real estate or personal property, did the previous owner give up his rights to that property or can he still do with it as he pleases?
Of course a lot depends on how you define a rights, so: how do you define a right?
A lot also depends on how you define “give up a right”.
For a start, how about freedom of speech vs. the various military blogs that were shut down on orders from above. And it wasn’t because they were giving away secrets.
>>Rights cannot be given up as part of a contract. Where did you get that idea?<<
Living in the real world. You ever hear of non-disclosure clauses? Theoretically a violation of the 1st. All company email can be monitored — 5th. All company property is searchable (5th). Drug testing — 5th and 4th.
You must not work for a living to understand these simple ideas.
I guess what you don’t understand is that the Rights are between the Government and the individual, not any private party (such as a college or business) and the individual.
And as far as employees of the State, having been one, I guarantee you that there is a prohibition against supporting any individual politician nor cause by things like buttons, posters and what have you — again, you give up your 1st Amendment rights as part of your employment contract.
The real world: live it, love it.
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