Hawaii Five UH - Oh!!!

Natural Born Citizen ^ | 9/21/2009 | patlin

[patlin]

I will be assisting one of my readers in filing litigation in Hawaii state circuit court pursuant to her ongoing request for public information denied by Hawaii officials. (Readers of my blog will recognize her as MissTickly aka TerriK.)

Correspondence sent to TerriK by Hawaii officials indicates that President Obama’s vital records have been amended and official records pertaining thereto are maintained by the state of Hawaii.

[rolling_stone]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/chat/2308045/posts?page=1

[El Gato]

Why wouldn’t Ann Soetoro renounce Barry’s US citizenship?

Because under US law, a parent cannot renounce the citizenship of a child. The child can't do it for themselves either, generally until they are 18.

Kinda blows your whole theory doesn't it.

Yes it's true that Lolo may have declared Barry to be adopted, and he may have been adopted, either in Hawaii, or Indonesia. Either way, it would not change Barry's citizenship under US law, Nor would any naturalization in Indonesia, in spite of Indonesian law. See State Department 7 FAM 1290

Of course what would be interesting if Barack Obama's legal name is really Barry Soetoro or if Barry himself had it changed back to Barack sometime within the last few years, especially if it was shortly before June 2007.

But as I see it there are only two ways BHO is not an NBC, one of which we know is true. One, he born outside the US, two, he was not born of two US citizens. Either is sufficient. Being outside the US is easier for most to understand, yet some even deny that that makes him not an NBC "since his mother was a citizen"(We know that is not enough to even be a citizen at all, let alone a natural born one). The double condition, parents citizens and born under US sovereignty, seems excessive to some, although it makes perfectly good sense if you put yourself in the position of the framers in 1787, who were worried primarily about foreign influence in the office of commander in chief.

[El Gato]

that sounds like a life-saver to me, otherwise Fukino might be able to maintain she was misquoted by the journalist who wrote the Honolulu Advertiser article:

The statement is also posted on the Health Department's website

STATEMENT BY HEALTH DIRECTOR CHIYOME FUKINO, M.D.

[mlo]

"...The double condition, parents citizens and born under US sovereignty, seems excessive to some, although it makes perfectly good sense if you put yourself in the position of the framers in 1787, who were worried primarily about foreign influence in the office of commander in chief."

It doesn't really matter what it "seems" or what we think made "good sense". It's not the law. It's not what "natural born citizen" means. The citizenship of the parents has no bearing.

[HereInTheHeartland]

Book em Dan o....

[RegulatorCountry]

The citizenship of the parents has no bearing.

Oh, really? Tell me, then, how it is, that a simple, legal term of art in the Constitution came to mean born of citizen parents, if born outside the United States, as was John McCain?

It didn't, the bizarre presumption of our Senate in resolving such with SR 511 notwithstanding.

And yet, somehow, this same, simple, legal term of art somehow does a backflip for domestic births, and then has no bearing?

It doesn't, despite tortured interpretations invoking the 14th Amendment, which had and has absolutely nothing to do with eligibility requirements for election to the office of President.

[HereInTheHeartland]

http://www.mjq.net/fiveo/sounds/bookemdanno.wav

[patlin]

Hold on there mlo, you shouldn't speak without actually studying history:

Justice Joseph Story was born in Marblehead, Ma in 1779. He graduated 2nd in his class from Harvard University in 1798. From there, Joseph went on to read law under Samuel Sewell, a then congressman and later chief justice of Ma. Joseph later went on to read law under Samuel Pitman in Salem, Ma and with no formal secondary law education; Joseph was admitted to the bar 3 years later in 1801. He would later go on to serve in the Ma House of Representatives and also represent Ma in the US congress. Joseph was nominated to the Supreme Court by President James Madison and he took his oath of office in November of 1811 at the age of 32 and he still remains the youngest ever to serve on the Supreme Court.

It was in reading his works of Volume 3, Section 1472-73 of ‘The Founders Constitution: Commentaries on the Constitution’ originally published in 1833 and now provided online by none other than the University of Chicago (how fitting), Story writes of the qualifications of those who wish to attain election into the executive branch as laid out in A2 S1 C5 of the constitution.

§ 1472. Considering the nature of the duties, the extent of the information, and the solid wisdom and experience required in the executive department, no one can reasonably doubt the propriety of some qualification of age. That, which has been selected, is the middle age of life, by which period the character and talents of individuals are generally known, and fully developed; and opportunities have usually been afforded for public service, and for experience in the public councils. The faculties of the mind, if they have not then attained to their highest maturity, are in full vigor, and hastening towards their ripest state. The judgment, acting upon large materials, has, by that time, attained a solid cast; and the principles, which form the character, and the integrity, which gives lustre to the virtues of life, must then, if ever, have acquired public confidence and approbation.

§ 1473. It is indispensable, too, that the president should be a natural born citizen of the United States; or a citizen at the adoption of the constitution, and for fourteen years before his election. This permission of a naturalized citizen to become president is an exception from the great fundamental policy of all governments, to exclude foreign influence from their executive councils and duties. It was doubtless introduced (for it has now become by lapse of time merely nominal, and will soon become wholly extinct) out of respect to those distinguished revolutionary patriots, who were born in a foreign land, and yet had entitled themselves to high honors in their adopted country. A positive exclusion of them from the office would have been unjust to their merits, and painful to their sensibilities. But the general propriety of the exclusion of foreigners, in common cases, will scarcely be doubted by any sound statesman. It cuts off all chances for ambitious foreigners, who might otherwise be intriguing for the office; and interposes a barrier against those corrupt interferences of foreign governments in executive elections, which have inflicted the most serious evils upon the elective monarchies of Europe. http://constitutionallyspeaking.wordpress.com/2009/08/21/constitutional-nuclear-bomb-blasts-obamas-eligibilty-to-smithereens/

[bitt]

CHECK IT OUT

[potlatch]

Thank you bitt, I keep missing you but it’s my bedtime, lol.

Another thread you will like;

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2345143/posts

[Alamo-Girl]

Thanks for the ping!

[Vendome]

See now I have been wondering if it was possible for a demand of evidence to support Hawaii's claim.

I have also wondered “If” Obama requested the form and where is the proof said form was issued and can Obama genuine COLB that can be verified.

I was not aware of 92F-12(15).

The mere fact that Obama's name does not show up in the spell checker proves he is a fraud! Delicious! The worm turns.

Can't wait for the drum roll to the theme song.

[ntnychik]

Thanks for the ping, bitt. I can’t shake the feeling that if 0’s documents are ever revealed, they’ll look exactly like he wants them to.

[Vendome]

that is a great story. Where did it come from?

[BP2]

In my research regarding the Hawaiian Vital Statistics office, they are renown for their sloppy record keeping. I offer the following from the book "In the Name of Hawaiians":

SO, I pose the following:

Let's say that an investigation uncovers that at one point in the 60s or 70s, the ORIGINAL birth certificate was lost due to internal clerical error. IOW, it's the Health Dept's fault, not Obama's.

Health Dept policy likely would allow for subsequent affidavits from his mother and perhaps his grandmother to meet required an evidentiary paper trail. They're not going to arbitrarily yank away his (or anyone's) US citizenship due to their own error - they'll use their own procedural manual (Vital Statistics, Registration & Records, Chapter 117, Administrative Rules) to fix the problem.

How would that affect the eligibility suits (from a prima facie standpoint)?

Although I am 99 percent sure Obama was NOT born in Hawaii, I'm trying to think ahead of potential obstacles they'd throw up to offer "plausible deniability" - and I see something like this as a likely result. I think that like nearly all of the other corruption surrounding him, there may be a "reasonable" and "innocent" explanation that doesn't implicate him to allow him a means to wiggle away.

[Vendome]

Your view is totally true. If the State Department, DOD or other interests require more information, you can request it.

Further, the COLB process is used for same day requests and walk-ins. If a person wants a vital record with complete information they have a right to that record. It is a record of their identity.

If a BC is amended, most of the time, the information that results in an amended record can be accessed.

[pissant]

Arse; hole in ground -—— they are supposed to be different

[Vendome]

That information is outdated and it depends on what the information is and the circumstances.

For Instance, I was adopted about the same time as Barry O.. There is no dispute in the adoption, the whole process was agreed to and there is no reason to keep the information private to protect anyone.

The same in Barry O.’s case. There was no dispute, the record is of vital interest to several concerned parties and the parties that could object are deceased.

Further, there is no reason to keep the record sealed, in opposition to lawful request, as there is no anonymous aspect to the parties. In other words, the parents are known or believed to be known and the circumstances protect no one, nor injure anyone should they continue as a sealed record or unsealed record.

I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night so I am pretty close to being an Attorney, thought not really.

[chris37]

Excellent work to stay ahead.

However, he won’t be able to slip away, and they won’t be able to offer plausible deniability if someone else has already managed to get their hands on the real mccoy.

http://axj.puntoforo.com/viewtopic.php?t=2536&sid=8903cffcea191d07d67781a24664d53b

[Vendome]

I am just excited to learn(maybe) that his BC may be amended. There will be a treasure trove of info in that file.

The best part is politically, he cannot survive slapping up a fraudulent document or one designed to deceive.

If his BC is amended he will be gone by Christmas, sadly. I wanted to go to the mat with him until next Christmas.

The range of delicious possibilities regarding the many incompetent politicians and their minions would make this the most historical time in the history of the US.