Thomas Jefferson Says Forget About Barack's Birth Certificate

My apologies, the article I read stated her as someone he met in Africa.

Wow, so this is when he was supposed to be married to Stanley if he met her in Boston, right?

“It’s a silly argument. Fraud vitiates all contracts, and fraud vitiates elections. Is he saying he’s in favor of allowing all cases of election fraud to go unexamined, simply because the people voted and one candidate won, so let’s move on?”

I am with you. It’s a silly argument. The correct argument is this:
Obama was born in Honolulu on Aug 4th, 1961, and is therefore a natural born citizen eligible to serve as President. There has been sufficient proof of this fact by considering:
- Honolulu paper birth announcement that week
- the CoLB that was presented and which was by all reasonable conclusions a valid document from state of Hawaii
- Hawaii state officials vouching for his birth records and birth certificate on file with the state
http://www.thedenverchannel.com/politics/17866037/detail.html

Yes you are correct in that if Sr and Ann were married, Sr began a new relationship with Ruth while still married to Ann. Sr himself, admitted to a friend that he was a serial polygamist, but one woman at a time. At this time I am still trying to find out if “...a Kenyan student split, leaving behind two pregnant blondes” written by Frank Marshall Davis was Sr.

ROTFLAO! Or the dog ate it. Or aliens grabbed it and even now one is using it, on some distant planet. Come on...

"While Jefferson was a true renassiance man, he was a freaking hypocrite and a arrogant snob. I take anything Jefferson said with a grain of salt"

And with what -- after your two earthshaking months here -- should we take your exalted pronouncements?

Come back when you have proved yourself to be 1/10th of the patriot that Jefferson was...

Not so fast, WOSG. His father had rights over him, as did Great Britain. He was a British subject at birth. No natural born there — but that’s what the Supreme Court needs to rule on.

1) A newspaper birth announcement is not evidence of anything, because anyone could have called that announcement in.

2) The CoLB that Obama has presented is not a Certificate of Live Birth. It is a Certification of Live Birth, which does not certify the birth location. The Certificate of Live Birth would have the name and signature of the doctor who assisted in the birth. That’s the document Obama is spending 100s of thousands of dollars to keep hidden.

A Certification of Live Birth can be provided for any person born outside of Hawai’i within, IIRC, one year. Hawai’i doesn’t even recognize a Certification of Live Birth as evidence of Hawaiian birth for homestead applications.

Again, no evidence of a Hawai’i birth.

3) Here’s what Fukino said: “’Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures,’” Fukino said.

She did not say that Obama was born in Hawai’i.

So, you’re 0 for 3. What else you got?

Keep in mind that there are the following types of citizens: - natural born - native born - naturalized John McCain is not native born, but he is natural born. Obama is native born but not natural born, at least according to one interpretation of the laws -- and there are no laws that define natural born citizen. One is forced to take a stand on its meaning and then let the Supreme Court rule whether that meaning is constitutional or not. That's what we're trying to do. But the cases so far haven't been quite the right cases, or presented in quite the right way, to get the Court to take a look at the issue. Not yet, that is. This brief ought to bring some cheer to those on the same side of this issue as Donofrio: http://wthrockmorton.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/joyce_anderson-amicus-final.pdf Excellent!

Was Ann a blonde?

Keep in mind that there are the following types of citizens:

natural born
native born
naturalized

John McCain is not native born, but he is natural born. Obama is native born but not natural born, at least according to one interpretation of the laws -- and there are no laws that define natural born citizen.

One is forced to take a stand on its meaning and then let the Supreme Court rule whether that meaning is constitutional or not. That's what we're trying to do. But the cases so far haven't been quite the right cases, or presented in quite the right way, to get the Court to take a look at the issue. Not yet, that is.

This brief ought to bring some cheer to those on the same side of this issue as Donofrio:

http://wthrockmorton.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/joyce_anderson-amicus-final.pdf Excellent!

Thomas Jefferson traveled to France, lived in Paris to ob-serve the Revolution, which he had been thrilled to witness—from afar. When he saw the mayhem and wanton bloodshed, the people even killing their own (Robespierre, Danton)in total bloodlust, he changed his mind, was greatly saddened. He had seen mob rule up close and it wasn’t pretty.

No Ann was a brunette. I wonder if when she was in WA state rumors reached her about Sr being with someone else which caused the split up.(if they were even a long term item which I doubt)

Do we need race riots now?

The aggrieved, whoever they will be, can choose not to riot.

You said — “Don’t pretend to know what I watch, or what I think. But if you want to talk about movies, you sound like you’ve watched Charlton Heston split the Red Sea one too many times.”

The following (what you said, below) is what sounds like a fiction novel or the Friday night movies... LOL...

Most American patriots (including me) will keep their powder dry and their rhetoric hot until our adversaries screw up and overreach, and do something stupid.

Then watch all Hell break loose. William Ayers will be hiding under his Marxist bed, whimpering for 0bambi to save him, and crapping his pants.

That’s the “fiction” that I’m talking about. No such thing is going to happen. There’s going to be no powder, wet or dry, fired at anyone in the government — except for the *crazies*. Perhaps you are one of them, I don’t know...

—

As far as the movie that you refer to with Charleton Heston in it..., well, I wouldn’t use his name — but rather Moses and I would take the Bible exactly at its word and know that God did that very thing. Now..., if you think that’s fiction (instead of the stuff you wrote up above) then you’re just like Obama in his denigrating the Bible and those who believe exactly what God said He did...

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And then you said — “The Constitution is being shredded even as I type these words, and what exactly do you propose that Americans do to “have our culture go back to our Creator God”, pray perhaps? You don’t think we’ve been praying, are praying and continuing to pray? Got any other bright ideas?”

The Constitution is not being adhered to, but it’s not been shredded at this point in time. I don’t think it will be, either.

And yes, prayer is one of the *main* answers to what is going on, and that pertains to Christians, very specifically. And then, what Christians need to do is to tell more about the saving grace of Jesus Christ, so that we can have more Christians in this society, in order to vote in a moral government (and officials) that will adhere to the Word of God and also carry that over to the Constitution.

Short of getting more Christians in this society, at this rate the Christians are going to be losing ground, no matter what. And that may very well be the “sign of the times” in that God did say that Satan would prevail over the ones who were saved, as that was what Satan was granted for that period of time when he takes over this world, just before Jesus Christ returns again to set up His Kingdom on this earth, and rule over the nations of the world (the ones that we have in existence right now).

So, it’s either we get more Christians in this society and we turn back to God, as a result of that — or else — we’re going to continue to lose ground and we’re going to be continually losing these battles — but then again — if that’s the case, then that means it’s close the time that Jesus Christ comes again and that’s what must happen.

You’re not going to have the United States “turn around” from its continual abandonment of God in the public sphere and demanding that Christians stay out of public life and politics — unless we (as a country) have that repentance that God has always demanded of nations in order to spare them the coming judgement that God brings when people abandon Him and turn to evil.

No amount of court cases or political maneuvering is going to make up for what is need in the heart — namely someone that is saved by the grace of Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. Anything else that is tried to “make up” for the country “going to hell” is simply not going to work, unless people (as a society) turn back to God. That’s what it’s going to take, primarily.

===== ===== =====

And then you said — “You’re preaching to the choir. You’re not saying anything that American Christians haven’t been doing, haven’t been believing for years. But it sure sounds good when you post it as if it were your own latter day revelation, now doesn’t it?”

It’s not preaching to the choir when I see many on Free Republic who have told me that Christianity doesn’t belong in politics and that it’s this kind of idea that is causing harm to the Republicans. All you have to do is go back to several of my prior posts and see where I’ve had those conversations with FReepers, so no..., it’s not preaching to the choir — it’s more like preaching to a bunch of atheists, agnostic and church-bench-warmers and cultists (although there is a goodly amount of Christians here; I just don’t know them all).

The way things are going and from what I see inside the conservative movement in many of them wanting to abandon the very *basis* for conservatism (which from my perspective is *Christianity*) — things are not going well in this country...

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You also said — “You don’t think our revolutionary ancestors were appealing to that Creator God at Lexington and Concord?”

Oh, I definitely think that they were, for the most part (perhaps not everyone...).

—

And then — “I’m all for beseeching the Almighty to have mercy on our Nation (not that I can think of many reasons why He ought to at this point), and I pray for my Country every damn day and night, because I witnessed first hand what happened when our illustrious courts evicted God from America’s classrooms, and -what- filled that vacuum and the resulting flood of licentiousness, wickedness, situational ‘ethics’, narcotics-for-all and amorality-as-it-fits.

What you appear to be saying is that Americans should just sit patiently, keep praying, don’t do anything rash, don’t let anyone provoke us to violence, and “everything will be alright”. “

WELL..., in answer to that, the Christian should do their duty, as a citizen, in any case. That’s not taking up arms for an armed revolution, though. That’s not called for here. That wouldn’t be a righteous war as it was for the Revolutionary War. That’s not what God is calling us to, right here and now.

And also, the Christian should do his duty to God, in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ, in the hopes that enough of the people in the nation will “turn from their wicked ways” and recognize God, once again, as the founding fathers did, in their work in forming this nation.

Short of that happening — we’re all sunk and the time for Jesus Christ to come back is sooner than we thought...

===== ===== =====

And finally — “If that advice had been taken in 1776, Prime Minister 0bama would be preparing his Throne Speech for the Queen to deliver next month. And Sam Adams would be laughing at you.”

—

You first follow your duty as a Christian, and then what is needed by your country. If it’s a righteous war, then follow as God leads. And that’s what the founding fathers did, along with the others who fought with them.

We’re not in a situation in which God would sanction a righteous war in this instance. We have the mechanisms that were put into place at the founding of our country and from what has followed since then — to follow through with. We have not exhausted all that — and I don’t think we will ever reach that point where we will consider all that exhausted and have to resort to an armed revolution against our own country (i.e., the government). We may have to fight wars with other enemies (of a shooting kind) but not with our own government...

"...I did read that he supported Russia’s invasion of Georgia."

I had not heard that. Hard to believe that it's true, but I take back my suggestion if it is.

Barack Obama won, fair and square in the minds of the electorate.

Obama won with the most concentrated advertising blitzkrieg in the history of history. In addition to the money he himself spent, the American media basically gave him a free commercial all the way to Election Day.

Now, there's a reason companies advertise on TeeVee and in the papers. It works, and it is for the most part deception.

So, the electorate was deceived. So what, say most people.

Well, to use a sports analogy - Great touchdown! Oops! Called back on a technicality! Oh, too bad!

Should have told your people not to push in the zone! ;-)

“But those that voted for him did not have the slightest inkling that he may not be eligible when they cast their ballot”

Mr. Huston should consider this fact, a little more.

First of all, you need to learn some HTML coding, because with your constant 'You saids', plus the fact that you appear to love to use 10 words when one will do, you're gobbling up JimRob's bandwidth like 'Rats gobble up federal funding knowing GWB can't find his damn veto pen.

Now, we can get started with your latest verbose missive.

You said — “Don’t pretend to know what I watch, or what I think. But if you want to talk about movies, you sound like you’ve watched Charlton Heston split the Red Sea one too many times.”
The following (what you said, below) is what sounds like a fiction novel or the Friday night movies... LOL...
Most American patriots (including me) will keep their powder dry and their rhetoric hot until our adversaries screw up and overreach, and do something stupid. Then watch all Hell break loose. William Ayers will be hiding under his Marxist bed, whimpering for 0bambi to save him, and crapping his pants.
That’s the “fiction” that I’m talking about. No such thing is going to happen. There’s going to be no powder, wet or dry, fired at anyone in the government — except for the *crazies*. Perhaps you are one of them, I don’t know...

You would classify our Founding Fathers as 'crazies' then, because they dared to resist with force, a tyrannical regime hellbound and determined to oppress the colonists (in their day, that regime was based in London). I'm not at all inciting or even suggesting that anyone should commit a violent act against the government or any lawful entity. However IF (in a hypothetical situation of course), ANY government entity (lawful or unlawful) initiates violence against the peaceful and law abiding population they are sworn to SERVE (not oppress) then the universal law of self defense not only can be applied, it MUST be applied. Nothing more, and nothing less. That is one reason why the Second Amendment exists, and that is why it has been fought for tooth and nail over the 2+ centuries that our Republic has existed because our ancestors KNEW that the only way we would be able to keep our freedoms was by having the tools guaranteed by our Constitution, and that means GUNS. Not for aggression, not for oppression, for DEFENSE of our liberties.

—

As far as the movie that you refer to with Charleton Heston in it..., well, I wouldn’t use his name — but rather Moses and I would take the Bible exactly at its word and know that God did that very thing. Now..., if you think that’s fiction (instead of the stuff you wrote up above) then you’re just like Obama in his denigrating the Bible and those who believe exactly what God said He did...

Don't be putting words in my mouth or reading things into my posts that aren't there. The fact is, what Charlton Heston portrayed in his role of Moses in one of the best movies of all time was NOT an exact portrayal of events, it was a DRAMATIZATION of Biblical events. Did Moses split the Red Sea? Of course he did. Did Moses look like Charlton Heston, and did Pharaoh Rameses II actually look like Yul Brynner? Here's your clue Sparky, "probably not". The fact is, NOBODY living today was around in that day to know exactly how the events played out EXCEPT for what is described in the Bible, and the Bible (accurate as it is) simply does not provide the microscopic details that you (or anyone) may wish to impart to it.

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And then you said — “The Constitution is being shredded even as I type these words, and what exactly do you propose that Americans do to “have our culture go back to our Creator God”, pray perhaps? You don’t think we’ve been praying, are praying and continuing to pray? Got any other bright ideas?”
The Constitution is not being adhered to, but it’s not been shredded at this point in time. I don’t think it will be, either.

And what do you base that naive belief on?

And yes, prayer is one of the *main* answers to what is going on, and that pertains to Christians, very specifically. And then, what Christians need to do is to tell more about the saving grace of Jesus Christ, so that we can have more Christians in this society, in order to vote in a moral government (and officials) that will adhere to the Word of God and also carry that over to the Constitution.

Great idea, I heartily endorse it. Now if you'll just step this way to the Time Tunnel, we'll just travel back to about 1960 or so, and see if we can undo all of this godless atheism, secular humanism, and all of the other poisons that have been injected into what was once a Christian-based society. Here is the sad reality that you better wake up and face: our United States is no longer a Christian nation, and while I am a firm believer in the words contained in 2nd Chronicles 7:14, I have seen less and less of God's people 'humbling themselves', let alone 'seeking God's Face', and there has been NO 'turning from our wicked ways', all you have to do is pick up a newspaper and you ought to be able to see that. The die is cast, and while Spiritually commendable, what you are suggesting is unfortunately too little, and too late.

Short of getting more Christians in this society, at this rate the Christians are going to be losing ground, no matter what. And that may very well be the “sign of the times” in that God did say that Satan would prevail over the ones who were saved, as that was what Satan was granted for that period of time when he takes over this world, just before Jesus Christ returns again to set up His Kingdom on this earth, and rule over the nations of the world (the ones that we have in existence right now).

We as Christians are the minority and that's not going to change prior to the Second Coming. Nice to see you acknowledging the reality of the situation, it's refreshing.

So, it’s either we get more Christians in this society and we turn back to God, as a result of that — or else — we’re going to continue to lose ground and we’re going to be continually losing these battles — but then again — if that’s the case, then that means it’s close the time that Jesus Christ comes again and that’s what must happen.

As Hank Williams Sr said in his famous song, you "saw the Light", it's going to happen and sooner than anyone thinks.

You’re not going to have the United States “turn around” from its continual abandonment of God in the public sphere and demanding that Christians stay out of public life and politics — unless we (as a country) have that repentance that God has always demanded of nations in order to spare them the coming judgement that God brings when people abandon Him and turn to evil.

Do you see any signs that America is "turning around"?

Nope, I don't either.

No amount of court cases or political maneuvering is going to make up for what is need in the heart — namely someone that is saved by the grace of Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. Anything else that is tried to “make up” for the country “going to hell” is simply not going to work, unless people (as a society) turn back to God. That’s what it’s going to take, primarily.

So using your logic, nobody should do anything except pray, is that right? Berg, Donofrio, et al, they're all wasting their time. We should just roll over and let the Obamunists do as they will, because it "is simply not going to work". Hey, at least nobody can call you a quitter, because you're not even willing to TRY.

===== ===== =====

And then you said — “You’re preaching to the choir. You’re not saying anything that American Christians haven’t been doing, haven’t been believing for years. But it sure sounds good when you post it as if it were your own latter day revelation, now doesn’t it?”
It’s not preaching to the choir when I see many on Free Republic who have told me that Christianity doesn’t belong in politics and that it’s this kind of idea that is causing harm to the Republicans.

Those are just RINOs, trolls and know-nothings. You state your position, preach the Gospel, tell them they need Jesus, and move along. If they reject it, it's on them, not you.

All you have to do is go back to several of my prior posts and see where I’ve had those conversations with FReepers, so no..., it’s not preaching to the choir — it’s more like preaching to a bunch of atheists, agnostic and church-bench-warmers and cultists (although there is a goodly amount of Christians here; I just don’t know them all).

Sounds like you've been getting frustrated with those non-believers, here's an idea: put your ideas on your FR home page, and just refer 'em to it either in posts, or your tagline. I think you're getting yourself agitated for no good reason.

The way things are going and from what I see inside the conservative movement in many of them wanting to abandon the very *basis* for conservatism (which from my perspective is *Christianity*) — things are not going well in this country...

Welllll imagine that? And beyond just praying about it, what are you willing to do about it? Talk is cheap. Don't ask what I'm doing about it, I won't talk about it and it has nothing to do with FR posting guidelines, in fact what I had to do, I've already done. I'm prepared and continuing to prepare, and *yes* that includes prayer. Read into that whatever you wish.

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You also said — “You don’t think our revolutionary ancestors were appealing to that Creator God at Lexington and Concord?”
Oh, I definitely think that they were, for the most part (perhaps not everyone...).

It had to be everyone or nearly everyone, otherwise the Almighty would not have 'blessed their undertaking', I believe that.

—

And then — “I’m all for beseeching the Almighty to have mercy on our Nation (not that I can think of many reasons why He ought to at this point), and I pray for my Country every damn day and night, because I witnessed first hand what happened when our illustrious courts evicted God from America’s classrooms, and -what- filled that vacuum and the resulting flood of licentiousness, wickedness, situational ‘ethics’, narcotics-for-all and amorality-as-it-fits.
What you appear to be saying is that Americans should just sit patiently, keep praying, don’t do anything rash, don’t let anyone provoke us to violence, and “everything will be alright”. “
WELL..., in answer to that, the Christian should do their duty, as a citizen, in any case. That’s not taking up arms for an armed revolution, though. That’s not called for here. That wouldn’t be a righteous war as it was for the Revolutionary War.

The arms are already out there, courtesy of the Second Amendment, which is the last bulwark of defense for our Republic. If the new regime shows it's true colors and begins to oppress We The People of the United States, it will be the new tyranny that will provoke and initiate hostilities. And our individual and collective defense against such oppression will most certainly be justified, and it will be Righteous.

That’s not what God is calling us to, right here and now.

You don't know that.

And also, the Christian should do his duty to God, in spreading the Gospel of Jesus Christ, in the hopes that enough of the people in the nation will “turn from their wicked ways” and recognize God, once again, as the founding fathers did, in their work in forming this nation.

I say 'Praise the Lord, and Pass the Ammunition'.

Short of that happening — we’re all sunk and the time for Jesus Christ to come back is sooner than we thought...

Once again, take a look around. I suggest Daniel 5:28, read that over and see what it suggests to you.

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And finally — “If that advice had been taken in 1776, Prime Minister 0bama would be preparing his Throne Speech for the Queen to deliver next month. And Sam Adams would be laughing at you.”
—
You first follow your duty as a Christian, and then what is needed by your country. If it’s a righteous war, then follow as God leads. And that’s what the founding fathers did, along with the others who fought with them.

So far, so good. You're getting it.

We’re not in a situation in which God would sanction a righteous war in this instance. We have the mechanisms that were put into place at the founding of our country and from what has followed since then — to follow through with. We have not exhausted all that — and I don’t think we will ever reach that point where we will consider all that exhausted and have to resort to an armed revolution against our own country (i.e., the government). We may have to fight wars with other enemies (of a shooting kind) but not with our own government...

Again, you have no way of knowing that. You're assigning your fondest hopes and aspirations the legitimacy of being established as proven fact, and they are not facts, they are nothing but wishes, and as the saying goes "if wishes were horses, beggars would ride".

The fact is, Americans aren't going to have to resort to an 'armed revolution', they're going to have it forced upon them by a Communistic regime that is now controlling the levers of what used to be a government 'of the People, by the People, and for the People'.

You just haven't seen it yet.

Mark my words, you will.

It really doesn’t help our cause to get him disqualfied by a technicality. He needs to be disqualified by a broadside... If we persist trying to get him disqualified by a real but relatively small technicality, we miss the opportunity to keep hammering away at his policies which will truly destroy our country.

The proscriptions of our Constitution are NOT mere "technicalities".

Yes, we need to fight Obama on political grounds, but our Constitution is being VIOLATED by this crypto-Marxist thug.

To continue to insist that Americans abandon their support and defense of our Constitution is completely indefensible, and nearly treason.

Give it up, folks.

No. Leave us if you must, but stop trying to make the rest of us stand down from this issue. It's our right and duty to insist that our Constitution be followed.

You follow whatever duty seems best for you.