Posted on 05/10/2005 5:09:45 PM PDT by dukeman
Libs trying to understand NASCAR is both funny and illuminating. Here's a recent offering from DU:
Pockets (135 posts)
Original message
Could someone please explain NASCAR to me?
Is NASCAR a rich man's sport, and if so, why are the masses so anxious to fund their hobby?
I'm not much into any sport but NASCAR seems like the macho counterpart of equestrian atheletics... never having watched either I may be way off base.
ohio_liberal
Do you mean "rich man's sport" as in the competitors, or the spectators?
Pockets (135 posts)
Response to Reply #1
10. The competitors
I know racing takes skill, but to start out in it you have to be or know rich people, right?
ohio_liberal (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #10
23. Well, they start out usually at around 7-10 years of age
driving go carts, then they move into modifieds or open wheel like midgets, etc. The families are the ones who get them started, then if they have talent a sponsor will usually pick them up along the way. It's tough to get into the top 3 NASCAR series. Not only do they have to have skill, but they also have to be marketable. It's similar for all of the top motorsports in this country. NASCAR is just the top dog right now.
They don't get rich until they get to the top of the sport. I can only think of one (Tim Richmond back in the 80's) who had a fabulously wealthy family.
Pockets (135 posts)
Response to Reply #23
34. Okay
If you say so... I just assumed the worst.
But I was lucky to get a car to drive to work with when I was a teenager, much less would they buy me a car to race in.
losdiablosgato (116 posts)
Response to Reply #10
43. In the beginning of Nascar it was a bunch of moonshiner
racing their cars they used to run shine with. It grew into a sport where you could soup up a old beater and race around a dirt track. It is now the fastest growing sport in the US.
supernova (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
2. Actually a poor man's sub for equistrian events
is racing.
W
mopaul (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
3. turn left, accelerate, spit
not much to it. the machines do all the work, the driver just sits there and occassionally gets splattered into the wall.
Atman (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #3
18. In all fairness, Mopaul
Edited on Tue May-10-05 02:57 PM by Atman
(I am not in any way getting behind NASCAR, just making an observation about your comment)...
On a trip back from Ohio last fall, we hit the interstate and immediately were fortunate enough to get behind a Corvette and some other basic stock fast car...a Chrysler something. I was driving a new vehicle, and became pretty familiar with the way it handled on the ten-hour drive from Connecticut to the Ohio border. Anyway, these two cars were in front of me, started hauling ass. I dropped back to let them play minesweeper, but I stayed with them. Three hours at between 95-100 mph before the Corvette pulled off, and I gotta tell you, I had to stop...driving even at that moderate speed (compared to NASCAR anyway) for so long required such total concentration and attention to the vehicle that I was exhausted...just from sitting there and letting "the machine do the work." So, while I understand the point you're trying to make, I don't agree. It IS a lot of work to control a vehicle traveling 180 mph, inches from another car travelling 180 mph. It doesn't make it any more of a sport, in my mind, nor the drivers athlete, but, as W might say..."It's hard work."
LisaM (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #18
27. No offense to you, but
where the **** were the police while this was going on?
Tierra_y_Libertad (1000+ posts) Response to Original message
4. Watching machinery go around in circles doesn't require brains.
Therefore, it is a big attraction for those who find thinking requires too much exertion.
ZombyWoof (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #4
21. As a NASCAR fan with an IQ above 140
I thank you.
Pockets (135 posts) Response to Reply #21
24. Not trying to offend...
But I'm just analyzing it from a sociological angle. You can't compete in NASCAR unless you have money. So you pay these rich people by spectating?
ZombyWoof (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #24
32. You didn't offend me
All pro sports is soaking in money, so I am not disputing that. I was addressing the intelligence comment.
My late grandfather raced sprint cars on a midwest circuit in the 40's and 50's. He patented a carburetor which was later lifted by a major car manufacturer before he could renew the patent. He was a master mechanic and something of an eccentric genius.
It's kind of a ritual on DU for the south/NASCAR or related topics to get bashed once in a while, and for some of us to jump in and counter the stereotypes and poor judgment.
Pockets (135 posts)
Response to Reply #32
41. I realize NASCAR can = Democrat
But what would Democrats be if we weren't allowed to criticize each other?
The intelligence angle is interesting. I actually feel sorry for genius level people, having to cope with everyone around them being on a lower level than them.
Maybe NASCAR has a lot of ultra dumb and ultra-smart people involved in it... maybe... it's just not something people of average intellect enjoy.
ZombyWoof (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #41
51. The coping part comes in here...
It is much more trying when progressives - whom I usually regard as having above-average intelligence - go to great lengths to criticize what they don't understand, on ANY topic.
Purrfessor (376 posts)
Response to Reply #41
56. You admit to not knowing much about NASCAR. So how is it that you know
"it's just not something people of average intellect enjoy."
It seems odd to me that of the 200,000 plus people who attend the Daytone 500, they're all either ultra dumb or ultra smart, or some combination of the two.
pie (377 posts)
Response to Reply #21
30. Please explain your interest in NASCAR
I have never understood it.
ZombyWoof (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #30
37. Partly physics, partly adrenaline
It requires some degree of empathy for the driver and his endurance and strategy, and knowing what kind of control driving at 180+ mph requires. If it were merely "making left turns", no one would care much for it. In regards to physics, I mean in relation to air drag, proper turn ratios, track angles, slopes, etc. It requires a degree of concentration few sports match. It is far better in person too, where there is a visceral feel for the engine roars and speeds - which television in its infinite passivity cannot bring to the viewer.
This is an issue in which the dictum "to each their own" certainly applies. But if there wasn't more to it than meets the eye, I wouldn't like it either.
warrens (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
5. Lotta left turns
ThorsHammer (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
6. I don't mind it as entertainment, but don't consider it a sport
It definitely started with a lower-middle class, Southern fan base, but is now moving toward a more national, lower-middle-upper class base. They will still have the cheap seats, but now also have the expensive skyboxes for the sponsors and other rich folks. They are making a concerted effort to move into "blue" areas as well. Corporations have moved into it big time. It's pretty easy to see their effect, from ads on the car itself, to overall sponsorship (NexTel), to event sponsorship (XYZ Co's 500). I think they are trying to position it as an up and coming "sport" with national appeal. Their schedule also helps some, as football doesn't start for months and baseball really doesn't matter until the Fall anyway.
dbonds (363 posts)
Response to Original message
8. It is an event people go to in hopes of seeing a really good wreck.
And if they are lucky someone may get hurt or die. A sick sport. They only one you can go to and have a good chance of seeing real carnage.
Purrfessor (376 posts)
Response to Reply #8
65. I witnessed first-hand what was probably the most horribly gruesome wreck in the history of Daytona. I was about 12 at the time and it happened right in front of me. It seemed to unfold in slow motion. And I promise you that I didn't enjoy it. I felt completely sick to my stomach for days afterwards.
I don't know of anyone who enjoys seeing people die.
FSogol (100 posts)
Response to Original message
9. Its a contradiction
1. Everyone thinks they are a good driver. Bubba knows he cannot hit a curve ball, but he knows how to drive.
2. They think this sport got its start from moon shining - essentially outrunning cops and Federal agents. So the sport is an Us vs. Them game. Nevermind the fact that it is the most corporately controlled sport on the face of the planet.
3. Supporting your driver means buying all the sponsor's stuff. Who doesn't love going down to the local Wall-Mart and shopping?
4. Wrecks. Whether they admit it or not, they are watching for death. Listen to the crowd cheer when contact is made. Its a throw back to Gladiators fighting in the Coliseum.
Atman (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
11. Drive fast, round and round. Hope for crashes (but no one hurt).
There you go. Glad I could help.
izzybeans (680 posts)
Response to Original message
12. Cars go Zoom and Bang. Round and Round and Round.
Weee! The same reason people stand and stare at fireworks.
"That Daryl Waltrip shore' zooms around there fast. Didn't he?"
Horses jump and run and often in circles, so your not far off.
"I say dear boy, That Stallion circumnavigated the course with a gentleman's grace."
mopaul (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #12
16. maybe i'll be there when dale jr. bites the big one
hoooo doggies
undeterred (99 posts)
Response to Original message
15. Maybe speed is next to godliness?
I haven't a clue why someone would want to drive that fast or watch other people who do. No clue.
Pockets (135 posts)
Response to Reply #15
17. ???
What about the fact that thousands people who are financially average to poor spend their hard earned dollars to make rich and spoiled people richer.
It's like paying to watch rich people ski the Alps...
undeterred (99 posts)
Response to Reply #17
25. Its like paying to watch any professional sport these days
Its too expensive for the average person to go to a live sporting event more than once in a while.
Aren't the "Nascar dads" supposed to include a lot of fundie Bush supporters?
Pockets (135 posts)
Response to Reply #25
28. Not trying to make this political
I'm sure a lot of them are Democrats too.
But NASCAR is unlike other pro sports, in that other pro sports reward athletes for developing exceptional skills that take a lifetime of practice to acquire. To compete in NASCAR requires... a sugar daddy.
Purrfessor (376 posts)
Response to Reply #28
42. Perhaps you ought to review Jeff Gordon's history.....
and the path he and his family traveled to get him where he is today.
MindPilot (679 posts)
Response to Reply #15
50. I go fast because I have a destination.
Do you? Are you one of those slow people sauntering down the aisle in the store or blocking my way in the hallway at work? Going one mile below the speed limit on the freeway because you've deluded youself into thinking it's safe?
I watch other people go fast because there are so many times I can't.
leftofthedial (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
19. vrooom, turn left, turn left
vroom, vroom, turn left, turn left, vroom
repeat ad nauseum
except for the left turns, it's the perfect freeper pastime--run in circles as fast as you can.
NRaleighLiberal (331 posts)
Response to Original message
20. NASCAR - lots of dumb smoking and drinking....
men with mullets, lots of scantily clad bimbos rotting their brains and wasting their hearing, breathing pollution, watching cars go round and round.....perhaps this was the extent of *'s education. No thanks!!!!! Life is too short to waste it on such bull****.
QC (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #20
59. Were you clutching a jeweled snuffbox when you posted that?
Purrfessor (376 posts)
Response to Reply #22
39. It's a safe bet that not one of these people criticizing NASCAR
has ever sat at Daytona and watched these drivers race past three wide, within inches of each other, at speeds in excess of 190MPH. Otherwise they might have a better understanding of NASCAR's allure.
Yes, I enjoy many different forms of racing, stock cars among them.
Yes, I was born in the South.
Yes, my parents have always lived modestly: they didn't have alot of disposable income when I was growing up.
I think it's compltely arrogant to criticize people simply because of the sports they choose to support. What business of yours is it how I choose to spend my money? Why do you assume that only "Bubbas" (code word for Republican) attend NASCAR events.
I'm a Democrat. I despise everything about Bush.But in reading this thread, it seems that because I like NASCAR, I'm some kind of enemy of the Democratic Party.
My advice to you folks is, if you don't like, then don't watch it.
I hope I never become so petty that I get a thrill out of criticizing people over the sports they enjoy.
ComerPerro (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
26. I think so.
Auto racing itself isn't really a rich man's sport. But NASCAR seems to be, where good driving meets tons of money.
I think you summed it up when you compared it to equestrian atheltics, just with a broad appeal.
MindPilot (679 posts)
Response to Original message
36. oh my haven't we become a bunch of elitists
No skill? At 200+ mph that car is almost airborne. It takes some serious athletic ability and lighting fast reflexes just to keep that thing off the wall. Then do that for 500 miles. Factor in the pit crew who perform major maintenance procedures and repairs literally in seconds. Consider the engineers who design and build those cars to maximize their speed, safety and efficiency generating technology which filters down to doing the same for your car.
Not a sport? There is a hell of a lot more skill involved in a NASCAR race than hitting a ball with a stick. Motorsports is the only sport where the participants face the threat of real injury and even death.
Do we liberals bash all motorsports now or just NASCAR because it happens to come from the south? How do we feel about NHRA or Formula 1?
QC (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #36
38. Yeah, it sounds like a meeting of the Charleston Junior League in here,
doesn't it? This subject--and there is a NASCAR thread at least once a week--always brings out the prisspots.
yurbud (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
52. blood sport like cockfighting or pit bulls
You're waiting to seeing something get blowed up real good.
MindPilot (679 posts)
Response to Reply #52
63. Oh right--go back to watching golf
that should be a real thrill for you.
NYCparalegal Response to Original message
54. I'm a latte-sippin' non-Southern Italian-born
librul non-God fearin' female who likes NASCAR... so shoot me! I have been to a race (Rockingham) when I could afford it. I saw blacks and hispanics at the race. I also saw a couple of men who definitely did not hide their sexual orientation and, as far as I saw, no one gave them grief over it.
A lot of the drivers are not from the south; most of the tracks nowadays are no longer in the south. Sure, there are plenty of racist pigs, but there are some in all other sports (John Rocker anyone?)
How can driving a vehicle at speeds hovering around 200mph not be a sport? These people have to have nerves and reflexes of steel, just like other athletes. They must have excellent hand-eye coordination. Their bodies must be able to withstand the pressure of driving a vehicle at such high speeds, even if they are better safeguarded against crashes.
Elwood P Dowd (1000+ posts) Response to Original message
55. Great way to attract new Democratic voters here
Blast the 75 million NASCAR fans with silly, uninformed posts about a sport you know little or nothing about.
Pockets (135 posts)
Response to Reply #55
61. Right
Very "Right". Let's always agree with each other, never debate, never criticize anything... if so we might as well be Republicans.
Elwood P Dowd (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #61
68. Why do you want to debate a subject
when you know little or nothing about it?
yurbud (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
57. like a lot of sports, I can see why it's fun to DO (but not watch)
Here in SoCal, we all drive like nascar.
In terms of watching though, I put it just above golf, bowling, and competitive gardening.
Mr.Green93 (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
58. It's the
Fundie go-round
SheepyMcSheepster (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
69. can someone please explain all pro sports to me?
why does it matter if one team of overpaid athletes beats another team of overpaid athlete's in an effort that merely exiss to line the owner's pockets?
these things are here because they make money, not because they give a rats ass about "fans".
Purrfessor (387 posts)
Response to Original message
113. I like watching NASCAR because I know it pisses some people off.
bvar22 (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
138. The Democratic Party...
...would win the NEXT election if they sponsored a competitive car on the Nascar circuit.
impeachdubya (1000+ posts)
Response to Original message
158. Not all NASCAR fans are dumb-f*** yahoos..
but a lot of dumb-f*** yahoos are NASCAR fans.
ohio_liberal (1000+ posts)
Response to Reply #138
142. Bob Graham tried
it didn't work out so good for him, but then he had campaign problems that had nothing to do with NASCAR. I'd love to see a DNC car but I can't see them forking over $20 million to do it.
ha ha
And I thought watching Mikey, Johnny, and Kenney review the race on Monday nights was a hoot!
There is still hope for this one.
Damn those southern hicks. Do they always have to confuse DUmmies????
Poster # 36 seems to have had a moment of lucidity.
That is too funny. These people are so out of touch with reality it's almost sad.
How do they figure out how to breathe every morning?
My sister was a engineer in NASCAR for a year before the work just wore her out. My parents are into NASCAR, my dad a big Kayne fan, my mom likes Gordon. I like drag and demolition myself, and out here in Mississippi almost everyone does mud-drivin'.
Shhhhhh! You'll give him away.
Let's see, instead of Pennzoil, Duraflame, and Goodyear as sponsors they can get the NEA, the Teamsters, and NY Times to pony up some dough....
Around here in SW Florida they put on an amateur race for the clergy at the local track called "Faster Pastor."
"I know racing takes skill, but to start out in it you have to be or know rich people, right?"
Yeah, being able to drive a race car has nothing to do with it.
LOL
prolly a FR troll...
Frankly it's one of the most intelligent threads Ive seen to come out of the DU.
sad!
You mean every other word isn't profane? ; )
From the complex engines to the restrictor plate races, drafting, tire changes, fuel stops, the aerodynamics of the cars....
"turn left and spit..." my arse!
It's strange. The one who seems to know NASCAR seems to be the intelligent one thus disproving their own stereotypes.
Oh well baseball for me tonight.
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