Posted on 11/22/2004 7:14:57 AM PST by Birdstrike
The Muslim religion preaches the extreme and death to those who do not believe in it. Jihadists are following their religion. They are the greatest threat to the security of the world and therefore they should be kept out of our country and confined to their own, where they can preach what they want and live in the dark ages if they so choose.
They are not a threat because they don't live in democracies, they are a threat becasue of what they believe. Read their "holy" book and see for yourself.
There are hundreds of mosques right here in the USA and millions of muslims, many of whom call themselves Americans. Yet their silence is deafening. Which one can I trust? I have not heard or seen a single one of them speak out against the disregard for human life or the violence that you say is "not the average Muslim."
What and who is the "average Muslim"? Is it one that doesn't commit the violence himself but condones it, finances it and does nothing to prevent it or won't even raise his voice against it? Who are these "moderate and average" Muslims of which you speak and where do they live? Why don't you tell me that? Or should I just wait for the next act of murder and the repetition of silence from the bretheren of those that commit it?
You see I don't care what they "believe" but I do care what they do in my country. As long as they stay in their own country I don't care how they live. I would like to see us stay out of their countries and stop trying to tell them what to believe, how to live or what to do. However, the minute they come out of their lairs they make themselves fair game.
If they or you want me to believe that the "average Muslim" is a good guy that I should trust and give sanctuary in my house, then let the "average Muslims" come forward and let me hear their voice. Until they do, I am unable to tell the difference between this average guy you're talking about and the one that's just waiting for his chance to stab me or my brother in the back.
I'm not asking them to think like me or to believe what I believe and I really don't care if they read the Quran or the Bible. As long as they are a threat I don't want them in my house. It will take a lot of convincing on their part to get me to accept that they are not my enemy. That's their problem not mine. Until they are able to do it, I would like them to go home. I have neither the time or the desire to "convert" them to anything.
"Exactly. "
So we're in agreement.
"Our publically funded education system does a pretty fine job of shoving secularist/pluralistic propaganda down our kids' throats."
True. It's no worse (to me) than having tax dollars spent on teaching Creationism or other myths. I'm not a big fan of the teaching of acceptance of alternative lifestyles either, for the record. Some things should be handled by parents.
"many sex education programs indoctrinate them in ways that I believe are harmful to society."
Those that encourage sexual experimentation by adolescents - I agree with you. School is no place to learn about different types of sexual positions, etc. BUT, simply educating them on contraception, along with abstinence, as ways to promote sexual health is a good thing, I think. I do not believe in ignorance here. Hoping kids remain abstinent is simply ignorant. Many will not so I think it's best and most-realistic to educate them on the options they have.
Since 100% abstinence will never be achieved, isn't it better to still have low teen birth rates and cases of sex. disease, rather than the alternative?
I was a teenager once, raised in a fairly-strict Catholic family with mindful parents and went to church and had all the guilt of Catholicism thrown upon me, blah-blah-blah. Yet, I did all I could to eventually have premarital, teen sex. I would've had more, had I been able to get in the girl's pants more often. I was stupid and male (still am both!), sure, but at least I knew what I was getting into due to sex ed. My parents, who were great in all aspects but one, never had a 'sex talk' with me.
I guess I should have said "name a country where Islam is of any populace significance and islam accomodates its neighbors..... how's that?
"Everyone is a heretic, except for me and thee. And I'm not so sure about thee." ;o)
I may have a nostalgia for monarchy and aristocracy, but a real theocracy? I wouldn't like it any more than you would. :)
Since 100% abstinence will never be achieved, isn't it better to still have low teen birth rates and cases of sex. disease, rather than the alternative?
I can see the rationale there, but if you want to get really philosophical, I don't believe there should be public education at all. I don't think the state has any business telling my kids what to know. Granted, at this point it's so driven into our system that we'd have to "work our way out of it" one thing at a time, so to speak.
I was a teenager once, raised in a fairly-strict Catholic family with mindful parents and went to church and had all the guilt of Catholicism thrown upon me, blah-blah-blah. Yet, I did all I could to eventually have premarital, teen sex. I would've had more, had I been able to get in the girl's pants more often. I was stupid and male (still am both!), sure, but at least I knew what I was getting into due to sex ed. My parents, who were great in all aspects but one, never had a 'sex talk' with me.
That IS a problem, but I don't think sex ed has really helped it. I think parents need to talk to their kids about it, regardless of what kind of education their kids get, but that sex ed might encourage the kind of thinking like, "Oh, well, they've already had that."
They are pitiful, and the numbers are small, which isn't a reason not to be alert. Along with the popcorn, virus and spyware detection would make sense.
Speaking for myself, I'm not reliable, after all, it's the internet.
Glad to see the thread is still going.
Personally, I worry more about Deer-e-Tics than her-e-tics.
It's not just that their numbers are small. It's the fact that their movements are completely fringe elements and have absolutely no sway in the real world. If anything, they serve the interests of multiculturalism, as they make convenient bogeymen for the left.
I just don't think we have to worry about FR being taken over by white supremacists.
Along with the popcorn, virus and spyware detection would make sense.
I suppose you have a point there.
I think it should happen, but it never will because we now live in a liberal PC world.
BTW, now that the election is over, can we tell the Keyesters what a keister is?
"I wouldn't like it any more than you would. :) "
I HATE arguing with people I'm in agreement with. Such a waste of time for the both of us...
" I don't believe there should be public education at all. I don't think the state has any business telling my kids what to know."
Philosophically, I'm in agreement. My wife & I made the sacrifice of shallow materialism and she now stays home with our children, rather than trying to earn a few more dollars to buy more crap to keep up with everyone else in debt. But -- and I'm sure you've met the type of people also -- most parents would not provide a quality education for their children if the parents themselves were forced to do so. Gotta make those BMW payments and fill up those SUVs!
"but I don't think sex ed has really helped it. I think parents need to talk to their kids about it, regardless of what kind of education their kids get, but that sex ed might encourage the kind of thinking like, "Oh, well, they've already had that.""
Agreed to a point. Some frank sex ed. would've been good for people like me whose parents -- for whatever reasons -- chose not to educate their children. Again, I don't want the embracing of alternative lifestyles crap, but more of a biological and sociological ("Here's what happens to teen moms. Here's what having a baby is all about" ,etc. Reality-based!) approach that, like some of the violent, anti-DUI films shown in Driver's Ed, would scare kids with reality and stats into abstinence.
I have yet to meet one rabbi (and I am talking Orthodox) who say women should not study Torah.
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