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Why Voting for a Third Party Candidate is NOT Throwing Your Vote Away
conservativesagainstrepublicans.com ^ | August 14, 2004 | Jason Marianna

Posted on 08/14/2004 4:03:42 PM PDT by TERMINATTOR

You hear it every election year. Those 5 little words, strung together to make up the biggest lie in politics: “You’re throwing your vote away.” The media even has a name for the candidates that get the “throw away” votes. They call those candidates “spoilers”. Why? Because it ruins the whole two-party myth. It shows evidence that there are more choices out there than tweedle-dee and tweedle-dum.

The two major parties are beginning to realize this too. No longer can they sit back as the Greens, Constitutionalists, Libertarians, and Independent Americans take away a percentage of the votes. They can’t rely on people to automatically disregard these third parties any more as “fringe groups” because the fringe is getting awfully big. Instead they try to scare you into believing that a vote for a third party is a vote for the opposition. For example, when Ralph Nader announced his candidacy for President in 2004, the Democrats began rounding up the troops with threats that support for Nader is really support for Bush in disguise. In their opinions, John Kerry has the only real chance of beating Bush, and therefore is the only candidate worth anyone's support.

It’s not that I defend Ralph Nader, in fact my viewpoint is quite the contrary. My support will go to Michael Peroutka (www.peroutka2004.com), and I’m sure Republican campaign against him will come closer to election day. They’ll scare their big supporters into believing that a vote for Peroutka is a vote for John Kerry.

It’s an age old tactic, do whatever you can to get votes. Run emotionally charged commercials, scare people with trumped up charges and exaggerated claims about the opponent, kiss babies, jump on band wagons, hold whistle stop tours, sign autographs, throw out first pitches at ball games, use every press opportunity as a campaign commercial, do whatever you can to get elected. Unfortunately, in the effort to score as many votes as possible, the two major parties often forget one thing . . . principle. How much do they really believe in their principles if they are willing to sacrifice them so freely for a vote?

For years the two parties have followed the same model of getting elected. They run to the left or right during the primaries, and run to the center in the general election. What we are left with is two candidates essentially saying the same thing, but disagreeing in name only, and occasionally on implementation of the same policies. This year is no different. Bush pushed the Patriot act because he is interested in removing God given rights from Americans. Kerry opposes the Patriot act, but that doesn’t mean he’s not interested in taking away American’s God given rights. He’ll still try to take our second amendment. He’ll still seek to hold “terrorists” without legal aid or trial. He’ll accomplish the same things Bush would, just under a different banner and in different ways. It’s politics. It’s the system. It’s anything but principled.

When you ask people why they vote for a candidate, they give you a few basic answers. For one, they may actually truly believe in the candidate and his policies. This is rare in the two-party system, but it does happen. Another reason many people give is because the candidate is the lesser of two evils. Some say that although they disagree with the candidate on some things “at least he’s not the other guy.” They imply with this thinking that there are no other choices, despite the emergence of viable third parties for both the left and the right.

The lesser of two evils argument frustrates the daylights out of me when I hear it. First of all, it is a flawed argument. As I’ve demonstrated above, in the general election, the parties run to the center. The result of this is that both parties become the big tent party. What has happened in America is that both parties have gotten so good at running to the center that they are almost exactly alike. There is no “lesser” in the lesser of two evils.

Since when is voting for evil a good thing? Does it matter if you drive a car off a cliff at 55 MPH or 80 MPH? Either way, you’re driving off the cliff. A vote for the lesser of two evils is a vote for evil, plain and simple. It doesn’t take a master’s degree to figure this out.

How many Americans grumble every year that all politicians are only in office for their own interests? The basis of these feelings is that Government has not progressed in America for nearly 100 years. There have been some victories on both sides of the spectrum, but for the most part, we’ve been in the same rut of one step forward and two steps back. Yet, these same Americans who complain about the hole we’re in, get out their two-party shovels on election day and dig us further in the hole by perpetuating the heart of the problem: The two-party system itself. If you want to change Government, change your vote.

I spent a week really campaigning for my candidate to my circle of conservative friends and acquaintances recently. I got the same response over and over again. “I would vote for Peroutka if I thought he had a chance of winning. However, even though I agree with nearly everything he says, he can’t possibly win, so I would be throwing my vote away, or worse yet, actually voting for John Kerry.” What they didn’t realize is that if they all vote for him, we are all actually that much closer to having someone we actually want in office, instead of someone we barely tolerate.

If someone were to open up the curtain at the voting booth and say to you “I voted for Ralph Nader, so you must vote for him too”, what would you do? I’d punch him in the nose even if I was a Nader supporter. No one has any right to tell you how to vote, let alone control your vote. So then why do we base our votes on what polls say or a candidate’s popularity rating? You wouldn’t let anyone look over your shoulder and tell you what to do when you fill out your ballot, so why let them look over your shoulder and tell you what to do beforehand?

A good percentage of people who voted for Bush and Gore in 2000 didn’t really like the candidate they choose, but felt like they were, at least in a small way, better than the other guy. A portion of those people (dare I say; a majority of those people?) actually liked another third party candidate a lot better, but felt they would be throwing their vote away if they voted for who they really wanted. Look at the big picture. If all of those people actually voted for who they wanted, we would have had a four horse race, most likely George Bush, Al Gore, Ralph Nader, and Howard Phillips. How hard would it have been for any of those candidates to get 25% of the vote if everyone voted for who they believed in, instead of who they were scared or manipulated into voting for?

The two parties don’t care about you. They care about power. They care about winning elections, no matter the cost. They’ve abandoned the American people and their needs. They’ve forgotten that the rights Americans enjoy are to be protected, not manipulated. They don’t care to hold to the constitution’s limitations. This must change, but will not change if we continue to give them our support. If you want government to reflect your principles, vote for candidates and parties that reflect those principles, no exceptions. The only result of holding to principle is government changing for the better, one individual vote at a time. Changing government for the better is not throwing your vote away. Quite the contrary, it is using it properly.


TOPICS: Government; Politics
KEYWORDS: avoteforevil; bigtentparty; changegovernment; changeyourvote; conservative; differentbanner; lesseroftwoevils; nolesserjustevil; notbush; notkerry; notnader; nottheotherguy; notthisagain; principles; sacrificeprincipals; samepolicies; samerut; samosamo; scarepeople; scaretactics; thirdparties; tweedledee; tweedledum; twopartymyth; twopeasinapod; viablethirdparties; voteforisavotefor
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To: TERMINATTOR
Yeah,right,and the rain isn't wet,snow isn't cold,and dope for everyone.

Some day,you just might manage to grow up and learn that third parties are a waste of time;as is THROWING AWAY YOUR VOTE/HELPING THE CANDIDIATE MOST UNLIKELY TO DO ANYTHING THAT YOU WANT!

The FFs did NOT want the kind of parliamentary system favored in Europe (which is THE only form in which many parties can work),so you're out of step with even the FFs!

21 posted on 08/14/2004 9:16:54 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: sefarkas
The ONLY message you third partyites send to the GOP/RNC ,is that you aren't trusted or needed to win and should be IGNORED.
22 posted on 08/14/2004 9:22:06 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: TERMINATTOR
Of course it isn't throwing away your vote. Without those of you who vote third party, no democrats would ever get elected.

It seems to me that some do not recognize what the "other party" really is. They claim there is no difference. If they really believe that, they haven't been paying attention, or else they weren't alive when Communism was called what it is really is.

So go ahead, vote for someone who will do all of your bidding. Vote third party because Bush isn't your personal robot and is silly enough to realize he is the President of all of the citizens of this country. Yep, we should have a dictator who only cares about the people who are in his party like Clinton did.Never mind that actually governing a nation like this requires compromise at times, YOU know best right? (not you personally, I am referring to those who vote third party to make a "statement")
23 posted on 08/14/2004 9:34:44 PM PDT by ladyinred (What if the hokey pokey IS what it's all about?)
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To: Samwise

LOL!


24 posted on 08/14/2004 9:47:15 PM PDT by Darksheare (I'll bayonet your snowmen and beat you down with a chinese yo-yo!!)
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To: Dog Gone

It isn't even THAT "large"! :-)


25 posted on 08/14/2004 9:48:54 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: TERMINATTOR

see tag line...


26 posted on 08/14/2004 9:55:31 PM PDT by null and void (Want to live in a socialist state now? Vote (D). Want to live in a socialist state soon? Vote (R)...)
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To: TERMINATTOR

The web site is called conservativesagainstrepublicans.com...you all haven't figured out who the enemy is yet.


27 posted on 08/14/2004 9:58:11 PM PDT by Luis Gonzalez (Sin Patria, pero sin amo)
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To: TERMINATTOR

You vote for a third party to punish the Republicans for not being exactly what you want and they move away from you in self defense. You will never get what you want that way, instead you will (did) marginalize yourselves. If you doubt that, consider how many people vote Democrat because their family has always voted Democrat - even though the 'rats are nothing like the Democrats of Grandpa's day.

If, instead of sticking your nose in the air and saying you are too good for the Republican Party, you were to hold your nose and participate, the result would be Republican candidates that reflected, more closely any way, your values. Then there would be a Constitution Caucus in the Republican Party, for example.

If I were running for President today as a Republican, I would approach the Constitution Party for its endorsement, and the Libertarian Party as well, because I believe that my values are sufficiently close to the core values of those parties. Yet I am still a Republican; there is room in the Republican Party for me and my viewpoints, and my best chance of getting elected is as a Republican. It isn't that I am compromising my principals - they are compatible with being a Republican even if they aren't popular among Republicans in office. I am actually advancing my principals by increasing the number of politicians favoring them by one.

So get down off your high horse, get down in the mud, and save the country from the most immediate danger - John Kerry, the nominee of the Democratic Party, which is really the SOCIALIST MAFIA and which is a CRIMINAL ENTERPRISE.

Now, as far as Nader taking votes away from Kerry - I'm all for that. The former is a mass murderer and the latter either a traitor or a war criminal (maybe both) and neither Kerry nor Nader belongs in any public office, especially POTUS.


28 posted on 08/14/2004 9:58:53 PM PDT by calenel (Peace Through Strength, and when necessary, Peace Through Victory!)
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To: TERMINATTOR
Another kook thread.... okay but afterward it back to the attic Uncle Fester....

By the way, there is a wonderful retirement community in Southern Arizona you should look into, warm weather for the arthritis and lots of UFO sightings.... just your speed.

29 posted on 08/14/2004 10:00:43 PM PDT by Porterville (Your sensitivity offends me you disgusting liberal.)
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To: nopardons

bobdole had the same attitude...hmm.


30 posted on 08/14/2004 10:01:05 PM PDT by ApesForEvolution (DemocRATS are communists and want to destroy America only to replace it with the USSA)
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31 posted on 08/14/2004 10:02:17 PM PDT by Porterville (Your sensitivity offends me you disgusting liberal.)
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To: Samwise
A third parties can be a good thing.
Voting against W is a very bad thing.

SIGN & FORWARD PETITION to GOP Leaders: Fund & Support Alan Keyes Senate Campaign!
Get up to date with Alan Keyes, his schedule and campaign.

32 posted on 08/15/2004 12:35:13 AM PDT by unspun (RU working your precinct, churchmembers, etc. 4 good votes? | Not "Unspun w/ AnnaZ" but I appreciate)
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To: gcruse
I am among those who jumped to Perot

Perot was a special case in that he got enough dissatisfied voters from both parties, as well as those that didn't vote too often.

I am unclear about the message the Republicans got from it. It was only 2 years later that the party retook the house after 40 years.

33 posted on 08/15/2004 9:46:26 AM PDT by No_Outcome_But_Victory (Reagan preferred to shoot the bear... the verdict of history will be simple: nice aim.)
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To: No_Outcome_But_Victory

You can thank Newt Gingrich for that. And that fact he is roundly hated by some many conservatives is a lesson in ingratitude itself.


34 posted on 08/15/2004 9:58:49 AM PDT by gcruse (http://gcruse.typepad.com/)
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To: bayourod
Is there any harm in voting third party in states that are not in play?

If you have a decent enough conservative candidate, why not widen his margin of victory?That would increase the governing mandate, and stave off legal challenges.

35 posted on 08/15/2004 10:01:03 AM PDT by No_Outcome_But_Victory (Reagan preferred to shoot the bear... the verdict of history will be simple: nice aim.)
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To: gcruse
You can thank Newt Gingrich for that. And that fact he is roundly hated by some many conservatives is a lesson in ingratitude itself.

WHAT! Who could hate Newt Gingrich? He's a great political thinker.

36 posted on 08/15/2004 10:06:28 AM PDT by No_Outcome_But_Victory (Reagan preferred to shoot the bear... the verdict of history will be simple: nice aim.)
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To: No_Outcome_But_Victory

He's maybe the best we have. But you'll find him roundly hated among socons.


37 posted on 08/15/2004 10:08:45 AM PDT by gcruse (http://gcruse.typepad.com/)
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To: TERMINATTOR
Why Voting for a Third Party Candidate is NOT Throwing Your Vote Away

I agree completely, but I think that this philosophy should only be taught to liberals.

If a liberal votes for Nader, then it is not a wasted vote. I hope every enviro nut out there votes for Nader, and all the unions vote Socialist Workers, and the NOW/feminists vote for Susan Sarandon, and so on and so on. Those are votes I could support entirely.

But to suggest that conservatives should split their vote is brainless. Was Clinton a better President then GHWB? And if not, then would Dole have made a better President than Clinton? Do you think that the ultra leftists that voted for Nader are happier with Bush than Gore?

Use your head, not your emotions. Politics is a game of compromise, and getting the best deal you can. Winning by wider margins strengthens our hand, becoming a fringe offshoot of kooks and refuseniks does not.

38 posted on 08/15/2004 10:16:01 AM PDT by Steel Wolf (Don't make me roll initiative...!)
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To: gcruse
He's maybe the best we have. But you'll find him roundly hated among socons.

Another thing I've noticed about some conservatives (if you can call them that) is that they have the obsessive need to punish any conservative politician that is even slightly more moderate than they are.

We have people around here that will vote for Kerry because they want to 'punish' Bush for not living totally up to their standards. 'Death Wish' conservatives only cause the Pubs to move left, because they think conservatives just aren't ascendant during the next election cycle, or that conservatives are too fickle.

I vote for the most conservative person I can. The wise man knows when to compromise, the fool runs headlong into disaster.

39 posted on 08/15/2004 10:24:28 AM PDT by No_Outcome_But_Victory (Reagan preferred to shoot the bear... the verdict of history will be simple: nice aim.)
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To: No_Outcome_But_Victory
1)
I think in hindsight Perot was a sign that the US was moving rightward, but unwilling to shift to the republicans. Remember how Clinton had to move way to the right(for a dem) to keep his job.

2)
Two party system is just the practical way to go. Its like a parliamentary government, except the coalition is formed before the election.

3)
I get very confused by (L) Libertarians. The Cato Institute is great but other libertarians make me crazy and seem immature.

4)
3rd parties seem to be for people who are bad at math. The bet outcome they could hope for in a presidential campaign would be to throw the election into the newly elected House. Go Nader Go
40 posted on 08/15/2004 12:36:37 PM PDT by sharpink (righting wrongs real or imagined)
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