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Why I Am Now Behind Arnold
me

Posted on 08/12/2003 9:52:14 AM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand

I have slowly come to the conclusion that California needs Arnold. Republicans need Arnold, and above all, California Republicans need Arnold.

I had been leaning towards McClintock, and I must admit, I made that decision before Arnold threw his hat into the ring. I welcomed the move when he did, but I still had reservations. I had gotten pretty excited over McClintock's vision, particularly his desire to void the Davis energy contracts and his general desire to stick it to the Democrats. I was also justifiably concerned at first about Arnold's talk of handing the treasury over to "the children".

But one has to be able to discern politics from policy. Everyone who wants to win elective office has to pay lipservice to "the children". It is the national passtime of politicians. I think when Arnold says "the children should have the first call of state Treasury" it is followed by an unspoken qualifier of "before illegal immigrants, welfare recipients, and special interests." He is simply putting forth his priorities, and they lay in stark contrast to Gray Davis and Cruz Bustamante's. He is quite savvy, so he isn't going to come out and say it in those words. He knows highlighting what is his priorities gets much better press than highlighting what isn't. He wants to reassure the soccer moms who have been frightened by Davis' threats of cutting funding to schools that he will be looking elsewhere to cut.

Arnold is very mindful of the hurdles he faces by running as a Republican in such a liberal state, so he will take extra measures to make traditional Democratic voters feel comfortable voting for him. It is what he has to do right now if he wants to win, and it seems to be working brilliantly.

Some conservatives will argue against Schwarzenegger because he opposed the impeachment of Bill Clinton. But Arnold understood the articles of impeachment that were brought were a pretty weak justification. Right or wrong, they were too easily construed as a right-wing lynching. He recognized it as too divisive and knew it could only further poison the political atmosphere and ultimately damage the Republican party.

Perhaps if Ken Starr had the convictions to pursue the serious matters of Whitewater, Chinagate, Filegate, or the murder of Vincent Foster, then Arnold would have seen it differently, just as the rest of America would have. But clearly Starr had no will to do so. It's hard to understand why, but perhaps he didn't want to expose that level of corruption in the highest office out of the long-term best interest of the American political system. Exposing Clinton's ties to the Dixieland mafia and Red China could have brought the entire government to its knees. It would have been a short-term victory for Republicans, but just as Nixon understood when he covered for Kennedy and Johnson over the Pentagon Papers, the long-term damage to the nation as a whole would have been far too great. Anyways, had Clinton actually been removed from office as a lame duck on those flimsy charges, we would have a President Gore in office right now. Arnold knew, just as everyone else did, that this was not going to happen considering it required a two-thirds majority in the Senate. Surely he understood that impeachment was a lose-lose proposition for Republicans so it was a mistake to go down that road. It was important for him to remain above it all for the sake of his own political future.

Some will argue that what we need right now is someone sort of financial wizard to fix the budget, and Arnold just doesn't qualify. But the truth is we really only need someone who can admit that Gray Davis has made some huge mistakes. Anyone but Gray Davis will do.

I hate to admit it, but the whole budget crisis is being about as overplayed for political reasons as the federal deficit in the '90s was (and is again). When it comes down to brass tacks, I think even the Democrats will bite the bullet and fix it. Yes, I know you're cringing, I am too, but it's the truth. The issue here isn't that the Democrats are incapable or even unwilling to fixing the budget. It's merely about how they want to fix it: the usual liberal approach of skyrocketing taxes. Either way, California isn't going to drop into the ocean or become a third world nation.

As far as Arnold not being a "social conservative", neither am I, and neither is California. A social conservative is not going to win a statewide election here for a long time to come. I fit in more along the lines of a fiscal conservative, just as Arnold is, and a "Constitutional conservative" with libertarian tendencies. Piety is not a prerequisite for my support, and too much of it may even lose it. I don't begrudge anyone their religious beliefs, but I do belive strongly in Jefferson's "wall of seperation between church and state". I also believe in strict interpritation of the First Ammendment, and that freedom of religion also entails freedom from religion. I realize those of you in the religious-right do not agree because this doesn't reinforce your personal religious beliefs, but not everything should be about our own personal whims and narrow agendas. Defending our own freedom as individuals must always be a higher objective. Otherwise it may be you they come for next. The Constitution protects everyone, or it protects no one. I think there are a lot of people on both extremes who forget that sometimes.

Even though some will say for these various reasons that Schwarzenegger is not the ideal conservative candidate, it is important for everyone to be pragmatic and pick their battles wisely. Right now we should be looking at long-term goals. An expedient victory in the recall of a conservative candidate by a 20 percent plurality is going to be counterproductive in the long-term. What are you going to do when Bill Simon is elected and the drive to recall him begins October 8th and qualifies three weeks later?

Electing Arnold, who can come to office with a true mandate and bring California together, will pay off big in the perception wars. Conservatives will never get their agenda anywhere in California as long as it is taboo to even vote for Republicans here. The longer Democrats have a complete lock on the state, the further left we will drift. Even if Arnold can't change the course right away, he can at least slow the momentum.

Personally, my goal is the destruction of the Democratic party and the liberal agenda far more than it is advancing any conservative single-issue. I have far more hate for left-wing Democrats than I have love for right-wing Republicans. I would be happy simply with a return to sanity at this point.

You can't walk a mile until you take the first step. For right now we all need to be concentrating on the jouney one step at a time or we will never reach the final destination. You have to at least open the door, which is now closed and locked here. It seems like a lot of right-wingers around here would rather rant and rave and pound on the door in futility than grab it by the handle.

I think I've finally figured that one out. For the death-before-electibility crowd, it's not about advancing their cause on earth, it's about earning a place in heaven.

As for the rest of us, we have to make a decision: do we want a small victory, or a huge defeat?


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: 1eternalvignotincali; california; davis; election; governor; guessmyotherid; imatroll; mcclintock; recall; schwarzenegger; schwarzenutter
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To: george wythe
Democrats 45%
Republicans 35%
Independents 15%
Other (Greens, Libertarians, etc)



Democrat voter fraud in California is estimated to be between 5-30% in any given area. It is impossible to know what the exact breakdown is but having lived here all my life, I suspect it is pretty close to even.
361 posted on 08/12/2003 6:53:36 PM PDT by Canticle_of_Deborah (The 12th Republican Commandment: "Thou shalt not alienate thy base")
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To: Tamsey
Can you imagine the tug of war in the months ahead? Have a feeling it is going to get worse.


362 posted on 08/12/2003 6:53:46 PM PDT by PhiKapMom (VOTE FOR ARNOLD -- GOP's Best Chance to Tank Hillary for 2004 and beyond!)
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To: jwalsh07
You have converted me!
363 posted on 08/12/2003 6:54:56 PM PDT by PhiKapMom (VOTE FOR ARNOLD -- GOP's Best Chance to Tank Hillary for 2004 and beyond!)
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To: PhiKapMom
{They are conservative and religious but members of the religious right they are not. J.C., Keating, Nickles have had some things to say about the likes of Robertson and Falwell for a long time!]

Fair enough. Like RINO, the phrase, religious right, is a term that is often misapplied and overused. For example, I have co-workers who think pro-choice Republicans who oppose tax funded abortions are disciples of Jerry Falwell.
364 posted on 08/12/2003 6:55:00 PM PDT by Kuksool (There are no guarantees in the Gray Recall)
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
This is a repost since I mistakenly wrote "involuntary" on the original.

LOL, no kidding? I knew what you meant Doc. I'm not a stickler for spelling, grammar or typing skills.

I get your drift quite easily. I don't agree with the the way your drifting but you don't have any problem making projecting your views..

365 posted on 08/12/2003 6:58:24 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: PhiKapMom
The thing about the AWB, is it criminalized Semi-auto rifles that were copies of full auto military rifles.

It never was legal to own an M-16, in full auto mode.

The AWB came because of the massacre of the asian schoolkids in Californias central valley.

That was the excuse the libs needed, & They waved those dead kids ( in a rhetorical sense ) & no politician could
stand against.

Fact is, ANY semi-auto action can be made into full auto by a competent machinist.

you can buy a M-1 garand, semi-auto & will take a bayonet

it's a better weapon at long distances, but it doesn't look like a scary " assault rifle "
366 posted on 08/12/2003 6:58:32 PM PDT by Mike the lurker (Let us stand in the gap together)
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To: PhiKapMom
You have converted me!

:-} Great, you made my day.

367 posted on 08/12/2003 6:59:06 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: Mike the lurker; jwalsh07
Thanks for the info! I have gotten an education today from Jwalsh07 and now you.

Would bet if the 2nd amendment folks explained things like the two of you, you would get more converts. No in your face but facts that can be understood!
368 posted on 08/12/2003 7:04:45 PM PDT by PhiKapMom (VOTE FOR ARNOLD -- GOP's Best Chance to Tank Hillary for 2004 and beyond!)
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To: All
McClintock is on Greta's show tonight and coming up shortly.
369 posted on 08/12/2003 7:05:26 PM PDT by Canticle_of_Deborah (The 12th Republican Commandment: "Thou shalt not alienate thy base")
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To: Tamsey
the hard-core conservatives are pulling the Republican Party as far right as possible and less hard-core conservatives don't appreciate being viciously insulted for not cooperating.

Dang, you just burned up another irony meter.


370 posted on 08/12/2003 7:06:11 PM PDT by Sabertooth (Where do Arnold and McClintock stand on California Drivers' Licenses for Illegal Aliens?)
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To: hellinahandcart
"Respecting" in the establishment clause means simply acknowledging or pertaining to. I don't really see where you and I materially differ on that.

Basically, Congress----->no law----->establishment of religion

Of course things are never apprached so simply in law. If they were, there would be no lawyers!

Even still, the above distillation you laid out reaches the same conclusion: Congressional endorsements of the God of Abraham are in direct conflict with the Establishment Clause.

371 posted on 08/12/2003 7:06:41 PM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand
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To: PhiKapMom
Have a feeling it is going to get worse.

I agree, it aint gonna be pretty! We'll just have to stick to our guns, so to speak, while they stick to their Uzi's ;-)

372 posted on 08/12/2003 7:06:52 PM PDT by Tamzee (I was a vegetarian until I started leaning toward the sunlight...... Rita Rudner)
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To: jwalsh07; Mike the lurker
Next time a 2nd amendment thread goes up, I suggest you and Mike the Lurker take the lead! You two would get some converts I am sure!



373 posted on 08/12/2003 7:06:59 PM PDT by PhiKapMom (VOTE FOR ARNOLD -- GOP's Best Chance to Tank Hillary for 2004 and beyond!)
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
James Madison said debating the First Amendment: "he apprehended the meaning of the words to be, that Congress should not establish a religion, and enforce the legal observation of it by law, nor compel men to worship God in any manner contrary to their conscience."

As another great American said: "stare decisis may bind courts as to matters of law, but it cannot bind them as to matters of history. "

My free advice: stick to discussing Arnold and the race, merely as a Californian your opinion on that has some inherent value.

374 posted on 08/12/2003 7:07:05 PM PDT by mrsmith
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To: jwalsh07
I might add that in several gated communites surrounding the area, several citizens manned barricades with the same weapons which dissuaded the bad guys from entering their community without a shot being fired.

Dr. John Lott has two books("THE BIAS AGAINST GUNS" AND "MORE GUNS LESS CRIME")that back up your arguments 100%

Great posts

375 posted on 08/12/2003 7:10:02 PM PDT by woodyinscc
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand; mrsmith
My free advice: stick to discussing Arnold and the race, merely as a Californian your opinion on that has some inherent value.

Ouch!

376 posted on 08/12/2003 7:10:12 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: woodyinscc
Thanks Woody.
377 posted on 08/12/2003 7:10:53 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: Tamsey
LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That's good!
378 posted on 08/12/2003 7:12:03 PM PDT by PhiKapMom (VOTE FOR ARNOLD -- GOP's Best Chance to Tank Hillary for 2004 and beyond!)
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To: jwalsh07
Do you support the Ninth Circuits recent ruling, since withdrawn, ordering public schools to cease and desist from the recitation of the Pledge with the words "under God" included?

Not entirely, but pretty much, yes.
I think that goes about it the wrong way. I'm glad to see the case is being kept alive, and with any luck will reach the Supreme Court. What I would like to see done is that this is handled correctly and the Supreme Court strikes down the law that Congress passed in the 1950s that first introduced the words "under God" into the Pledge, thus restoring it to the proper Historical Pledge.

Surely a return to the Historical text is something any good conservative could support, no?

379 posted on 08/12/2003 7:13:17 PM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand
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To: PhiKapMom
Well if I'm out of lurk mode I will help :)
380 posted on 08/12/2003 7:15:26 PM PDT by Mike the lurker (Let us stand in the gap together)
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