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Why I Am Now Behind Arnold
me

Posted on 08/12/2003 9:52:14 AM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand

I have slowly come to the conclusion that California needs Arnold. Republicans need Arnold, and above all, California Republicans need Arnold.

I had been leaning towards McClintock, and I must admit, I made that decision before Arnold threw his hat into the ring. I welcomed the move when he did, but I still had reservations. I had gotten pretty excited over McClintock's vision, particularly his desire to void the Davis energy contracts and his general desire to stick it to the Democrats. I was also justifiably concerned at first about Arnold's talk of handing the treasury over to "the children".

But one has to be able to discern politics from policy. Everyone who wants to win elective office has to pay lipservice to "the children". It is the national passtime of politicians. I think when Arnold says "the children should have the first call of state Treasury" it is followed by an unspoken qualifier of "before illegal immigrants, welfare recipients, and special interests." He is simply putting forth his priorities, and they lay in stark contrast to Gray Davis and Cruz Bustamante's. He is quite savvy, so he isn't going to come out and say it in those words. He knows highlighting what is his priorities gets much better press than highlighting what isn't. He wants to reassure the soccer moms who have been frightened by Davis' threats of cutting funding to schools that he will be looking elsewhere to cut.

Arnold is very mindful of the hurdles he faces by running as a Republican in such a liberal state, so he will take extra measures to make traditional Democratic voters feel comfortable voting for him. It is what he has to do right now if he wants to win, and it seems to be working brilliantly.

Some conservatives will argue against Schwarzenegger because he opposed the impeachment of Bill Clinton. But Arnold understood the articles of impeachment that were brought were a pretty weak justification. Right or wrong, they were too easily construed as a right-wing lynching. He recognized it as too divisive and knew it could only further poison the political atmosphere and ultimately damage the Republican party.

Perhaps if Ken Starr had the convictions to pursue the serious matters of Whitewater, Chinagate, Filegate, or the murder of Vincent Foster, then Arnold would have seen it differently, just as the rest of America would have. But clearly Starr had no will to do so. It's hard to understand why, but perhaps he didn't want to expose that level of corruption in the highest office out of the long-term best interest of the American political system. Exposing Clinton's ties to the Dixieland mafia and Red China could have brought the entire government to its knees. It would have been a short-term victory for Republicans, but just as Nixon understood when he covered for Kennedy and Johnson over the Pentagon Papers, the long-term damage to the nation as a whole would have been far too great. Anyways, had Clinton actually been removed from office as a lame duck on those flimsy charges, we would have a President Gore in office right now. Arnold knew, just as everyone else did, that this was not going to happen considering it required a two-thirds majority in the Senate. Surely he understood that impeachment was a lose-lose proposition for Republicans so it was a mistake to go down that road. It was important for him to remain above it all for the sake of his own political future.

Some will argue that what we need right now is someone sort of financial wizard to fix the budget, and Arnold just doesn't qualify. But the truth is we really only need someone who can admit that Gray Davis has made some huge mistakes. Anyone but Gray Davis will do.

I hate to admit it, but the whole budget crisis is being about as overplayed for political reasons as the federal deficit in the '90s was (and is again). When it comes down to brass tacks, I think even the Democrats will bite the bullet and fix it. Yes, I know you're cringing, I am too, but it's the truth. The issue here isn't that the Democrats are incapable or even unwilling to fixing the budget. It's merely about how they want to fix it: the usual liberal approach of skyrocketing taxes. Either way, California isn't going to drop into the ocean or become a third world nation.

As far as Arnold not being a "social conservative", neither am I, and neither is California. A social conservative is not going to win a statewide election here for a long time to come. I fit in more along the lines of a fiscal conservative, just as Arnold is, and a "Constitutional conservative" with libertarian tendencies. Piety is not a prerequisite for my support, and too much of it may even lose it. I don't begrudge anyone their religious beliefs, but I do belive strongly in Jefferson's "wall of seperation between church and state". I also believe in strict interpritation of the First Ammendment, and that freedom of religion also entails freedom from religion. I realize those of you in the religious-right do not agree because this doesn't reinforce your personal religious beliefs, but not everything should be about our own personal whims and narrow agendas. Defending our own freedom as individuals must always be a higher objective. Otherwise it may be you they come for next. The Constitution protects everyone, or it protects no one. I think there are a lot of people on both extremes who forget that sometimes.

Even though some will say for these various reasons that Schwarzenegger is not the ideal conservative candidate, it is important for everyone to be pragmatic and pick their battles wisely. Right now we should be looking at long-term goals. An expedient victory in the recall of a conservative candidate by a 20 percent plurality is going to be counterproductive in the long-term. What are you going to do when Bill Simon is elected and the drive to recall him begins October 8th and qualifies three weeks later?

Electing Arnold, who can come to office with a true mandate and bring California together, will pay off big in the perception wars. Conservatives will never get their agenda anywhere in California as long as it is taboo to even vote for Republicans here. The longer Democrats have a complete lock on the state, the further left we will drift. Even if Arnold can't change the course right away, he can at least slow the momentum.

Personally, my goal is the destruction of the Democratic party and the liberal agenda far more than it is advancing any conservative single-issue. I have far more hate for left-wing Democrats than I have love for right-wing Republicans. I would be happy simply with a return to sanity at this point.

You can't walk a mile until you take the first step. For right now we all need to be concentrating on the jouney one step at a time or we will never reach the final destination. You have to at least open the door, which is now closed and locked here. It seems like a lot of right-wingers around here would rather rant and rave and pound on the door in futility than grab it by the handle.

I think I've finally figured that one out. For the death-before-electibility crowd, it's not about advancing their cause on earth, it's about earning a place in heaven.

As for the rest of us, we have to make a decision: do we want a small victory, or a huge defeat?


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: 1eternalvignotincali; california; davis; election; governor; guessmyotherid; imatroll; mcclintock; recall; schwarzenegger; schwarzenutter
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To: jwalsh07; PhiKapMom
I do not see the need for anyone in civilian life to own an assault rifle but then that makes me a RINO and anti-gun rights!

She didn't say YOU couldn't have one; she said she didn't see the need for it.

And her point is right: if she voices that opinion, she branded a gun grabber/hater and a RINO.

Believe me, I know.

PKM, look for that post to come back to haunt you. I had the nerve to say I didn't want some jerkwad living next to me to have an Uzi.

You can't believe how many times it's posted here (and at the Little Place) to PROVE I'm a liberal.

301 posted on 08/12/2003 5:43:15 PM PDT by Howlin
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To: sitetest
very insightful

as opposed to

insiteful

302 posted on 08/12/2003 5:44:02 PM PDT by AeWingnut (Soccer: a symptom of a greater ill)
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
{What about the native americans who worship many spirits?}

Native Americans, by and large, worship God. The majority are Catholic, though both the Mormons and the Baptists are making strong inroads. Please don’t let Disney describe the beliefs of a people.
303 posted on 08/12/2003 5:44:03 PM PDT by kingu
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To: Howlin; PhiKapMom
I had the nerve to say I didn't want some jerkwad living next to me to have an Uzi.

I don't have any problem with me or my neighbor owning an Uzi, but I'm a little leery about the idea of the drug lords downtown owning them.

304 posted on 08/12/2003 5:45:42 PM PDT by Amelia
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To: Howlin; PhiKapMom
How long do you think it'll be before The Legend copies and pastes that one over at the Little Place (I love that!) since he's got such a "thang" for you AND PKM.........LOL
305 posted on 08/12/2003 5:47:12 PM PDT by justshe ("Do you trust a Democrat to protect America?")
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To: Lazamataz
Curiously, Sabertooth saw fit to question your admittance date, and really didn't bother addressing what seemed like a pretty good essay.

I especially liked the part about Ken Starr and his failings in the impeachment of Clinton.

Clinton and Starr are not hot-button issues in California's Gubernatorial Recall campaign.

I, and most Californians, don't give a rip about how this election affects the rest of the country; we have a mess, and we're cleaning it up. On the flip side, we've never expected the rest of the country to bail us out financial hole in which our officials have buried us.

Wasn't really impressed with the rest of the essay either. I found it to be more of the same appeal to conformity, predicated on the notion that my vote is not mine to cast as I please, even if I'm voting for a Republican, even if that Republican wins, but by less than the artificially raised bar the essayist presumes to dictate to me. "Vote for Arnold because more People Magazine readers do" is simply not compelling.

This is a recall and replacement election of the second most powerful elected Executive in the nation. Only South Dakota in 1921 has recalled a governor. We're doing something unique and Historic in this state and in America, and you all are certainly welcome to pull up a chair and watch us do it. However, I've lived in California all my life, and I've got a few ideas as to why this state is screwed up the way it is, because I lived here when it was a much better place.

There's no way I'm going to have my vote stampeded by people who aren't thinking beyond 2004, and who don't have the knowledge or the desire for my State's best interests in them.


306 posted on 08/12/2003 5:49:20 PM PDT by Sabertooth (Where do Arnold and McClintock stand on California Drivers' Licenses for Illegal Aliens?)
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
The intent is that Congress shall not respect religion as an establishment.

LOL.

In other words, Congress is to REMAIN SILENT on all things religious.

Again, LOL. The Constitution requires neutrality not SILENCE. Karl Marx and Josef Stalin required SILENCE.

307 posted on 08/12/2003 5:51:27 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: Howlin
She didn't say YOU couldn't have one; she said she didn't see the need for it.

Yeah, I know which is why I was trying to explain it from mine and the founders view point.

And I certainly wouldn't call PKM any names. We see things alike.

308 posted on 08/12/2003 5:53:10 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: kingu
Native Americans, by and large, worship God. The majority are Catholic, though both the Mormons and the Baptists are making strong inroads. Please don’t let Disney describe the beliefs of a people.

Yes, that is true, but... not to go all lib on you here but, they were BEATEN into Christianity just like the slaves were. There are many Native Americans on the reservations who still practice their original traditions.

309 posted on 08/12/2003 5:53:40 PM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand
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To: PhiKapMom
{Religious conservatives will not win in some states}

Are Frank Keating, J.C. Watts, Ernest Istook, Don Nickles, and James Inhofe losers? The New York Times would consider these people to be members of the vast religious right conspiracy.
310 posted on 08/12/2003 5:54:23 PM PDT by Kuksool (There are no guarantees in the Gray Recall)
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To: Howlin
But isn't it a fact that anything salacious, short of a dead body, won't go over very well with the voters in California?

Not necessarily. If voters were that tolerant we wouldn't be having this recall. As far as anything salacious, you never can tell. California voters may not decide they want that in a governor. For all of California's wierdness, it hasn't been what we've looked for in a governor. Gray Davis and Pete Wilson are a pretty boring group, and previous ones too.

311 posted on 08/12/2003 5:56:51 PM PDT by nickcarraway
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To: jwalsh07
Sorry for the use of legal terminology. "Remain silent" is just what it's called.
312 posted on 08/12/2003 5:57:12 PM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
All that's missing now is your essay titled Force McClintock Out
313 posted on 08/12/2003 5:59:40 PM PDT by hole_n_one
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
Sorry for the use of legal terminology. "Remain silent" is just what it's called.

Are you also sorry for misrepresenting the plain and clear meaning of the "establishment clause"?

314 posted on 08/12/2003 5:59:44 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
{Yes, that is true, but... not to go all lib on you here but, they were BEATEN into Christianity just like the slaves were. There are many Native Americans on the reservations who still practice their original traditions.}

Well, I know of a couple who did suffer beatings when they didn’t act as expected fast enough, but, by and large American Indians have joined Christianity as a matter of choice. The message is a powerful one, and it naturally attracts people. Original traditions are practiced by a minority, a larger number off reservation follow such beliefs, and mostly they’re copying the religions of other tribes. Those beatings you spoke of destroyed all knowledge of many traditional beliefs. It would take a bit of imagining to think of what it might be like to read reports written by disinterested people who only half paid attention, seeking the ‘truth’ that your grandparents followed, or to get some clue as to what their language sounded like. You’re a bit into my area of expertise.
315 posted on 08/12/2003 6:01:12 PM PDT by kingu
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To: PhiKapMom
The other day I finally figured out that the people calling us RINO's are the people threatening not to vote and about time we turned it around on them.

How'd you manage that, since you're not Californian, and aren't voting in our recall election? You're staying home, by law.

Tell you what, I've voted for every Republican nominee on every ballot since I joined the party, and intend to do so next year as well. I've voted for every lousy RNC-approved candidate and losing campaign since 1994, the last time a Republican at the top of the ticket won anything here. I've paid my dues, and I'll cast my vote as I please, for the candidate who I feel is best able to turn my state around. And my vote will go to a Republican.

This, however, is not an election with a primary, it's a recall and replacement election, which means there will be multiple candidates on the ballot, and more than one Republican. To point to a few polls favoring one candidate after less than a week in the campaign and presume that is the equivalent of a primary, and that the very presumption requires California Republicans to fall in now behind that candidate is quite bizarre, and not very republican, or Republican.


316 posted on 08/12/2003 6:01:21 PM PDT by Sabertooth (Where do Arnold and McClintock stand on California Drivers' Licenses for Illegal Aliens?)
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To: Howlin
Yep! Looks like I am going to get called a RINO again -- this time by the 2nd amendment folks because I still don't see a need for someone to own an assault rifle and anyone calling me names isn't going to change that fact.

That's a reach but doesn't surprise me. Some people cannot seem to understand that being against assault weapons is not the same as being a gun grabber! If they have a need for assault weapons, then prove it!

They might as well go all the way and buy a humvee with assault weapons on them. Or better yet, get a tank because the 2nd amendment says they can own any gun they want!

This is unbelieveable -- lifelong Republicans get called RINO's because we are not "pure" conservatives. Who would have thought!


317 posted on 08/12/2003 6:05:18 PM PDT by PhiKapMom (VOTE FOR ARNOLD -- GOP's Best Chance to Tank Hillary for 2004 and beyond!)
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To: hole_n_one
I would never suggest McClintock leave the race. Only Simon. There is room for one traditional conservative on the ballot. He will help bring out the anti-Davis vote. Who will replace Davis doesn't matter a whole lot if we can't get 51% to throw him out. Besides, with the Democrats making public threats to shoot Arnold, we may need a replacement candidate.
318 posted on 08/12/2003 6:06:05 PM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
Legally there is nothing that stops the Government from regulating which arms are and aren't legal. The right to bear arms is quite narrow. That's just the way it is. The Government has to have the ability to regulate it. Otherwise the 2nd Amendment would also guarantee your right to NUCLEAR arms.

Sheesh, where do you get this crap from. The second amendment's intent was for the inactive militia, in those days all men between the ages of 18 and 45, to be armed with the same weapons as the active milita.

In other words, I should be able to have the M-16 I carried in the Army hanging on my gun rack. I didn't carry nuclear weapons. Did you?

319 posted on 08/12/2003 6:06:27 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: justshe; PhiKapMom
20:58:41
320 posted on 08/12/2003 6:09:07 PM PDT by Howlin
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