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Why I Am Now Behind Arnold
me

Posted on 08/12/2003 9:52:14 AM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand

I have slowly come to the conclusion that California needs Arnold. Republicans need Arnold, and above all, California Republicans need Arnold.

I had been leaning towards McClintock, and I must admit, I made that decision before Arnold threw his hat into the ring. I welcomed the move when he did, but I still had reservations. I had gotten pretty excited over McClintock's vision, particularly his desire to void the Davis energy contracts and his general desire to stick it to the Democrats. I was also justifiably concerned at first about Arnold's talk of handing the treasury over to "the children".

But one has to be able to discern politics from policy. Everyone who wants to win elective office has to pay lipservice to "the children". It is the national passtime of politicians. I think when Arnold says "the children should have the first call of state Treasury" it is followed by an unspoken qualifier of "before illegal immigrants, welfare recipients, and special interests." He is simply putting forth his priorities, and they lay in stark contrast to Gray Davis and Cruz Bustamante's. He is quite savvy, so he isn't going to come out and say it in those words. He knows highlighting what is his priorities gets much better press than highlighting what isn't. He wants to reassure the soccer moms who have been frightened by Davis' threats of cutting funding to schools that he will be looking elsewhere to cut.

Arnold is very mindful of the hurdles he faces by running as a Republican in such a liberal state, so he will take extra measures to make traditional Democratic voters feel comfortable voting for him. It is what he has to do right now if he wants to win, and it seems to be working brilliantly.

Some conservatives will argue against Schwarzenegger because he opposed the impeachment of Bill Clinton. But Arnold understood the articles of impeachment that were brought were a pretty weak justification. Right or wrong, they were too easily construed as a right-wing lynching. He recognized it as too divisive and knew it could only further poison the political atmosphere and ultimately damage the Republican party.

Perhaps if Ken Starr had the convictions to pursue the serious matters of Whitewater, Chinagate, Filegate, or the murder of Vincent Foster, then Arnold would have seen it differently, just as the rest of America would have. But clearly Starr had no will to do so. It's hard to understand why, but perhaps he didn't want to expose that level of corruption in the highest office out of the long-term best interest of the American political system. Exposing Clinton's ties to the Dixieland mafia and Red China could have brought the entire government to its knees. It would have been a short-term victory for Republicans, but just as Nixon understood when he covered for Kennedy and Johnson over the Pentagon Papers, the long-term damage to the nation as a whole would have been far too great. Anyways, had Clinton actually been removed from office as a lame duck on those flimsy charges, we would have a President Gore in office right now. Arnold knew, just as everyone else did, that this was not going to happen considering it required a two-thirds majority in the Senate. Surely he understood that impeachment was a lose-lose proposition for Republicans so it was a mistake to go down that road. It was important for him to remain above it all for the sake of his own political future.

Some will argue that what we need right now is someone sort of financial wizard to fix the budget, and Arnold just doesn't qualify. But the truth is we really only need someone who can admit that Gray Davis has made some huge mistakes. Anyone but Gray Davis will do.

I hate to admit it, but the whole budget crisis is being about as overplayed for political reasons as the federal deficit in the '90s was (and is again). When it comes down to brass tacks, I think even the Democrats will bite the bullet and fix it. Yes, I know you're cringing, I am too, but it's the truth. The issue here isn't that the Democrats are incapable or even unwilling to fixing the budget. It's merely about how they want to fix it: the usual liberal approach of skyrocketing taxes. Either way, California isn't going to drop into the ocean or become a third world nation.

As far as Arnold not being a "social conservative", neither am I, and neither is California. A social conservative is not going to win a statewide election here for a long time to come. I fit in more along the lines of a fiscal conservative, just as Arnold is, and a "Constitutional conservative" with libertarian tendencies. Piety is not a prerequisite for my support, and too much of it may even lose it. I don't begrudge anyone their religious beliefs, but I do belive strongly in Jefferson's "wall of seperation between church and state". I also believe in strict interpritation of the First Ammendment, and that freedom of religion also entails freedom from religion. I realize those of you in the religious-right do not agree because this doesn't reinforce your personal religious beliefs, but not everything should be about our own personal whims and narrow agendas. Defending our own freedom as individuals must always be a higher objective. Otherwise it may be you they come for next. The Constitution protects everyone, or it protects no one. I think there are a lot of people on both extremes who forget that sometimes.

Even though some will say for these various reasons that Schwarzenegger is not the ideal conservative candidate, it is important for everyone to be pragmatic and pick their battles wisely. Right now we should be looking at long-term goals. An expedient victory in the recall of a conservative candidate by a 20 percent plurality is going to be counterproductive in the long-term. What are you going to do when Bill Simon is elected and the drive to recall him begins October 8th and qualifies three weeks later?

Electing Arnold, who can come to office with a true mandate and bring California together, will pay off big in the perception wars. Conservatives will never get their agenda anywhere in California as long as it is taboo to even vote for Republicans here. The longer Democrats have a complete lock on the state, the further left we will drift. Even if Arnold can't change the course right away, he can at least slow the momentum.

Personally, my goal is the destruction of the Democratic party and the liberal agenda far more than it is advancing any conservative single-issue. I have far more hate for left-wing Democrats than I have love for right-wing Republicans. I would be happy simply with a return to sanity at this point.

You can't walk a mile until you take the first step. For right now we all need to be concentrating on the jouney one step at a time or we will never reach the final destination. You have to at least open the door, which is now closed and locked here. It seems like a lot of right-wingers around here would rather rant and rave and pound on the door in futility than grab it by the handle.

I think I've finally figured that one out. For the death-before-electibility crowd, it's not about advancing their cause on earth, it's about earning a place in heaven.

As for the rest of us, we have to make a decision: do we want a small victory, or a huge defeat?


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: 1eternalvignotincali; california; davis; election; governor; guessmyotherid; imatroll; mcclintock; recall; schwarzenegger; schwarzenutter
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To: EternalVigilance
In the name of Jesus, I should support a pro-death, homo-loving Leftist?

It doesn't matter who we support. We don't get to vote, you and I.

241 posted on 08/12/2003 4:34:18 PM PDT by sinkspur (Get a dog! He'll change your life!)
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To: EternalVigilance
"I didn't realize before this how many 'electibility-before-principle' types had come to inhabit FR."

Just stick an (R) before a celebrity candidate's name -- any name -- and RINOs will regard it as the Second Coming...

Let's try it: 'Alec Baldwin(R) For Governor.'

"Hey -- looks goooood...."

242 posted on 08/12/2003 4:34:22 PM PDT by F16Fighter
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To: Torie
Ya, I know McClintock is a longshot right now. So what?

Fine, but you're gonna miss the Kool-aid chugging contest.


243 posted on 08/12/2003 4:34:24 PM PDT by Sabertooth (Where do Arnold and McClintock stand on California Drivers' Licenses for Illegal Aliens?)
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To: F16Fighter
Hey, he's a shoo-in!

Can't imagine how his platform could be any worse than the current hero of the hacks.
244 posted on 08/12/2003 4:35:43 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: EternalVigilance
It's the new gop.

It's now the Al Davis republican party..........

Who cares about principle, or character, or doing what's right...................

Just WIN baby !!!
245 posted on 08/12/2003 4:37:07 PM PDT by WhiteGuy (Deficit $455,000,000,000 + MY VOTE IS FOR SALE)
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To: EternalVigilance
It's the new gop.

It's now the Al Davis republican party..........

Who cares about principle, or character, or doing what's right...................

Just WIN baby !!!
246 posted on 08/12/2003 4:37:20 PM PDT by WhiteGuy (Deficit $455,000,000,000 + MY VOTE IS FOR SALE)
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To: WhiteGuy
:-(
247 posted on 08/12/2003 4:38:02 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: EternalVigilance
You guys have been trashing people over this for a week.

Have I called you Fred Phelps? Maybe I ought to call you Fred Phelps for a while, and see how you like it. Comparing Schwarzenegger to Mengele is vile, which is waht I was reacting to..

And, if I compare the two camps, I don't see anybody trashing McClintock; they're just saying he can't win.

You do nothing but point to Arnold's pro-choice stance, and act as if the governor of California is going to be able to do anything about abortion anyway.

I'm sorry your guy's losing, but you seem to have a propensity to tie yourself to nags who bring up the rear.

248 posted on 08/12/2003 4:40:12 PM PDT by sinkspur (Get a dog! He'll change your life!)
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To: Ann Archy
"Tom McClintock can NOT get elected...."

If McClintock could explain just how he would get the Unions and other state workers to accept a 9.5% cut, I might consider voting for him. Not to mention how do you "merely" suspend a mandate ?

From his website -"Thus, merely suspending these mandates and reducing current expenditures by 9.5 percent – and then holding at that level for 18 months – ...."
249 posted on 08/12/2003 4:41:35 PM PDT by RS (nc)
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To: EternalVigilance
Why don't you knock off that "homo-loving" crap; there are people on this board that actually HAVE gays in their families or KNOW gays in their real lives.
250 posted on 08/12/2003 4:42:43 PM PDT by Howlin
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To: EternalVigilance
One million plus Republicans voted for Keyes in 2000.

hahahaha!
That is nationwide, out of something like 60 million registered Republicans!

251 posted on 08/12/2003 4:45:03 PM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand
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To: sinkspur
I have pointed out a whole range of issues that Schwarzenegger holds that are, or should be, anathema to Republicans--not just the fact that he is pro-death.

As to losing nags, it all depends on what you consider to be 'winning'. Electing liberals doesn't qualify, at least to me.

Good evening.
252 posted on 08/12/2003 4:47:01 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: Howlin
Why don't you knock off that "homo-loving" crap; there are people on this board that actually HAVE gays in their families or KNOW gays in their real lives.

Yes, or there may even be some Log Cabin Republicans around.
Wait, they're just a bunch of RINOs too. If they were "true conservatives" they would persecute themselves. ;-)

253 posted on 08/12/2003 4:47:59 PM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand
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To: nyconse; DrMartinVonNostrand
"The key point here is this-getting a Republican elected is what is important. "

This is where you're wrong. Putting a Republican in the governorship accomplishes nothing if the state continues it's downhill slide. If anything it's *better* for Democrats that this happens, because this absolves them from responsibility for the policies that drove California down. After all, the Republicans can do no better.

A conservative, however, will do better, and create the sort of soul-searching that will persuade Californians that maybe everything they "know" about conservatives is a lie.

"Not really-Bloomberg is a Democrat who only changed his party so he could run in the Republican primary-less crowded field."

I submit it is the same thing because "Democrat" or "Republican" are only gross labels. The philosophical approach toward politics should be the determining factor.

It's not the "R" or "D" at the end of the name that deserves the vote. It is the candidates' underpinning principles that drive their choices as your representatives that determine your vote.

This is why many of us do not understand why Riordan was even on the primary ballot...the philosophical underpinnings of his politics are NO DIFFERENT THAN THOSE OF DAVIS.
254 posted on 08/12/2003 4:48:04 PM PDT by Maelstrom (To prevent misinterpretation or abuse of the Constitution:The Bill of Rights limits government power)
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To: EternalVigilance
'You can claim to be pro-gun til your face turns blue, but when you empower politicians who despise our God-given unalienable rights, you are in any case functionally anti-gun/anti-self-defense.'

God now wrote the constitution? I suppose it is also a God-given unalienable right for gang-bangers to drive through my neighborhood using a piece of crud to spit out fifty bullets faster than they can think of the answer to 2+2?

I’ve got nine rifles, three revolvers and one semi-auto. My kid has a pump shotgun. I can’t even keep track of what all my wife has. Do I care if you’re denied an AR-15? Not in the slightest. Does that mean I’m anti-gun? According to your guide, I must be, since I want to deny you the holy machinegun.
255 posted on 08/12/2003 4:48:35 PM PDT by kingu
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To: Howlin
Sorry for my gross insensitivity to the homo-lo...er...people on this board that actually HAVE gays in their families or KNOW gays in their real lives.
256 posted on 08/12/2003 4:49:49 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: EternalVigilance
Spoken with true sensitivity, I can see. Par for the course.
257 posted on 08/12/2003 4:52:19 PM PDT by Howlin
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
If I have to pick a side, I'll pick the side where people aren't so damn judgmental.
258 posted on 08/12/2003 4:53:34 PM PDT by Howlin
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
That is nationwide, out of something like 60 million registered Republicans!

Yes, and you aren't fit to untie their shoelaces.

Without them, the GOP would have not a bit of backbone left in it. It would be as useless as a jellyfish...RAT Party II.

Just what we need.

By the way, there were about 20 million who voted in the 2000 primaries.

259 posted on 08/12/2003 4:54:18 PM PDT by EternalVigilance
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To: sinkspur
"A truly stupid and insipid remark. Did you get dropped on your head on a runway somewhere?"

LOL -- it's been awhile since we've had a make-out session ;-)

"What the hell is the matter with you McClintocks? Just read through this thread and see who's spewing the most bile, who's quick with the insults, who trashes anyone who disagrees with them."

Quite frankly, a whole lot of us are "insulted" that Hollywood poseurs of principle and conservatism AND their respective rabid supporters demand that we ALL fall in line for the sake of that one itty-bitty sacred initial -- (R).

My apologies to Aaah-noldphiliacs -- I'm NOT getting on my knees.

260 posted on 08/12/2003 4:54:33 PM PDT by F16Fighter
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