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Bush supports 'intelligent design'
MyrtleBeach Online ^ | 02 August 2005 | Ron Hutcheson

Posted on 08/02/2005 4:16:26 AM PDT by PatrickHenry

President Bush waded into the debate over evolution and "intelligent design" Monday, saying schools should teach both theories on the creation and complexity of life.

In a wide-ranging question-and-answer session with a small group of reporters, Bush essentially endorsed efforts by Christian conservatives to give intelligent design equal standing with the theory of evolution in the nation's schools.

Bush declined to state his personal views on "intelligent design," the belief that life forms are so complex that their creation cannot be explained by Darwinian evolutionary theory alone, but rather points to intentional creation, presumably divine.

The theory of evolution, first articulated by British naturalist Charles Darwin in 1859, is based on the idea that life organisms developed over time through random mutations and factors in nature that favored certain traits that helped species survive.

Scientists concede that evolution does not answer every question about the creation of life, and most consider intelligent design an attempt to inject religion into science courses.

Bush compared the current debate to earlier disputes over "creationism," a related view that adheres more closely to biblical explanations. While he was governor of Texas, Bush said students should be exposed to both creationism and evolution.

On Monday, the president said he favors the same approach for intelligent design "so people can understand what the debate is about."

The Kansas Board of Education is considering changes to encourage the teaching of intelligent design in Kansas schools, and some are pushing for similar changes across the country.

"I think that part of education is to expose people to different schools of thought," Bush said. "You're asking me whether or not people ought to be exposed to different ideas. The answer is 'yes.'"

The National Academy of Sciences and the American Association for the Advancement of Science both have concluded there is no scientific basis for intelligent design and oppose its inclusion in school science classes. [Note from PH: links relevant to those organizations and their positions on ID are added by me at the end of this article.]

Some scientists have declined to join the debate, fearing that amplifying the discussion only gives intelligent design more legitimacy.

Advocates of intelligent design also claim support from scientists. The Discovery Institute, a conservative think tank in Seattle that is the leading proponent for intelligent design, said it has compiled a list of more than 400 scientists, including 70 biologists, who are skeptical about evolution.

"The fact is that a significant number of scientists are extremely skeptical that Darwinian evolution can explain the origins of life," said John West, associate director of the organization's Center for Science and Culture.


[Links inserted by PH:]
Letter from Bruce Alberts on March 4, 2005. President of the National Academy of Sciences.
AAAS Board Resolution on Intelligent Design Theory.
Statements from Scientific and Scholarly Organizations. Sixty statements, all supporting evolution.


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: bush; bush43; crevolist; darwinisdead; evolution; intelligentdesign; science; scienceeducation
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To: Blzbba
First and foremost...and like all politicians, Bush is one.

And usually a damn good one at that. But, yeah, you're right about that.

261 posted on 08/02/2005 8:30:46 AM PDT by Rudder
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To: PatrickHenry

So, why do we have a Coccyx if it´s not from a tail our ape-ancestors still have?

I don´t know who created life in general, but I do know that humans evolved from apes, and that the first living creatures on earth were in the sea.

Everything else is subject to belief.


262 posted on 08/02/2005 8:31:21 AM PDT by Michael81Dus
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To: JeffAtlanta

I would be interested in anyone's interpretation of how the Bible says slavery is okay. Any takers?


263 posted on 08/02/2005 8:32:00 AM PDT by mlc9852
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To: Asphalt
There weren't millions of people in the Exodus, regardless of what Scripture says. There may have been a few tens of thousands.

As you might have gleaned, I do not accept the inerrancy of Scripture. Those words have been through too many retellings to have any resemblance to their originals.

And, before you get into a high dudgeon about this lack of acceptance at face value of what claims to be the Word of God (a circular argument if I ever heard one), please note my comments that any interpretation of Scripture I accept must conform to reality.

264 posted on 08/02/2005 8:32:03 AM PDT by Junior (Just because the voices in your head tell you to do things doesn't mean you have to listen to them)
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To: ThinkPlease

Do I read on this thread that the ID supporters are not necessarily a majority on FR?


265 posted on 08/02/2005 8:32:04 AM PDT by Michael81Dus
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To: PatrickHenry

I saw this on google very early in the morning (GMT). I searched for "intelligent design" and at first there were just two news sites running the story. I thought "uh oh.." and just hoped it wouldn't spread, but when I checked again an hour or so later there were a couple of dozen new sites running it. A few hours after that it filled the first 8 pages on google news and a neon word "darn" appeared in my head.

But I think this is blown out of proportion. It's probably been mentioned already but notice how Bush is clever enough to subtley divert the question:

"You're asking me whether or not people ought to be exposed to different ideas. The answer is 'yes.'""

Notice he didn't say that such non-science ideas should be taught in science classes though :) Very clever dodge.


266 posted on 08/02/2005 8:32:08 AM PDT by bobdsmith
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To: JohnnyM

I am aware that there is a small majority of Americans who believe in creation. Many of them also accept evolution, at least up to man.

Facts are not decided by voting, though.


267 posted on 08/02/2005 8:33:23 AM PDT by From many - one.
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To: Michael_Michaelangelo
I don't know, Jeff; perhaps you will enlighten us all.

Wow, you guys are really mature. What is next? Are you going to start saying "I know you are but what am I"?

BTW, I see that you totally ignored the points in my post. (1)Your list of 400 is bogus and (2)The number of ID clubs is vastly surpassed by the number of gay or even video game clubs.

268 posted on 08/02/2005 8:34:40 AM PDT by JeffAtlanta
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To: bobdsmith
But I think this is blown out of proportion.

Perhaps, but the MSM knows a "good thing" when it sees one. This is going to be big in forthcoming elections.

I suppose we should look at the bright side. There won't be too many people asking why we have these threads on FR any more.

269 posted on 08/02/2005 8:35:44 AM PDT by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas. The List-O-Links is at my homepage.)
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To: mlc9852

No.

Changing the subject, are we?


270 posted on 08/02/2005 8:36:06 AM PDT by From many - one.
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To: Right Wing Professor
What kind of educator are you? let me guess, not in science.

Most people of religion seek to have their doctrine taught in schools but would exclude any other religion. I have long thought that Christianity should be examined in schools along with Islam, Judaism, Hinduism Buddhism, Greek Mythology, and Atheist ism. They should be examined for origin, intellectual thought, purpose and agenda. They should not be taught as science but could be taught as folklore.
271 posted on 08/02/2005 8:36:13 AM PDT by jec41 (Screaming Eagle)
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To: JeffAtlanta
Those scientists signed a paper stating: “we are skeptical of claims for the ability of random mutation and natural selection to account for the complexity of life.”

Are you saying those scientists are lying, Jeff?

272 posted on 08/02/2005 8:37:17 AM PDT by Michael_Michaelangelo (The best theory is not ipso facto a good theory. Lots of links on my homepage...)
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To: PatrickHenry
Scientists concede that evolution does not answer every question about the creation of life...

Evolution does NOT address the creation of life. That theory is called abiogenesis.

What a poorly written article.
273 posted on 08/02/2005 8:37:53 AM PDT by Tequila25
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To: TonyRo76
My list of "discarded cr@p" actually comprises old Evolutionist lies that were finally deemed too transparent to keep defending, so they got jettisoned.

So, who disproved these various items you mentioned? Was it creationists or evolutionists?

And what does that tell you?

274 posted on 08/02/2005 8:38:13 AM PDT by Modernman ("A conservative government is an organized hypocrisy." -Disraeli)
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To: From many - one.

I'm not changing the subject. The subject is what we all think about President Bush promoting creationism. I think it's wonderful. Sorry you disagree.


275 posted on 08/02/2005 8:39:04 AM PDT by mlc9852
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To: ConsentofGoverned
For evolution to work to explain life we must make one leap of faith

Sorry, but evolution does not even attempt to explain the origin of life.

I suggest you find out what a theory is about before you start criticizing it. That way, you can avoid making an ass of yourself.

276 posted on 08/02/2005 8:39:04 AM PDT by curiosity
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To: Junior

That is precisely my point. And it shows that you are missing it entirely.

That is not what Scripture attributes the parting of the Red Sea to...it attributes it to the overwhelming and decidedly non-natural power of God Almighty, acting on behalf of His people, just as He told Abraham that He would. (Read the psalms and subsequent recollections of this event thoughout the Bible...it is not remembered as some sort of wind). Moreover, parting it a bit would not have allowed the million or so Jews leave on dry ground, which is how it is described. Nothing in the history of the natural world occurs like that. And then...interestingly...it flooded back to kill most of the Egyptian army. I doubt if the French researchers can account for that timing.

Finally....that is only one single example. These episodes occur throughout Scripture. Read the book of Daniel, for example. The examples would number in the thousands.

A naturalistic interpretation of Scripture is not an interpretation. It is a renunciation of Scripture.

You are free to reject Scripture. But don't reject its heart and sould and pretend that you aren't.


277 posted on 08/02/2005 8:39:14 AM PDT by ConservativeDude
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To: jec41; Right Wing Professor
What kind of educator are you? let me guess, not in science.

Bzzzt! Wrong!

278 posted on 08/02/2005 8:39:22 AM PDT by RadioAstronomer (Senior member of Darwin Central)
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To: Tribune7
There are no scientitic reasons to oppose ID -- only religious ones.

I can't accept that statement. If ID moves from hypothesis to a potentially falsifiable theory, there'd still be plenty of scientific reasons to oppose it ... just as there are plenty of scientific reasons to oppose most scientific theories. If there weren't, our understanding of physics, chemistry, and biology would never have improved.

Scientists should ALWAYS be allowed to question existing scientific theory and hypotheses --- even their own! --- in fact, it is necessary that this happens for science to be "science".

And before anyone states that this is why ID should be taught in schools, please understand that the scientific community wants issues that rise to the level of SCIENTIFIC theory be taught ...

I mean, I was taught multiple theories on why earth has a moon (captured by earth's gravity, chuck of the earth itself), so science definitely allows for multiple theories to be taught ... but not just ANYTHING. For instance, I couldn't say the moon was a paper-mache project I created in 2nd grade and taped to the sky ... as that theory is disproven by current evidence. For instance, I was a slacker in 2nd grade and didn't do my work.

279 posted on 08/02/2005 8:39:49 AM PDT by bobhoskins (And I couldn;t reach that high.)
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To: JeffAtlanta

I don't know exactly. In the

Your friend Junior will no doubt giive ou the evolutionist indoctrination


280 posted on 08/02/2005 8:40:16 AM PDT by Asphalt (Join my NFL ping list! FReepmail me| The best things in life aren't things)
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