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As conservatives, we really need to think through how "socialized" we have become.
1 posted on 01/02/2005 8:50:12 AM PST by worldclass
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To: worldclass

Absolutely true. However, quite a number of misguided folks will not welcome your wise message.


2 posted on 01/02/2005 8:51:13 AM PST by neutrino (Globalization “is the economic treason that dare not speak its name.” (173))
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To: worldclass
There is nothing necessarily 'unconstitutional' about elective use of Federal money unless the action is expressly forbidden by the USC.

Such an action is more accurately 'extra-constitutional.' Not expressly forbidden but not officially mandated, either. That doesn't mean that it's unconstitutional.

Making stuff like this a constitutional issue only makes our side look as bad as the other side, which loves making all sorts of issues into Constitutional issues when they can't win at the ballot box. Bad thing.

The Feds can choose to give disaster relief or not, and either course of action is perfectly constitutional. Arguing anything else is silly.
8 posted on 01/02/2005 8:55:19 AM PST by HitmanLV (HitmanNY has a brand new Blog!! Please Visit! - http://www.goldust.com/weblog -)
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To: worldclass
The President has usurped a massive amount of Americans' good-natured character/good will. $350 million dollars reflects very well on the U.S. government. All of that has been usurped from the taxpayers.

Had the President put it to a vote of the people he likely would have gotten a 'yes' to give aid. In that way it would have been the people's good will that would receive it's just deserved recognition for their compassion.

It is wrong, very wrong for the President/government to usurp what is rightfully each individual person's deeply personal ethical concerns on doing right by their own conscience.

It sickens me that the government can so easily usurp such personal and integral-to-the-individual essence of character. 

President Bush needs to address the people regarding this very important aspect.

-- Side note: consider how often politicians and bureaucrats spend your money to make themselves look good.

11 posted on 01/02/2005 8:56:19 AM PST by Zon (Honesty outlives the lie, spin and deception -- It always has -- It always will.)
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To: worldclass

According to the Constitution the Congress (House of Representatives) must initiate and then the Senate must agree on any spending or allocation of funds. As I understand it the Congress gave the President authority to spend X dollars on disaster relief. The 350 million dollars just about wipes out the allocation. If more is spent then congress will have to initiate and then pass a bill authorizing the expenditure of additional funds.


12 posted on 01/02/2005 8:56:35 AM PST by YOUGOTIT
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To: worldclass



So......... who is making the popcorn...?


14 posted on 01/02/2005 8:57:40 AM PST by SouthernFreebird
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To: worldclass
(Excerpt) Read more at peroutka2004.com...

2004? Hey spoiler-boy, the election's over. I think you lost or something. It was in all the papers.

19 posted on 01/02/2005 9:03:06 AM PST by inkling
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To: worldclass

How much does this aid work out to be per citizen? One dollar? Or two? Does Peroutka think we have control over every bit of our tax dollars? While we are at it, I personally think my school taxes are a waste educating the little sh*t that stole my car. How about that? If we're going to start discussing how our taxes are being used, we should do it in a logical fashion and one that is realistic. Sometimes folks like Peroutka can be a bit unrealistic.


21 posted on 01/02/2005 9:03:22 AM PST by cyborg (http://mentalmumblings.blogspot.com/)
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To: worldclass
Davy Crockett again?

If "conservatives" think President Bush is wrong here, and I think Congressman Crockett was right, they best be thinking of the hundred plus years this garbage has been going on, and place the blame squarely where it belongs.

At the feet of the American voter.

25 posted on 01/02/2005 9:04:42 AM PST by G.Mason (A war mongering, UN hating, military industrial complex loving, Al Qaeda incinerating American.)
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To: worldclass

So Americans are more charitable than other nations.. big deal. If you want you can agitate for a billl making it illegal to send aid to foriegn nations for disaster relief. Good luck lobbying for this bill. Somehow I don't think the majority will support you. Democracy in action.


28 posted on 01/02/2005 9:06:12 AM PST by blurb
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To: worldclass

Fair enough, and this will become even more relevant as the scope of aid...exactly what, when, and where, and for how long...becomes evident. Some of these devastated countries are not our friends, too. A great deal to ponder.


37 posted on 01/02/2005 9:09:50 AM PST by hershey
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To: worldclass

Oh brother, just how many votes did this supposedly christian man get? Peroutka had no problem letting the state take care of his step daughters. He had no problem keeping their social security checks even while they were in state foster care.

The constitution party is a great big joke. They also make conservative christians look bad.


52 posted on 01/02/2005 9:15:33 AM PST by CajunConservative
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To: worldclass

Peroutka. LOL


58 posted on 01/02/2005 9:17:00 AM PST by Petronski (I'm not *always* cranky.)
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To: worldclass
Surely something involved must cross state lines somewhere.... /sarcasm
63 posted on 01/02/2005 9:18:06 AM PST by thoughtomator (Flush twice, it's a long way to France)
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To: worldclass

Absolutely true, the federal govt has no right to exceed the authority GIVEN it by the people within the limited guidelines of the Constitution. Good luck getting the FEDGOV to live within the constraints of the "Law of the Land". The most ironic part of this whole story, is the govt borrowed this money to give away to people that will end up in the pockets of every crook with sticky fingers.


78 posted on 01/02/2005 9:24:10 AM PST by jeremiah (Either take the gloves off of our troops, or let them come home NOW)
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To: worldclass
blah blah blah........blah


As conservatives we should also do away with publicly funded highways too right? No government official has constitutional authority to fund such things.

There should be an island somewhere for people with views such as yours. Then again, the rest of us may have to move there with you someday, who knows. lol.
93 posted on 01/02/2005 9:29:33 AM PST by KoRn
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To: worldclass

Apparently most Freepers think that the President does have the power to give millions away even if the cause may be just. However, it is not stated in the Constitution anywhere that the President indeed does have this power. Therefore, he does not have the Constitutional right to do so, if you disagree show me where you think the Constitution does give him that power. The American people have always been among the most generous in the world, and therefore, it should be left up solely to the American people to provide for disaster relief, both abroad and at home. If we were to make it an explicit Constitutional amendment then the amount America donated for disaster relief could not be used as a weapon by either foreign entities (Bush and America are stingy etc.) or political parties (Republicans are mean people). Sad that so many Freepers really don't get the fact that they are CINO's (conservative in name only). Because basically they are good people whom I often agree with, but not on this issue. SORRY, that's my view and I am sticking to it.


96 posted on 01/02/2005 9:30:52 AM PST by Robert DeLong
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To: worldclass

Paging Ragnar Danneskjold, please pick up the white courtesy phone...


102 posted on 01/02/2005 9:32:49 AM PST by RobFromGa (End the Filibuster for Judicial appointments in January 05)
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To: worldclass
>>>>As conservatives, we really need to think through how "socialized" we have become.

This didn't start just yesterday. Over the last 40 years, the federal government has given us higher taxes, social welfare spending to the tune of $7-trillion and an ever expanding bureaucracy. Over the last 25 years, conservatives have led the charge to reduce the burdens of government on the American taxpayer. The job is far from over.

105 posted on 01/02/2005 9:34:04 AM PST by Reagan Man ("Don't let the bastards grind you down." General "Vinegar Joe" Stilwell)
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To: worldclass
The criticism of federal disaster aid and most of the current federal budget as constitutionally improper is politically idiotic and contrary to settled constitutional law as fashioned by generations of federal judges, Congresses, Presidents, and elections. The sole virtue of the argument is that it is correct as a matter of original intent. Yet that is irrelevant today unless you can convince the country as a matter of public policy that we can and should return to the original implicit limitations on the role of the federal government. That is not going to happen anytime soon, but the impending financial and demographic collapse of the modern welfare state in Europe and the US will prompt a reexamination of the role of government. That is going to be a long, nasty fight and Jeremiahs will gain more of an audience as the federal pantry goes bare.
115 posted on 01/02/2005 9:37:54 AM PST by Rockingham
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To: worldclass
The real issue here is whether such so-called Federally-funded disaster “relief” is Constitutional. And the answer is very clear: No, it is not. There isn’t the slightest Constitutional authority for Federal tax dollars to be spent for disaster “relief.” Thus, any such expenditure of Federal tax dollars for disaster “relief” --- foreign or domestic --- is illegal, unlawful.

President Washington sided with Hamilton versus Jeffeerson on the interpretation of the "necessary and proper" clause in the 18th Century when he signed the Act creating the First Bank of the United States. This interpretation has been consistently upheld for over two hundred years. Thus, the answer to the question posed in this article is clear: Yes, it is lawful. Nobody with even the slightest connection to reality would even argue the point. To argue the point in an attempt to shut off disaster relief to people who would otherwise die of disease is just cruel. To argue that the same principle would apply to deny disaster relief domestically is, frankly, insane.

Any politician or judge who tried to block disaster relief for 9-11 would be run out of office.

This article is a disgrace.

121 posted on 01/02/2005 9:39:38 AM PST by You Dirty Rats
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