You are hate anti-war persons?

Why do you hate anti-war protestors? And why are you offended by the efforts of France, Germany, and Russia to block the actions of the US which may lead to war against Iraq? Who is the real culprit here? Let's see: What country has been, and remains, the main source of money for Islamic terrorists? Saudi Arabia. What citizenship was held by the majority of Islamic Terrorists? Saudi Arabia. Where was Osama bin Laden born? Saudi Arabia. Where are the business interests of Osama bin Laden, businesses which nourish him financially? Saudi Arabia. Which country only one week ago made a direct threat of war to the US? Not Iraq, but North Korea. North Korea represents a much bigger threat than Iraq, but all of your naval ships are now in the Red Sea, not in the Yellow Sea. Why are you picking only on Iraq? Why can't Americans and George W. Bush think about the consequences (to the Iraqi people) of this escalation? Will a war against Iraq be fruitful in any way? Will a coup de grace against Sadam Hussein magically reduce the threat of terrorism to nil? (Even if we remove Sadam Hussein from power, we will still face about the same level of terrorist threat from other sources, so why pursue him?)

Although the Bush administration does not talk about it at length, if at all, the dividends of taking out the Saddam regime in Iraq will be:
1) The significant likelihood that the Iranian people will unseat their Mullahs (it is generally conceded that Iran is the home office of Islamic terrorism).
2) The Saudis, and with them the lesser Arab rulers, will be cowed. They will now know definitively, that the US will back it's threats with action. They will understand that they must either cease supporting Islamic terrorism or face Saddam's fate.
3) In short, the US will be feared in the region.
If all of the above smacks of ugly power politics, so be it. The alternative is a gauranteed repeat of 9/11.

Because we do one thing at a time over here and actually get some where as opposed to trying to do everything at once and getting no where.

First Afghanistan for harboring terrorists, now Iraq for harboring terrorists, then either Iran (harboring terrorists) or North Korea (being a terrorist). Pretty soon nations that might harbor terrorists are going to get the idea that doing so could be hazardous to their health.

Countries that support terrorists with weapons and money are going to get the idea as well. We can't wipeout every nut case with a grudge. But we can cut off their access to funds, weapons and safe harbors.

Anything else you would like to know?

All your bases are belong to us.

Sorry for my English.

Thanks to Naked Lunch for translate my post :)

To Harmless Teddy Bear:

___First Afghanistan for harboring terrorists,___

yes, it’s right – Afghanistan been good harbor for terrorist. Especially after USA spend some billions of bucks for help Osama-like leaders. Build a Tora-Bora complex, as example. But it’s been old history – cold war, “foe of our foe is our friend”, etc. You done good work in Afghanistan, really.

___now Iraq for harboring terrorists__

Oh, yes? Did you know that OBL call upon to attack Saddam's regime, because from his point of view it’s a untrue, anti-Islamic power. And where a proofs of your assertion? In case of Afghanistan we all seen that OBL been there. Now we only heard about “rumors”, “secret information”, “circumstantial evidence”. Weapon of mass distraction? Where? Do you believe that Iraq can build A-bomb or bio-weapon and hide all this industry under “unsleeping eye” of satellites?

I understand you fears. I know that Saddam is ugly and unprincipled leader, little Stalin the Middle East. But do you know one quote – “too often a victor of dragon turn into dragon.
On next week or next day, may be next month your sophisticated forces will make a slaughter for thousands of young Iraqi men inside old tanks. All their crime is that they born on wrong place, in wrong time.

PS
If you’ll done job in N.Korea, job which you promised to us in your post – it will be much more useful.

Sorry for my English again.

All your bases are belong to us.

Can you explain?

You done good work in Afghanistan, really.

Actually we did. Nice to know that you recognize it.

As for Iraq harboring terrorist that is an established fact. Ever hear of a guy called Abu Nidal? You do know that Saddam pays $25,000 for suicide bombers?

Weapon of mass distraction? Where? Do you believe that Iraq can build A-bomb or bio-weapon and hide all this industry under “unsleeping eye” of satellites?

Where is the proof? Iraq admitted it! Go here read the story. You know that he used poison gas against the Kurds in 1996?

On next week or next day, may be next month your sophisticated forces will make a slaughter for thousands of young Iraqi men inside old tanks. All their crime is that they born on wrong place, in wrong time.

And if we do nothing in the next few months we will be facing them anyway at some point. A half million Iraqi people have died because of Saddam already. Burned with acid, eyes gouged out. All because they happened to be born in the wrong place at the wrong time.

The young men you feel such compassion for have more then likely helped kill more Iraqis then the US ever will. They will, if they surrender, be treated quite gently.

No honeybabe you don’t understand. You have no idea. And you don’t want to. But that is okay. We will as usual clean up this little mess for you.

Rover Young signed up 2002-08-31.
This account has been banned.

Why banned? bad english?!?!? He seems far from rude.

Seems the questions are the usual ones the antiwar folks pose, I'll post an answer.

"Why do you hate anti-war protestors?"

hate is too strong. those who want the Iraqi regime disarmed know that Saddam Hussein gets aid and comfort from these protests - it is why Iraqi TV showed hours and hours of such coverage. We know that it actually make war MORE likely because it (incorrectly) makes Saddam think our resolve is not strong and leads him to beleive he need not really disarm. Iraq's raction to UN inspections has waxed and waned based on international resolve (or lack of resolve) and unfortunately, it is now too late. Iraq hasnt disarmed, it has deceived.

"And why are you offended by the efforts of France, Germany, and Russia to block the actions of the US which may lead to war against Iraq?"

see above. Without removing Saddam from power, there will be no real disarmament of his weapons of mass destruction. And he cannot be trusted with them. In truth, the biggest weapon of mass destruction in Iraq is Saddam Hussein himself.

" Who is the real culprit here? Let's see: What country has been, and remains, the main source of money for Islamic terrorists? Saudi Arabia."

As others have posted the *government* of Iraq has had significant terrorist links, like Abu Nidal, like support for palestinian terrorism, like the Salman Pak terrorist training camp south of baghdad, like the 500 Al Ansar brigade members which are assasinating kurdish leaders at saddam's behest, and are tied to Al Quaeda, like his offers to harbor Bin Laden in the late 1990s and his harobiring of several Al Aquaeda terrorists, inclduing the one who organized euroepan terror cells and was behind the killing of an american diplomat in Jordan. Go back and listen to the Powell Feb 5 speech where some (not all) of this was laid out.

Iraq has been behind terrorist attacks on our soil btw, the WTC attack in 1993.

" What citizenship was held by the majority of Islamic Terrorists? Saudi Arabia. Where was O:sama bin Laden born? Saudi Arabia. Where are the business interests of Osama bin Laden, businesses which nourish him financially? Saudi Arabia."

True but not relevent. It's the countries whose Governments *harbor* terrorists that count - in this case, first Afghanistan, and now Iraq.

" Which country only one week ago made a direct threat of war to the US? Not Iraq, but North Korea. North Korea represents a much bigger threat than Iraq, but all of your naval ships are now in the Red Sea, not in the Yellow Sea."

So is your point that we should militarily attack North Korea? What are your conditions on when you think US can legitimately attack? Would you agree or disagree that in N Korea we should try multilateral diplomacy first?

" Why are you picking only on Iraq? "

I dont think Taliban would agree with "picking only on Iraq". Are there other countries you think the US *should* attack?

"Why can't Americans and George W. Bush think about the consequences (to the Iraqi people) of this escalation?"

They have and so have Iraqi refugees. They say with clear voices that removing Saddam will be a liberation of Iraq. It will free the people of Iraq from the tyranny of saddam hussein, who has killed nearly a million Kurds in the brutal genocide known as Anfal, who has killed thousands upone thousand of Iraqis has political prisoners, who tortures and denies basic human rights. How can a people want such a thug to stay as their leader. He is a monster, and the Iraqi people will welcome 'regime change', however it happens.

' Will a war against Iraq be fruitful in any way?"

Yes. It will remove weapons of mass destruction from a rogue state. It will sever the terrorist ties that Saddam has with terror groups and give the terrorists one less hiding place. It will free the Iraqi people from a brutal and violent dictator, and free

"Will a coup de grace against Sadam Hussein magically reduce the threat of terrorism to nil?"

Um, no, but this is known as a "strawman" argument, where you project an unreasonable contention on the 'other' side of the debate. Nobody is saying that terrorism goes away with this regime change. Nor with any regime change. BUT, just as removing the Taliban from Afghanistan was a major VICTORY against tyranny and terrorism, so too when we remove Saddam Hussein from power.

"(Even if we remove Sadam Hussein from power, we will still face about the same level of terrorist threat from other sources, so why pursue him?)"

This is not so. First, as point out above there are
significant areas where Saddam has supported terrorists.
Second, saddam Hussein has had links to MANY TERROR GROUPS and he has had a VERY SOPHISTICATED INTELLIGENCE SERVICE. What I am saying is that we may find HUGE AND VALUABLE INTELLIGENCE about all of the terrorist organizations, even beyond those groups that Saddam directly supported.
This will help us win the war on terrorism.

Here is a hint: There is well-organized opposition to this war, it is true. But ask yourself WHO? Who is really behind these protests (hint, some are funded by Iraq itself) Then ask WHY? WHY WOULD RUSSIA AND FRANCE NOT WANT US GOING TO BAGHDAD AND OPENING UP THOSE INTELLIGENCE FILES???!??!?

Why banned? bad english?!?!? He seems far from rude.
Seems the questions are the usual ones the antiwar folks pose, I'll post an answer.

I don't see any point in banning somebody who actually comes here and tries to start a discussion (assuming they aren't looking to start flame wars). The mere fact that somebody like Rover posts here actually gives us one more opportunity to illuminate facts on someone who may not be aware of the full story or has been feed too much of a liberalized media diet. He has actual questions for which we have answers.

We got to convert them one at a time folks.

Why can't Americans and George W. Bush think about the consequences (to the Iraqi people) of this escalation?

During the past 2 decades, Mr. Hussein has systematically targeted certain minority groups in Iraq, particularly the Iraqi Kurds. During the 80's between 120,000 and 180,000 Kurds were killed and more then 4,000 villages destroyed during the Anfal campaign. Perhaps more famously, in 1998 Saddam used chemical weapons in about 60 villages, including Halabja where he killed more then 5,000 children and parents and injured over 10,000 in a single 6 hour period. Consider the following survivors story:

The case of Halabja is full of the same emotive human tremors that emerge when survivors speak of the destruction of Koreme village. Tears flow when Younis Sharif Mohamed tells of hiding in his basement with 13 other members of his family. The regular shelling lasted for several hours. "Then something new happened," Mr. Mohamed says. "The sound of the bombs was different ? a flat, damp-sounding pop ... pop. We noticed a darkening of the sun, and then three special smells like apple, onion, and cucumber. After a moment, people began to scream." Mohamed was out of the basement first, with his mother close behind. But he soon collapsed. When he came to, his eyes were in extreme pain. Ten other family members lay dead where they fell.

For all the faults and failures that some US Foreign Policy has had in the past, it has also been a champion of freedom and assistance to many who are repressed. Witness the United States war involvement during the 1990's to help the muslin population in Bosnia/Serbia. Countless lives where saved from Milosevic (currently on trial for crimes against humanity).

Likewise, the northern and southern no-fly zones in Iraq (as a result of the 1991 war) have saved countless of Kurds (in the north) and Shi'te Muslins (in the south). The US has been a protector to Muslin's for many years. This war is not against muslims, but rather about liberating and providing protection to those people. South Korea has had the benefit of US protection for more then half a century from a pretty crazy northern neighbor. On March 1, 2003 South Korea held a MASSIVE rally in support of the US and it's continued presence in South Korea. If the US doesn't help these people who will?

I have an Iraqi friend who was saddened by all the anti war protests. He was afraid that it would deny his country the first real opportunity to freedom in almost 30 years.

I don't see any point in banning somebody who actually comes here and tries to start a discussion (assuming they aren't looking to start flame wars).

agreed !

didn't seem like they were here being a smartass.
but then i've not gotten to the end of the thread ...

I have an Iraqi friend who was saddened by all the anti war protests. He was afraid that it would deny his country the first real opportunity to freedom in almost 30 years.

---

At least this 'debate' will let the Iraqi people know who their real friends are.

I don't have a clue why he was banned. I was as suprised as you were.

MKM