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To: 4ConservativeJustices
It seems the obvious escapes you. There is no mechanism in the US constitution for states to leave the United States, because the framers did not contemplate it happening in a perpetual union.

They did say in Article I Section 10 that "No State shall enter into a Treaty, Alliance or Confederation;"

and Article III Section 2 vests the Supreme court as the judicial power " to all cases in law and equity, arising under this constitution"

But what gives any confederate the right to invoke the United States constitution? Perhaps you could explain why instead of pursuing their so-called claims in the United States Supreme Court, the slave powers chose instead to fire on its flag.

171 posted on 01/25/2003 2:56:07 PM PST by mac_truck (go ahead, mention states-rights. I dare ya)
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To: mac_truck

Hey Yankee! Read post 172! It tells you where the Southern States' right to secede came from. Ergo ... the people that have the ultimate authority to make the Constitution, had the ultimate authority to unmake it!

James Madison at the Virginia Ratification Convention of 1788 conceded the right of secession. Answering critics of the proposed Constitution, he said "If we be dissatisfied with the national government, if we choose to renounce it, this is an additional safeguard to our defence."

173 posted on 01/25/2003 4:36:10 PM PST by Colt .45 (Non tu tibi istam praetruncari linguam largiloquam iubes?)
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To: mac_truck
"It seems the obvious escapes YOU:

"Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable, a most sacred right-a right which we hope and believe is to liberate the world. Nor is this right confined to cases in which the whole people of an existing government may choose to exercise it. Any portion of such people, that can, may revolutionize, and make their own so much of the territory as they inhabit." Abraham Lincoln, 1848.

175 posted on 01/25/2003 4:55:27 PM PST by groanup
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To: mac_truck
It seems the obvious escapes you. There is no mechanism in the US constitution for states to leave the United States, because the framers did not contemplate it happening in a perpetual union.

Again, where is anything indicating perpetuity? It seems the obvious escapes you - the founders just seceded from a union that was declared to be perpetual, and that union only lasted a few years.

They did say in Article I Section 10 that "No State shall enter into a Treaty, Alliance or Confederation;"

A state still within the union cannot perform as indicated. A state that has seceded is no longer bound by us laws or the Constitution

and Article III Section 2 vests the Supreme court as the judicial power " to all cases in law and equity, arising under this constitution"

See above. The Confederate states had left, their allegaince to the Constitution revoked.

But what gives any confederate the right to invoke the United States constitution? Perhaps you could explain why instead of pursuing their so-called claims in the United States Supreme Court, the slave powers chose instead to fire on its flag.

Easy. While they were still members, they exercised their rights under the 10th to legally secede from the union. Once seceded, the federal courts have no authority over them. The Confederates fired on US forces invading their territory - just as the states fired on the British invading after seceding.

233 posted on 01/26/2003 7:04:53 PM PST by 4CJ
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