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To: JenB
... there's a quote from Boromir about using the Ring that really forshadows stuff later.

Is this the quote?

Boromir stirred, and Frodo looked at him. He was fingering his great horn and frowning. At leangth he spoke.

'I do not understand all this,' he said. 'Saruman is a traitor, but did he not have a glimpse of wisdom? Why do you speak ever of hiding and destroying? Why should we not think that the Great Ring has come into our hands to serve us in the very hour of need? Wielding it the Free Lords of the Free may surely defeat the Enemy. That is what he most fears, I deem.

'The Men of Gondor are valiant, and they will never submit; but they may be beaten down. Valour needs first strength, and then a weapon. Let the Ring be your weapon, if it has such power as you say. Take it and go forth to victory!'

I don't think he was thinking of stealing the Ring at this point. I think he bring this up because he truly doesn't understand why the good guys can't use the ring.

The Lay of Earendil....don't those Elves have any stories that end "and they lived happily ever after"?

405 posted on 04/29/2002 9:45:00 AM PDT by Overtaxed
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To: Overtaxed
don't those Elves have any stories that end "and they lived happily ever after"?

I think when you live so long, as in possibly forever, that after a while all life will be at best bittersweet. The best part being is that all will come to the halls of the "dead" (I know that isn't it, and someone will correct me). After so long and losing all that you built and was important to you, you just give it up, so to speak. Think about it when you wish that you could live forever. Hence, the "gift" to men of death.

406 posted on 04/29/2002 9:54:53 AM PDT by doubled
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To: Overtaxed
I don't think he was thinking of stealing the Ring at this point. I think he bring this up because he truly doesn't understand why the good guys can't use the ring.

Good quote. I think that this is probably the "hook" that the Ring used to reel Boromir in. Remember, the Ring has a will of its own.

-Kevin

408 posted on 04/29/2002 10:07:52 AM PDT by ksen
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To: Overtaxed
That's the quote I was looking for! It sounds innocent, yes, but take it in conjuction with this:
‘For Boromir was loyal to me and no wizard’s pupil. He would have remembered his father’s need, and would not have squandered what fortune gave. He would have brought me a mighty gift.’

And Faramir says in TT, to Frodo, "And what is Isildur's Bane" - then later, `But, Frodo, I pressed you hard at first about Isildur's Bane. Forgive me! It was unwise in such an hour and place. I had not had time for thought. ....'But this much I learned or guessed, and I have kept it ever secret in my heart since: that Isildur took somewhat from the hand of the Unnamed, ere he went away from Gondor, never to be seen among mortal men again. Here I thought was the answer to Mithrandir's questioning. But it seemed then a matter that concerned only the seekers after ancient learning. Nor when the riddling words of our dream were debated among us, did I think of Isildur's Bane as being this same thing....I can well believe that Boromir, the proud and fearless, often rash, ever anxious for the victory of Minas Tirith (and his own glory therein), might desire such a thing and be allured by it. Alas that ever he went on that errand! I should have been chosen by my father and the elders but he put himself forward, as being the older and the hardier (both true), and he would not be stayed.

I'll let Gandalf have the last word on this subject: ‘Comfort yourself!’ said Gandalf. ‘In no case would Boromir have brought it to you. He is dead, and died well; may he sleep in peace! Yet you deceive yourself. He would have stretched out his hand to this thing, and taking it he would have fallen. He would have kept it for his own, and when he returned you would not have known your son.’

As for the Earendil question, actually that is a happy ending - for an Elf story! The Silmaril is safe, Earendil and Elwing are alive and together, and Middle-Earth is saved from Morgoth. What more do you want?

409 posted on 04/29/2002 10:11:57 AM PDT by JenB
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