The New Hobbit Hole

[HairOfTheDog]

Welcome to The New Hobbit Hole
Concerning Hobbits
The New Hobbit Chronicles

This is a continuation of the infamous thread New Zealander Builds Hobbit Hole originally posted on January 26, 2001 by John Farson, who at the time undoubtedly thought he had found a rather obscure article that would elicit a few replies and die out. Without knowing it, he became the founder of the Hobbit Hole. For reasons incomprehensible to some, the thread grew to over 4100 replies. It became the place for hobbits and friends of hobbits to chit chat and share LoTR news and views, hang out, and talk amongst ourselves in the comfort of familiar surroundings.

In keeping with the new posting guidelines, the thread idea is continuing here, as will the Green Dragon Inn, our more structured spin-off thread, as soon as we figure out how to move all the good discussion that has been had there. As for the Hobbit Hole, we will just start fresh, bringing only a few mathoms such as the picture above with us to make it feel like home, and perhaps a walk down memory lane:

Our discussion has been light:

It very well may be that a thread named "New Zealander builds Hobbit hole" will end up being the longest Tolkien thread of them all, with some of the best heartfelt content... Sorry John, but I would have rather it had been one with a more distinguished title!… post 252 - HairOfTheDog

However, I can still celebrate, with quiet dignity, the fact that what started as a laugh about some wacko in New Zealand has mutated and grown into a multifaceted discussion of the art, literature, and philosophy that is Tolkien. And now that I've managed to write the most pompous sentence of my entire life, I agree, Rosie… post 506 - JenB

Hah! I was number 1000!! (Elvish victory dance... wait, no; that would be too flitty) … post 1001 - BibChr

Real men don't have to be afraid of being flitty! Go for it. – post 1011 – HairOfTheDog

Seventeen years to research one mystical object seems a bit excessive… post 1007 - JenB

Okay...who's the wise guy who didn't renew Gandalf's research grant?… post 1024 – Overtaxed

To the very philosophical:

…Judas Iscariot obviously was a good man, or he wouldn't have been chosen to be one of the Apostles. He loved Jesus, like all of the Apostles, but he betrayed him. Yet without his betrayal, the Passion and Crucifixion would never have occurred, and mankind would not have been redeemed. So without his self-destruction infinite good would not have been accomplished. I certainly do not mean this to be irreverant but it seems to me that this describes the character of Gollum, in the scenes so movingly portrayed above… Lucius Cornelius Sulla

To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters…

…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB

Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog

…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1

Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed

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Oh, I think by the time Frodo reaches the Cracks, he's not even himself anymore! I think he's not only on the brink of a dangerous place physically, he's on the brink of losing himself completely during the exchange with Gollum. But for some reason, the take-over isn't complete till he actually has to throw the Ring in. The person speaking to Gollum is not Frodo, but the "Wheel of Fire" that Sam sees. After the Ring is destroyed, Frodo not only comes back to himself, but comes back with the unbearable (to him) knowledge of what it's like to be completely without compassion. I think that's why it's so important to him to be compassionate in the Shire… post 2506 - 2Jedismom

…Regarding Frodo's compassion... it's a little too much at the end. Even Merry tells him that he's going to have to quit being so darn nice. But you're right. He's learned a lesson about evil that very few ever learn since it wasn't an external lesson but an internal one. (Those kinds of lessons have the greatest impact) Not only did he totally succumb to it, but he was rather ruthless to my little Smeagol… post 2516 - carton253

Well that Frodo was a big mean bully! (to Smeagol)… post 2519 – Overtaxed

So as you can see, everything JRR Tolkien (and Peter Jackson) is welcome here in our New Row, our soon-to-be familiar New Hobbit Hole…; philosophy, opinion, good talk and frequent silliness.

[HairOfTheDog]

I need to think on it some more...

[JenB]

No... we mostly see it as too late. The ship has hit the iceberg, it's taking on water, the boilers have stopped and it's sinking fast. Let's get in the lifeboats, not rearrange the deck chairs! There's no turning the Titanic now.

Actually, that's a bad metaphor, since trying to turn the ship actually caused a great deal more damage than would have occured had they hit the iceberg head on. In fact, the Titanic probably wouldn't have sunk if they hadn't tried to turn her. But that's not important.

[Corin Stormhands]

When I said on another thread today that we were comfortable with our public schools where I live, someone said to me: Your fooling yourselves:)

Here's what I said over there:

No. We really aren't. Our son is ADHD and we are very involved in all aspects of his school work and his school life. The majority of our school board members are committed Christians (and conservative Republicans). These are elected positions. Until last year's Governor's race, I was not represented by a single Democrat, from dog catcher on up to the White House. We are the most solid (or perhaps second most solid) Republican County in Virginia.

And, most importantly, our parents are involved in the public schools.

I admire and applaud homeschoolers. But that's not what is best for our son.

Let me tell you a bit about the atmosphere here. I've shared this story elsewhere on FR. Last spring, two local high school boys (one from our church) were killed on their way to pick up another friend for a Young Life Bible Study. It had an incredible impact on the high school community. That Wednesday night, our youth group canceled their regular meeting (they have about 100-150 on a regular basis) and held a prayer and communion service. Over 1,200 kids showed up. Since the funeral, our youth group has added about another 100 senior high kids. And they are solidly supported by the community.

My son is 13, but he "gets it." He's preaparing to go on choir tour in two weeks and will sing at Ground Zero and Time Square. He has a shirt that he wears regularly to school that says "I want to be like Adam *****" (the boy from our church). I told him he couldn't wear it unless he was able to explain why. He can. And does.

In another community, we'd private school or homeschool in a heartbeat. But not here.

The main thing is continued parental involvement. We have that here. It may not always be that way. But for now, it is.

I think you homeschoolers are great. I also know that my wife's temperment and my son's temperment, when left together all day with the intent of teaching/learning, would land us on the nightly news or the Springer show.

Ironically, my wife will be teaching at a homeschool academy in the fall.

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

Way too broad a brush LCS! All of America is not a mess.

That is why I said: 'many states, and most center cities', which I think is accurate. As far as using too broad a brush, as I said earlier, I am fond of doing that. I have even said: 'Kill ALL the Orcs', which is, perhaps, too much of a generalization. LOL!

I have a business meeting tomorrow, for which I will have to be getting out of bed by about 3 AM your time, so I will be logging off soon.

[JenB]

Broad bursh is good, friend! You can have the one I was given earlier, if you like.

[HairOfTheDog]

I guess parents are involved here too, so I am not seeing it as THAT broken, ie, not too late JenB. My very Christian friend (A Baptist book burner ;~D) goes to her son's school and participates a few times a week in class, along with other parents that are also there. Her son is 7. She is voicing her opinion on the curriculum, and pushing for inclusion of her faith in the classroom. It is working for her... The principle she is talking to was our 5th grade teacher. (Mr. Egabroad Penny) There are issues, but she is raising them. If she wasn't there who would get heard?

[HairOfTheDog]

OK - Well you were supposed to be in that post of mine above too...

[JenB]

Maybe it's just our area... we're suburban/rural, and the schools should be better. But instead, we hear constantly about druug and pregnancy problems, bomb threats, kids subjected to psychological experiments (not our district but one over; I know a mother who sued for years to try to get records of what was done to her kids) bad academics... for instance, for seven years I attended Sunday School with a girl who literally could not read. She had a 3.5 GPA, presumably inflated because she won state championships in swimming. She sure as heck didn't earn it.

Maybe I'm really naive, or too critical. I was in the local high school twice, for my PSAT and SATs. It was - well, to me it was a lot like visiting a prison. It felt so oppressive, enclosed and just wrong. I was already attending college, it wasn't the classrooms and halls that did it. There was an atmosphere there - this will sound silly - but it felt wrong. I can't understand how anyone could learn there. Sure, there are some kids I know who did learn, and they were the ones whose families were involved. Most parents just don't seem to care...

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

I guess parents are involved here too, so I am not seeing it as THAT broken, ie, not too late JenB.

I agree that it is not hopeless, but would not put a child of mine in the inferior institutions that do exist. If I found that my child's school system was nearly as good as the one I went to, I likely would send my child there, if not, not.

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

Broad bursh is good, friend! You can have the one I was given earlier, if you like.

Yes, that was a high quality broad brush, good for mixing in the good with the bad, which is the purpose of a good broad brush.

[JenB]

Sounds like the one you went to is closer to a British "public school" than to our kind. I wish I'd learned Latin. I know tons of roots, and I can get the gist of a paragraph, usually, by deducing what the words must mean... but it would be cool to speak it.

[Bear_in_RoseBear]

I wish I'd learned Latin.

It's never too late to learn. I didn't learn German until I went to college. Does the college you're attending offer courses in Latin?

[Lucius Cornelius Sulla]

I am going to bed, and there is no night-light!! I want reparations!!

[JenB]

No... just French, Spanish, and video courses. I'd hoped for Latin or Japanese, but got stuck with Spanish, mostly because I don't like French at all. At least in Spanish you use most of the letters.

[2Jedismom]

One of our ladies in the fellowship I belong to is married to a Lutheran minister who teaches Latin! He said Matthew can take it when he's in the fourth grade (next year) but I think I'll wait till he's a little older...

I just can't get over that Krispy Kreme Hooplah!

[JenB]

Actually.... there's a package out there called, I think, English from the Roots up. It's flashcards with Greek and Latin root words on one side, and their meaning and common English words on the other side. They're really great, since you can learn what words really mean, not just what they're used for, and since learning the root can help you identify the meaning of other words later. Studying roots on my own in middle school helped me develop my English skills. My 9 year old brother does the roots flashcards all the time and enjoys them. You might look at something like that for your guys, before they try to start conjugating words.

[Penny1]

(Mr. Egabroad Penny)

Oooohhhh, I was in love with Mr. Egabroad when I was in grade school! ;) Along with all the other girls in class, of course. He's a terrific teacher, and hopefully he's doing a good job as principle too...

When I was in Tumwater Schools, one of our church members was heavily involved in the school board. I think certainly in our case the involvement of people in the school board's decisions made a huge difference.

[Bear_in_RoseBear]

I am going to bed, and there is no night-light!!

Oh, sorry... here's a northern night-light. Hope I got it posted before you logged off for the night!

[2Jedismom]

English from the Root up. Thanks! That sounds good!

I already explain a lot of words to him...based on my medical terminology.

Tonight, we were driving home from checking out Krispy Kreme and we drove by a weedy wheat field. He said "Would you look at those tares?"

[Corin Stormhands]

I wish I'd learned Latin.

Dan Quayle got in trouble for saying that once...