Posted on 03/14/2002 5:07:26 AM PST by HairOfTheDog
This is a continuation of the infamous thread New Zealander Builds Hobbit Hole originally posted on January 26, 2001 by John Farson, who at the time undoubtedly thought he had found a rather obscure article that would elicit a few replies and die out. Without knowing it, he became the founder of the Hobbit Hole. For reasons incomprehensible to some, the thread grew to over 4100 replies. It became the place for hobbits and friends of hobbits to chit chat and share LoTR news and views, hang out, and talk amongst ourselves in the comfort of familiar surroundings.
In keeping with the new posting guidelines, the thread idea is continuing here, as will the Green Dragon Inn, our more structured spin-off thread, as soon as we figure out how to move all the good discussion that has been had there. As for the Hobbit Hole, we will just start fresh, bringing only a few mathoms such as the picture above with us to make it feel like home, and perhaps a walk down memory lane:
Our discussion has been light:
It very well may be that a thread named "New Zealander builds Hobbit hole" will end up being the longest Tolkien thread of them all, with some of the best heartfelt content... Sorry John, but I would have rather it had been one with a more distinguished title!… post 252 - HairOfTheDog
However, I can still celebrate, with quiet dignity, the fact that what started as a laugh about some wacko in New Zealand has mutated and grown into a multifaceted discussion of the art, literature, and philosophy that is Tolkien. And now that I've managed to write the most pompous sentence of my entire life, I agree, Rosie… post 506 - JenB
Hah! I was number 1000!! (Elvish victory dance... wait, no; that would be too flitty) … post 1001 - BibChr
Real men don't have to be afraid of being flitty! Go for it. – post 1011 – HairOfTheDog
Seventeen years to research one mystical object seems a bit excessive… post 1007 - JenB
Okay...who's the wise guy who didn't renew Gandalf's research grant?… post 1024 – Overtaxed
To the very philosophical:
…Judas Iscariot obviously was a good man, or he wouldn't have been chosen to be one of the Apostles. He loved Jesus, like all of the Apostles, but he betrayed him. Yet without his betrayal, the Passion and Crucifixion would never have occurred, and mankind would not have been redeemed. So without his self-destruction infinite good would not have been accomplished. I certainly do not mean this to be irreverant but it seems to me that this describes the character of Gollum, in the scenes so movingly portrayed above… Lucius Cornelius Sulla
To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters…
…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB
Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog
…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1
Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed
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Oh, I think by the time Frodo reaches the Cracks, he's not even himself anymore! I think he's not only on the brink of a dangerous place physically, he's on the brink of losing himself completely during the exchange with Gollum. But for some reason, the take-over isn't complete till he actually has to throw the Ring in. The person speaking to Gollum is not Frodo, but the "Wheel of Fire" that Sam sees. After the Ring is destroyed, Frodo not only comes back to himself, but comes back with the unbearable (to him) knowledge of what it's like to be completely without compassion. I think that's why it's so important to him to be compassionate in the Shire… post 2506 - 2Jedismom
…Regarding Frodo's compassion... it's a little too much at the end. Even Merry tells him that he's going to have to quit being so darn nice. But you're right. He's learned a lesson about evil that very few ever learn since it wasn't an external lesson but an internal one. (Those kinds of lessons have the greatest impact) Not only did he totally succumb to it, but he was rather ruthless to my little Smeagol… post 2516 - carton253
Well that Frodo was a big mean bully! (to Smeagol)… post 2519 – Overtaxed
So as you can see, everything JRR Tolkien (and Peter Jackson) is welcome here in our New Row, our soon-to-be familiar New Hobbit Hole…; philosophy, opinion, good talk and frequent silliness.
One effect seems to be that I am extrodinarily stubborn and very hard to convince of anything, but this may be genetic, as my father is the same way.
By the time I was 15, I was taking math classes at community college. You have no idea how many different opinions on issues can get aired in ten-minute coffee breaks from calculus - it seems to stimulate people's debating skills. I had met people who weren't the same religion or had different politcal views before, we knew a Mormon lady who sold us books, and I took a biology class with other homeschoolers who were homeschooling for academics, not religion, and who had very different view.
Anyway, then I discovered the internet and whatever illusions I had about harmony were gone.... the result is, I know exactly what I believe, and am willing to defend it. Oddly enough for some reason I don't usually shove my believes down peoples' throats. I have a good friend who was saved around Christmas, last year. She told me that I was the first Christian she had known who didn't either completely scare her away or make her wonder if they really believed. I'm not certain my homeschooling had anything to do with that - I think it was because of my science fiction addiction. Now there's something I've had to defend to certain... fellow homeschoolers who are a little too fanatical!
Oh, and good morning, all! I almost forgot. ;-)
Well, this one throws everything else I said out the window.. "By the time I was 15, I was taking math classes at community college" - Because that is what throws in those variables I was not sure were there... More later! - I really am late now!
We will face that situation in September when Elizabeth begins 7th grade. We have decided to use a video curriculum for her during grades 7-12. These are videos that have been made during actual classroom time. The teachers give their lectures, or present their material, and the children on the tape ask questions. My wife will serve to answer any questions Elizabeth may have and to grade her homework, tests, and quizzes.
I don't want my child exposed to all the "other" stuff that is being taught in the goobermint schools. If you want a good book on the subject check out John Stormer's None Dare Call It Education. It is a pretty easy read and the guy is practically giving the book away. He documents all sorts of shenanigans that are going on under the rubric of "public education." If we weren't homeschooling when I read that book, we would have been soon after I had finished.
I want my children to know how to read, how to write, how to perform mathematical calculations, how to think, and how to intelligently express their thoughts (unlike their old man). I don't want them learning how to put condoms on cucumbers, how "peaceful" Islam really is, how "normal" homosexuality is, and all the rest of that junk.
-Kevin
I imagine there are some like this...I have met very few even here in Poh-dunk Oklahoma. I have met several Mennonite families where they are almost as odd as Amish, but they were courteous and friendly. I am sure they do just fine in their self-imposed "isolated environments"
It is those rigid extremists that I used to associate with homeschooling. How do those kids cope with the world when they find out that it contains a whole lot of stuff their parents never talked about?
First off, I am very careful about labeling anyone an extremist. In my left wing liberal brother-in-law's eyes, this slightly pudgy S. Baptist housewife is an extremist. If a person isn't breaking any laws, they ought to be able to do anything they want and raise their kids any way they want. For example:
A homeschooling Wiccan believes that their child doesn't need to know anything other than when to plant their completely organic garden by the phases of the moon. More power to them. A resourceful homeschooled wiccan could live on the income of organic veggies.
I mean to say this...it is highly unlikely that the children of most (even what you would consider extremist) homeschoolers are going to be beating a path to the welfare office. Homeschoolers, although perhaps considered rigid and "extreme" are usually quite resourceful and if they don't want to fit into society, nobody should try to make them.
I am considered rigid in some areas, and overly flexible in some areas, depending upon who I'm with at the time.
As far as high school goes, there are a ton of resources out there for homeschooling high-schoolers. And by that time, they seem to be totally prepared to go out and find those resources. There are courses at our local junior college that allow homeschoolers to attend. There are co-ops (Matthew is attending one this next fall, already...music) where professionals are hired by a group of homeschooling parents to teach a course in a particular subject...like chemistry and calculus.
I don't defend anything I do. I just generally either tell people outright (or find some other way to be discreet) to just go blow it out their shorts.
:-D
Hair, I'd like to respond to your questions about home-schooling from the perspective of someone who doesn't have kids yet, but plans to home-school if/when we do have kids... but I don't have time right now. :) Maybe later if you're still interested.
Have a good day all!
Anyway, I don't approve of those types either. But they're free to be that way, and it's probably better to have them alone than to have them around other people.... in all my life I've met only two homeschool familes who I felt would be better off in public school. Sadly, one of those were my cousins.
Jen, you are in college. Did your homeschooling background help or hinder you being admitted into school?
-Kevin
LOL!!! Exactly!! Ha haa! That's exactly right!
Spoken like a true almost-geezer!
Signed....Geezer
Oh, I forgot to mention my four years of co-op classes, where I studied all sorts of stuff with other homeschoolers. I learned Shakespeare, science, and logic; got spurned by the popular girls' clique; made friends with guys and got mocked for it; fell for my best friend... all the things you're supposed to get in school, but without most of the negative things. I guess I don't really fit Hair's ideas. Oh well!
It didn't really matter to me. What helped most were my SAT scores (very high, I got an 800 in verbal). I was already taking classes at the community college, and I got an Associate's Degree there last May. This year I transferred to a four year school. They didn't give me any problems about being homeschooled, certainly, but I wasn't actively recruited by anyone.
Tell you where it's helped me - in my classes. One of my teachers told me I was the only student in the class who could write well. She was pleasantly surprised when she found out I was homeschooled, not having met any of us before...
Can't I just teach Matthew to tell people to blow it out their shorts? I think it would hysterically funny to hear! (Shhh...I am feeling rebellious!)
;^)
-Kevin
Glad I'm not posting this in the Crusades!
Living by example is a powerful thing.
-Kevin
Or was it a "fanatical homeschooler" thing? Anyway, I'm not mad at you.
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