The New Hobbit Hole

[HairOfTheDog]

Welcome to The New Hobbit Hole
Concerning Hobbits
The New Hobbit Chronicles

This is a continuation of the infamous thread New Zealander Builds Hobbit Hole originally posted on January 26, 2001 by John Farson, who at the time undoubtedly thought he had found a rather obscure article that would elicit a few replies and die out. Without knowing it, he became the founder of the Hobbit Hole. For reasons incomprehensible to some, the thread grew to over 4100 replies. It became the place for hobbits and friends of hobbits to chit chat and share LoTR news and views, hang out, and talk amongst ourselves in the comfort of familiar surroundings.

In keeping with the new posting guidelines, the thread idea is continuing here, as will the Green Dragon Inn, our more structured spin-off thread, as soon as we figure out how to move all the good discussion that has been had there. As for the Hobbit Hole, we will just start fresh, bringing only a few mathoms such as the picture above with us to make it feel like home, and perhaps a walk down memory lane:

Our discussion has been light:

It very well may be that a thread named "New Zealander builds Hobbit hole" will end up being the longest Tolkien thread of them all, with some of the best heartfelt content... Sorry John, but I would have rather it had been one with a more distinguished title!… post 252 - HairOfTheDog

However, I can still celebrate, with quiet dignity, the fact that what started as a laugh about some wacko in New Zealand has mutated and grown into a multifaceted discussion of the art, literature, and philosophy that is Tolkien. And now that I've managed to write the most pompous sentence of my entire life, I agree, Rosie… post 506 - JenB

Hah! I was number 1000!! (Elvish victory dance... wait, no; that would be too flitty) … post 1001 - BibChr

Real men don't have to be afraid of being flitty! Go for it. – post 1011 – HairOfTheDog

Seventeen years to research one mystical object seems a bit excessive… post 1007 - JenB

Okay...who's the wise guy who didn't renew Gandalf's research grant?… post 1024 – Overtaxed

To the very philosophical:

…Judas Iscariot obviously was a good man, or he wouldn't have been chosen to be one of the Apostles. He loved Jesus, like all of the Apostles, but he betrayed him. Yet without his betrayal, the Passion and Crucifixion would never have occurred, and mankind would not have been redeemed. So without his self-destruction infinite good would not have been accomplished. I certainly do not mean this to be irreverant but it seems to me that this describes the character of Gollum, in the scenes so movingly portrayed above… Lucius Cornelius Sulla

To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters…

…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB

Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog

…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1

Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed

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Oh, I think by the time Frodo reaches the Cracks, he's not even himself anymore! I think he's not only on the brink of a dangerous place physically, he's on the brink of losing himself completely during the exchange with Gollum. But for some reason, the take-over isn't complete till he actually has to throw the Ring in. The person speaking to Gollum is not Frodo, but the "Wheel of Fire" that Sam sees. After the Ring is destroyed, Frodo not only comes back to himself, but comes back with the unbearable (to him) knowledge of what it's like to be completely without compassion. I think that's why it's so important to him to be compassionate in the Shire… post 2506 - 2Jedismom

…Regarding Frodo's compassion... it's a little too much at the end. Even Merry tells him that he's going to have to quit being so darn nice. But you're right. He's learned a lesson about evil that very few ever learn since it wasn't an external lesson but an internal one. (Those kinds of lessons have the greatest impact) Not only did he totally succumb to it, but he was rather ruthless to my little Smeagol… post 2516 - carton253

Well that Frodo was a big mean bully! (to Smeagol)… post 2519 – Overtaxed

So as you can see, everything JRR Tolkien (and Peter Jackson) is welcome here in our New Row, our soon-to-be familiar New Hobbit Hole…; philosophy, opinion, good talk and frequent silliness.

[Scott from the Left Coast]

sneaky elf

[Scott from the Left Coast]

The glory of non-intermitant Internet service.

[RMDupree]

Thanks 2J! I've created an account at boomspeed.com. If it doesn't work out, I'll try York Photo.

Thanks again!

[RMDupree]

*bows deeply, as is customary*

"Seamus Hamfist at your service, and your family's service for years to come."

Such a well-mannered Hobbit. May your pipe overflow with the finest pipeweed in the Shire!

[RMDupree]

OK. lemme try this thing out.

The camera was the cheapy disposable kind, so the pic quality is terrible. Anyway, this is Becky as a flower girl at my cousin's wedding.

[2Jedismom]

Mad Max is coming back! Yeah! I love Mad Max! Mel Gibson has signed up to do another one!

[2Jedismom]

How pretty! How old is she?

[RMDupree]

She just turned 5 in September.

She's a chatterbox that drives me absolutely nuts, but I think she and her sister are just the best things in the world. (Shameless mommy brag)

[Sam Cree]

I have a question that I hope you guys may also have considered. Perhaps, as a military officer you might have an insight, g'nad, and I know you study it carefully, Carton.

How likely do you think it is that terrorists might set off a WMD in the U.S.?

If they get hold of one or more, I'm not sure that we could stop them, and it sure seems like they'd want to use them, just for the sake of causing death and satisfying their hatred.

I am imagining the effect on all our lives if, say, a "suitcase" nuke went off in NYC or Washington, or even Miami or Philadelphia, for that matter. I'd say, just for starters, that the effect on our economy could immediately put lots of people out of work, along with having a catastrophic effect on the securities markets, which would in turn destroy everyone's retirement, insurance and, probably health plans. Plus, most institutions and corporations are fairly closely tied into the markets.

Anyway, I feel more and more a strong responsibility to be giving this my utmost consideration, in order to fulfill my responsibility take care of my family, at the minimun. The shadow is growing, so to speak.

I do believe that Bush also feels the danger, and is doing everything he can to hold it at bay, which means to destroy it. I for one believe it is possible he can succeed, but it seems clear to me that things might be dangerous just now.

As a sometimes fairly serious investor, I'm not sure that getting out of the market altogether is wise, after all, a catastrophe will likely screw up even the value of cash and real estate. Nevertheless, I think alot about attempting to reposition, as best I can.

I posted this question directly on a financial discussion here on FR, but no one so much as replied. Heads in the sand, maybe, or maye just wiser than me.

Anway, I note that Warren Buffet and Sean Hannity are both in print as to thinking the question is "when," not "if."

These days, I find that I empathize pretty strongly with the free folk of Middle Earth who were facing an enemy of implacable evil. Though I hope that with a little luck, we may be successful in defeating it, the danger seems real to me.

[carton253]

In my opinion... they only reason they have not done so is that they don't have one, but I believe they are working to get them.

The purpose of terror is not to cause death and satisfy their hatred. The purpose of terror against citizens is to inspire fear in the citizens so that they will pressure the government to capitulate to the terrorists demands. And there are demands in Al-Queda... and they are more than "get out of Saudi Arabia... and kill all the Jews!"

For all the flack President Bush took for saying "get on with your life... go shopping..." it had the necessary affect. It calmed the public. It reduced the number one aim of terrorists.

Right now, terrorists lack the power to destroy us. They do not lack the will. We have the power to destroy them. We lack the will.

September 11th made use of the weapons that they had.

But consider this.... 5 pounds of smallpox released in the NYC subway would kill more people than a nuclear device detonated in NYC.

BTW, there is an interesting article at World Net Daily about Iraq's ties to Al Queda.

I hope this answers your question.

[RMDupree]

It's a major concern for me too, Sam. Especially since a lot of these terrorists seem to have South Florida residences and/or connections.

I have family in Chicago, but it's safe to say that I wouldn't really feel any safer there.

I think it's important to set up a "buddy system" of sorts just in case something goes down and the internet is unaccessible to a friend in the affected area.

In terms of investments, real estate should remain a safe bet although any property owned in the area of an attack would be rendered worthless. For those who own outside of that area however, the value should skyrocket.

If I had the money, I would buy land in a rural, less populated area where the likelyhood of attack would be slim to none. That way, should I lose everything where I am now, I still have a place to go and live, even if it's in a trailer home.

[RMDupree]

In my opinion... they only reason they have not done so is that they don't have one, but I believe they are working to get them.

I agree.

The purpose of terror is not to cause death and satisfy their hatred. The purpose of terror against citizens is to inspire fear in the citizens so that they will pressure the government to capitulate to the terrorists demands.

I agree.

Right now, terrorists lack the power to destroy us. They do not lack the will. We have the power to destroy them. We lack the will.

I agree, yet again!

Thank you carton. You are invaluable with your information!

[Sam Cree]

Thank you, Carton.

"And there are demands in Al-Queda... and they are more than "get out of Saudi Arabia... and kill all the Jews!"

I have never been able to really see demands, so I just figured hatred and love of death were the motivators. I did figure that hatred of Israel plays a part and I do kind of think that if we found our oil elsewhere, there might be less problem. But what do you see as their demands?

[g'nad]

carton's statement is very poignant:

Right now, terrorists lack the power to destroy us. They do not lack the will. We have the power to destroy them. We lack the will.

I believe there is no way to prevent a WMD attack on the U.S. ... Our borders are too open... society is too mobile... this facet of our society which makes us great, is also a weakness...

The only thing we can do is try and stop the development and proliferation of these weapons... by destroy those entities with evil intentions building WMDs or trying to obtain these weapons... destroy them where they are, where ever they are... For this to be effective, we must be ruthless and perseverent... this is a fight that will never end as long as there is discord and religious strife...

my expertise in investments is poor at best... But I am diversifying... stocks, CDs, savings, etc... I would try to develop as much independence as possible... I'm buying land with water, tillable land, timber and wildlife... this is not for everyone I know... but for a short term crisis, you don't want to be helpless...

You are right friend... the Shadow is growing... the battle is coming... it's already begun...

[Sam Cree]

"In terms of investments, real estate should remain a safe bet"

I think real estate is always good, but I suppose a castastrophic event, say a bomb went off in DC and destroyed a major amount of our government, could so seriously disrupt our concepts of the value of money, that even there confusion could reign. I think these kind of implications are beyond me to figure out.

Interesting that David Hackworth, FWIW, and I don't know what it's worth, considered living in Manhattan, but decided against, it because he thought it was too vulnerable to terrorism.

[Lil'freeper]

This has been circulating in our office- everyone is getting a big kick out of it. Only a fool would go against our military.

Javelin test

[RMDupree]

But real estate is going anywhere, you see. After things stabilize a bit, you'll still have something to show for it.

Even if it nevers recovers full market value, it is still worth something. And if no one is buying, you can always live on it.

Not so with stocks and such, which rely heavily on the hopes that the companies will still be there tomorrow.

Maybe my thinking is a bit amateurish in investment perspectives. I am a lost soul in the world of investments - I jsut started my 401k this year and it's all in a money market account. I know...pathetic. But I'm so scared to try putting it elsewhere right now.

[Sam Cree]

I like a money market for now, until things become a little more clear. And my opinion is that seeing the forest instead of the trees is the key, if you can make out the forest, that is. But it seems to me that it may be possible for someone less involved to see more clearly than one who is caught up in the daily intricacies of the market. Also possible for such a one to be more easily led into the wrong thing, such as those who bought dot.coms the last few years.

And I agree on a gut level, owning land seems basically sound.

[RMDupree]

I like a money market for now, until things become a little more clear.

Whew! It's a relief hearing that from you. Everytime a get my quarterly statement, I chide myself for being such a ninny and vow to diversify my portfolio. But then, I start to think about the instability of the stock market and do nothing.

[RMDupree]

And I agree on a gut level, owning land seems basically sound.

So...when do we start building a shanty town in the Everglades? :)