Posted on 03/14/2002 5:07:26 AM PST by HairOfTheDog
This is a continuation of the infamous thread New Zealander Builds Hobbit Hole originally posted on January 26, 2001 by John Farson, who at the time undoubtedly thought he had found a rather obscure article that would elicit a few replies and die out. Without knowing it, he became the founder of the Hobbit Hole. For reasons incomprehensible to some, the thread grew to over 4100 replies. It became the place for hobbits and friends of hobbits to chit chat and share LoTR news and views, hang out, and talk amongst ourselves in the comfort of familiar surroundings.
In keeping with the new posting guidelines, the thread idea is continuing here, as will the Green Dragon Inn, our more structured spin-off thread, as soon as we figure out how to move all the good discussion that has been had there. As for the Hobbit Hole, we will just start fresh, bringing only a few mathoms such as the picture above with us to make it feel like home, and perhaps a walk down memory lane:
Our discussion has been light:
It very well may be that a thread named "New Zealander builds Hobbit hole" will end up being the longest Tolkien thread of them all, with some of the best heartfelt content... Sorry John, but I would have rather it had been one with a more distinguished title!… post 252 - HairOfTheDog
However, I can still celebrate, with quiet dignity, the fact that what started as a laugh about some wacko in New Zealand has mutated and grown into a multifaceted discussion of the art, literature, and philosophy that is Tolkien. And now that I've managed to write the most pompous sentence of my entire life, I agree, Rosie… post 506 - JenB
Hah! I was number 1000!! (Elvish victory dance... wait, no; that would be too flitty) … post 1001 - BibChr
Real men don't have to be afraid of being flitty! Go for it. – post 1011 – HairOfTheDog
Seventeen years to research one mystical object seems a bit excessive… post 1007 - JenB
Okay...who's the wise guy who didn't renew Gandalf's research grant?… post 1024 – Overtaxed
To the very philosophical:
…Judas Iscariot obviously was a good man, or he wouldn't have been chosen to be one of the Apostles. He loved Jesus, like all of the Apostles, but he betrayed him. Yet without his betrayal, the Passion and Crucifixion would never have occurred, and mankind would not have been redeemed. So without his self-destruction infinite good would not have been accomplished. I certainly do not mean this to be irreverant but it seems to me that this describes the character of Gollum, in the scenes so movingly portrayed above… Lucius Cornelius Sulla
To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters…
…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB
Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog
…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1
Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed
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Oh, I think by the time Frodo reaches the Cracks, he's not even himself anymore! I think he's not only on the brink of a dangerous place physically, he's on the brink of losing himself completely during the exchange with Gollum. But for some reason, the take-over isn't complete till he actually has to throw the Ring in. The person speaking to Gollum is not Frodo, but the "Wheel of Fire" that Sam sees. After the Ring is destroyed, Frodo not only comes back to himself, but comes back with the unbearable (to him) knowledge of what it's like to be completely without compassion. I think that's why it's so important to him to be compassionate in the Shire… post 2506 - 2Jedismom
…Regarding Frodo's compassion... it's a little too much at the end. Even Merry tells him that he's going to have to quit being so darn nice. But you're right. He's learned a lesson about evil that very few ever learn since it wasn't an external lesson but an internal one. (Those kinds of lessons have the greatest impact) Not only did he totally succumb to it, but he was rather ruthless to my little Smeagol… post 2516 - carton253
Well that Frodo was a big mean bully! (to Smeagol)… post 2519 – Overtaxed
So as you can see, everything JRR Tolkien (and Peter Jackson) is welcome here in our New Row, our soon-to-be familiar New Hobbit Hole…; philosophy, opinion, good talk and frequent silliness.
At least no one was hurt.
FROM TORN
TTT Review - What Of The Cast Performances?
Demosthenes @ 7:18 pm ESTTigerlilly Gamgee sent in this Two Towers review that is largely absent of spoilers. Those who want a feel of the performances in the film may enjoy this one, though if you're trying to avoid spoilers regarding who may or may not be at Helm's Deep, perhaps you should steer clear.
The Two Towers - What Of The Cast Performances?
I had the priveledge of attending an advanced screening of TTT this morning here in Chicago (along with Roger Ebert... and many other contest winners). My opinion is still forming for this movie; it is just so strange because you are accustomed to FOTR and then you see the characters in a new story (which you probably already know the ending to). Overall, I did like it. I was not disappointed. I need to see it again!
It varies away from the books a lot more than FOTR did. Some parts didn't even exist in the books, and in other cases you are seeing the same story from different perspectives. Sam and Gimli stole the show, in my opinion. Everyone voted that Pippin would be the comic relief in this movie, but I think that Gimli has stolen his trophy on that account. Many of Sam's greatest moments from the books are left in the movie (Sam fans will be cheering at these parts!), and some really nice new scenes are given to him. Legolas is also more likeable in this movie. He becomes a little more "humanistic" in quality, as opposed to the slightly "magical" nature he had about him in the first film (his kind-of "aloofness"). Elijah Wood does a great job with Frodo as he becomes possessed by the ring. There are some heart-breaking moments for him and Sam (one really huge one at the end; which is from a shot in the trailer, but you wouldn't know that that shot of Frodo is actually in a scene with Sam and not Gollum).
The new characters are all lovely. Eowyn has a very nice introduction and she doesn't whip out the sword quite yet (at least, not in a big way). Theoden is well played and Wormtongue is great. Eomer is also a lot better than I expected (no offense to Karl Urban, it's just that he seemed a little dryer in the books; but new life is good). There is also some nice stuff with the Rohan refugees, some of it is very emotional and may move some to tears (look for the Jackson kids in the caves - boy they get around don't they!).
Gollum and Treebeard, in my opinion, have not fallen in the "Jar-Jar trap", but those who have not read the books may not like them. I can see how putting an Ent on screen is a difficult task (with their not wanting to be hasty and all - I don't think that people will quite understand them if they haven't read the books). Merry has a lovely speech at the Entmoot (addition); Dominic is really stepping up to the plate. Gollum is done very well, though slightly different from my impressions of him in the book (though, I have never really liked him - so don't listen to me). I never felt pity for him while reading the book, but that aspect is brought into the movie very nicely. His relationship with Frodo and Sam is great! It really made me see why Frodo trusts him.
You get to see Merry and Pippin start to grow up in this film. I mentioned the speech Merry has... great! Pippin also has a nice moment with Treebeard when they have left the Moot. He's not so much of a "fool" anymore.
The scene between Arwen and Elrond is very well done. Everyone is worrying about her being in the movie, but I enjoyed that scene (though her picture on the poster need not be so big). The flash-forward was very moving and it let's the audience see more of what Arwen is sacrificing to be with Aragorn (that was probably unclear to non-readers in the first movie). Fear not, she does not come to Helm's Deep (though I can't speak for Haldir's troops on that matter)! I, personally, liked the elves at Helm's Deep. It gave the movie a slight Silmarillion-like moment. I think it added to the relationships of the characters, and it showed more where the fate of Middle Earth is heading. Helm's Deep is spectacular!!!!!!!! 'Nuff said there...
The movie has a great climax accompanied by a speech with Sam. I was accompanied by Rosemunde Brownlocks (from my Line Party) and she made an excellent point that... at one point or another in the movie each character has a moment where they realize that this is their fight. All of Middle Earth is in peril, not just an individual race or kingdom. This speech is the climax of those moments. Very well done... go Sean Astin!!!!!
Well, this is already long, so I will end here. I tried not to spoil too much, so hopefully I didn't ruin anything for anyone. Now, I am eager to see what Ebert is going to say (though something tells me he's probably going to be skeptical about it). Fans will not be disappointed, though I am beginning to think that maybe I shouldn't have re-read the book so close to the movie's release date (because of the differences - it made them much more noticeable). They are each in their own, different, yet the same. Be ready for moments that will blow you away!
~Tigerlily Gamgee~
Well, look on the bright side.
The car is still driveable
Jen - sorry about your accident. Doesn't sound like it was that big of a deal, though - parking lot bumps and scrapes happen all the time. I wouldn't take it too seriously, though of course it's stressful. I had someone back into me hard about a month ago when I was at Wal-Mart, and I still get nervous in that particular parking lot.
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