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The New Hobbit Hole

Posted on 03/14/2002 5:07:26 AM PST by HairOfTheDog

Welcome to The New Hobbit Hole

Concerning Hobbits

The New Hobbit Chronicles

This is a continuation of the infamous thread New Zealander Builds Hobbit Hole originally posted on January 26, 2001 by John Farson, who at the time undoubtedly thought he had found a rather obscure article that would elicit a few replies and die out. Without knowing it, he became the founder of the Hobbit Hole. For reasons incomprehensible to some, the thread grew to over 4100 replies. It became the place for hobbits and friends of hobbits to chit chat and share LoTR news and views, hang out, and talk amongst ourselves in the comfort of familiar surroundings.

In keeping with the new posting guidelines, the thread idea is continuing here, as will the Green Dragon Inn, our more structured spin-off thread, as soon as we figure out how to move all the good discussion that has been had there. As for the Hobbit Hole, we will just start fresh, bringing only a few mathoms such as the picture above with us to make it feel like home, and perhaps a walk down memory lane:

Our discussion has been light:

It very well may be that a thread named "New Zealander builds Hobbit hole" will end up being the longest Tolkien thread of them all, with some of the best heartfelt content... Sorry John, but I would have rather it had been one with a more distinguished title!… post 252 - HairOfTheDog

However, I can still celebrate, with quiet dignity, the fact that what started as a laugh about some wacko in New Zealand has mutated and grown into a multifaceted discussion of the art, literature, and philosophy that is Tolkien. And now that I've managed to write the most pompous sentence of my entire life, I agree, Rosie… post 506 - JenB

Hah! I was number 1000!! (Elvish victory dance... wait, no; that would be too flitty) … post 1001 - BibChr

Real men don't have to be afraid of being flitty! Go for it. – post 1011 – HairOfTheDog

Seventeen years to research one mystical object seems a bit excessive… post 1007 - JenB

Okay...who's the wise guy who didn't renew Gandalf's research grant?… post 1024 – Overtaxed

To the very philosophical:

…Judas Iscariot obviously was a good man, or he wouldn't have been chosen to be one of the Apostles. He loved Jesus, like all of the Apostles, but he betrayed him. Yet without his betrayal, the Passion and Crucifixion would never have occurred, and mankind would not have been redeemed. So without his self-destruction infinite good would not have been accomplished. I certainly do not mean this to be irreverant but it seems to me that this describes the character of Gollum, in the scenes so movingly portrayed above… Lucius Cornelius Sulla

To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters…

…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB

Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog

…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1

Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed

-----------------------------------------

Oh, I think by the time Frodo reaches the Cracks, he's not even himself anymore! I think he's not only on the brink of a dangerous place physically, he's on the brink of losing himself completely during the exchange with Gollum. But for some reason, the take-over isn't complete till he actually has to throw the Ring in. The person speaking to Gollum is not Frodo, but the "Wheel of Fire" that Sam sees. After the Ring is destroyed, Frodo not only comes back to himself, but comes back with the unbearable (to him) knowledge of what it's like to be completely without compassion. I think that's why it's so important to him to be compassionate in the Shire… post 2506 - 2Jedismom

…Regarding Frodo's compassion... it's a little too much at the end. Even Merry tells him that he's going to have to quit being so darn nice. But you're right. He's learned a lesson about evil that very few ever learn since it wasn't an external lesson but an internal one. (Those kinds of lessons have the greatest impact) Not only did he totally succumb to it, but he was rather ruthless to my little Smeagol… post 2516 - carton253

Well that Frodo was a big mean bully! (to Smeagol)… post 2519 – Overtaxed

So as you can see, everything JRR Tolkien (and Peter Jackson) is welcome here in our New Row, our soon-to-be familiar New Hobbit Hole…; philosophy, opinion, good talk and frequent silliness.


TOPICS: Books/Literature; Chit/Chat; Poetry; TV/Movies; The Hobbit Hole
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To: Vindibudd
Welcome to the Hobbit Hole. We are a collection of hobbits, elves, dwarves, humans, gollums/Smeagals, and others.

Hope you enjoy your stay. Sometimes we do get into deep topics, but usually it is lighthearted and fun in here. We are open to anyone who wants to stop by and have a few pints.

42,441 posted on 11/19/2002 3:21:17 PM PST by htur_75
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To: HairOfTheDog; Vindibudd
Oh good! I hope the tutor helps.

Better tell the new guy about the egroup...
42,442 posted on 11/19/2002 3:40:12 PM PST by 2Jedismom
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To: 2Jedismom
Didn't want to overwhelm him. Thought I would see if he wanted to settle in around here first!
42,443 posted on 11/19/2002 3:47:50 PM PST by HairOfTheDog
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To: HairOfTheDog
Lord Of The Rings star Elijah Wood has hit out at claims Frodo Baggins and Sam Gamgee have a gay relationship in the JRR Tolkien novel - he thinks they are just good friends. But the actor - who is a huge fan of Tolkien's epic adventure - admits he sees how the mistake could be made. Wood says, "They have a very close relationship that sort of transcends friends. Those feelings are probably there and they probably exist. I wouldn't say that it has anything to do with homosexuality but it is certainly one possible interpretation of it. I don't think Frodo or Sam, in the way they are portrayed, either confirm or deny it. But I personally don't really see it from that perspective. I just see them as being completely tied to each other in a very personal and emotional way. Sam sort of tends the earth and comes from a very servile background, and he kind of dotes on Frodo, who helps and guides Sam. They compliment each other in terms of where they come from. That's how I see it anyway."
42,444 posted on 11/19/2002 3:48:04 PM PST by Paul Atreides
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To: Paul Atreides
Well, that was a tactful answer I guess... what was the context of the question?
42,445 posted on 11/19/2002 3:49:48 PM PST by HairOfTheDog
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To: Paul Atreides
I can not even believe this topic is even raised. Who but the most deviant in our society could even think they had a homosexual relationship? These are people who have no clear understanding of what love really is. It's all perversion.
42,446 posted on 11/19/2002 3:53:01 PM PST by 2Jedismom
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To: Paul Atreides
Well, doesn't some people say the same thing about David and Jonathan, or Naomi and Ruth? Some people just don't understand that two people could have a strong relationship and a love for eachother without making it a sexual thing. They don't understand the different types of love. It annoys me that they have to put that spin on it.
42,447 posted on 11/19/2002 3:56:22 PM PST by htur_75
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To: HairOfTheDog
That is the entire context of the article. Frankly, I get really tired of the homosexual community trying to turn any friendship between two men into something filthy. There are so many complexities to the the roles of Frodo and Sam. LOTR is written in the style of the Middle Ages, in which people were born into certain class levels and loyalty to one's superior was expressed as a platonic love (a brotherly love). Also, I watched a National Geographic on the making of LOTR, and it stated that Frodo's and Sam's relationship was based on Tolkein's experiences in WWI, in which the class distinctions between the upper class officers and the lower class infantry disappeared on the front lines.
42,448 posted on 11/19/2002 3:57:35 PM PST by Paul Atreides
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To: htur_75
doesn't some people say the same thing
I mean don't some people... I realized that was very bad grammer after I posted. Sorry.
42,449 posted on 11/19/2002 3:57:57 PM PST by htur_75
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To: Paul Atreides
That was one of the better points of that Nat'l geograhic thing...before the shirtless moron at the end.
42,450 posted on 11/19/2002 3:59:10 PM PST by 2Jedismom
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To: 2Jedismom
It is raised by the same people who would have us believe that every great writer, artist, musician, inventor, leader, etc. of the past was a homosexual.
42,451 posted on 11/19/2002 3:59:31 PM PST by Paul Atreides
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To: 2Jedismom
Ugh! I turned it down when that part came up. I was wondering how a P.C. message would be interjected into the documentary.
42,452 posted on 11/19/2002 4:00:51 PM PST by Paul Atreides
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To: htur_75
I once had a literature instructor say that she thought the two male heroes of The Epic of Gilgamesh were lovers.
42,453 posted on 11/19/2002 4:02:04 PM PST by Paul Atreides
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To: Paul Atreides
Well, did you think Elijah's was a good answer?

I do... It was tactful. He can't say the idea is gross, even if he believed it, in the business he is in. He probably doesn't think the idea is gross, but I am glad he didn't say it should be part of our story. Glad they didn't ask Ian McK.
42,454 posted on 11/19/2002 4:02:07 PM PST by HairOfTheDog
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To: Paul Atreides
I wish I could find that article written by some gay magazine guy...he wrote a fairly decent review about FOTR...says basically the same thing, that it's very likely they didn't have a homosexual relationship...Tolkien didn't mean it that way. Then he launches into his own senario...his dream story so to speak and it was so disgusting. He just couldn't write a review that didn't have some sort of filth in it.
42,455 posted on 11/19/2002 4:03:00 PM PST by 2Jedismom
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To: HairOfTheDog
He could have just said "I don't think Tolkien meant it that way."

He said a tad too much, imo.
42,456 posted on 11/19/2002 4:06:07 PM PST by 2Jedismom
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To: HairOfTheDog
I think that a lot of actors and actresses have to be careful how they express their thoughts on homosexuality. I believe that Hollywood is full of homos and they would ruin anyone's career if they thought the person was repulsed by homosexuality. This is not to let Wood off of the hook. He may be the type that sees nothing wrong with it. Remember the producer's comment about the "gay mafia" in Hollywood? Even after he apologized, it was stated that he would never work in Hollywood again. And this from the people always beating their drums about the Blacklisting!
42,457 posted on 11/19/2002 4:09:11 PM PST by Paul Atreides
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To: Paul Atreides; 2Jedismom
Yeah, I wish he wouldn't have said so much. I just wish it didn't come up.
42,458 posted on 11/19/2002 4:10:32 PM PST by HairOfTheDog
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To: SuziQ
what the heck is CARMEX?

awesome lip balm...

q-tips fer cleanin, graphite fer lubricatin'...

42,459 posted on 11/19/2002 4:10:58 PM PST by g'nad
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To: HairOfTheDog
I just wish it didn't come up.

Me too, sis.

sigh

42,460 posted on 11/19/2002 4:12:14 PM PST by 2Jedismom
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