Posted on 03/14/2002 5:07:26 AM PST by HairOfTheDog
This is a continuation of the infamous thread New Zealander Builds Hobbit Hole originally posted on January 26, 2001 by John Farson, who at the time undoubtedly thought he had found a rather obscure article that would elicit a few replies and die out. Without knowing it, he became the founder of the Hobbit Hole. For reasons incomprehensible to some, the thread grew to over 4100 replies. It became the place for hobbits and friends of hobbits to chit chat and share LoTR news and views, hang out, and talk amongst ourselves in the comfort of familiar surroundings.
In keeping with the new posting guidelines, the thread idea is continuing here, as will the Green Dragon Inn, our more structured spin-off thread, as soon as we figure out how to move all the good discussion that has been had there. As for the Hobbit Hole, we will just start fresh, bringing only a few mathoms such as the picture above with us to make it feel like home, and perhaps a walk down memory lane:
Our discussion has been light:
It very well may be that a thread named "New Zealander builds Hobbit hole" will end up being the longest Tolkien thread of them all, with some of the best heartfelt content... Sorry John, but I would have rather it had been one with a more distinguished title!… post 252 - HairOfTheDog
However, I can still celebrate, with quiet dignity, the fact that what started as a laugh about some wacko in New Zealand has mutated and grown into a multifaceted discussion of the art, literature, and philosophy that is Tolkien. And now that I've managed to write the most pompous sentence of my entire life, I agree, Rosie… post 506 - JenB
Hah! I was number 1000!! (Elvish victory dance... wait, no; that would be too flitty) … post 1001 - BibChr
Real men don't have to be afraid of being flitty! Go for it. – post 1011 – HairOfTheDog
Seventeen years to research one mystical object seems a bit excessive… post 1007 - JenB
Okay...who's the wise guy who didn't renew Gandalf's research grant?… post 1024 – Overtaxed
To the very philosophical:
…Judas Iscariot obviously was a good man, or he wouldn't have been chosen to be one of the Apostles. He loved Jesus, like all of the Apostles, but he betrayed him. Yet without his betrayal, the Passion and Crucifixion would never have occurred, and mankind would not have been redeemed. So without his self-destruction infinite good would not have been accomplished. I certainly do not mean this to be irreverant but it seems to me that this describes the character of Gollum, in the scenes so movingly portrayed above… Lucius Cornelius Sulla
To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters…
…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB
Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog
…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1
Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed
-----------------------------------------
Oh, I think by the time Frodo reaches the Cracks, he's not even himself anymore! I think he's not only on the brink of a dangerous place physically, he's on the brink of losing himself completely during the exchange with Gollum. But for some reason, the take-over isn't complete till he actually has to throw the Ring in. The person speaking to Gollum is not Frodo, but the "Wheel of Fire" that Sam sees. After the Ring is destroyed, Frodo not only comes back to himself, but comes back with the unbearable (to him) knowledge of what it's like to be completely without compassion. I think that's why it's so important to him to be compassionate in the Shire… post 2506 - 2Jedismom
…Regarding Frodo's compassion... it's a little too much at the end. Even Merry tells him that he's going to have to quit being so darn nice. But you're right. He's learned a lesson about evil that very few ever learn since it wasn't an external lesson but an internal one. (Those kinds of lessons have the greatest impact) Not only did he totally succumb to it, but he was rather ruthless to my little Smeagol… post 2516 - carton253
Well that Frodo was a big mean bully! (to Smeagol)… post 2519 – Overtaxed
So as you can see, everything JRR Tolkien (and Peter Jackson) is welcome here in our New Row, our soon-to-be familiar New Hobbit Hole…; philosophy, opinion, good talk and frequent silliness.
Are you sure about Glorfindel? I seem to remember a discussion way back, probably in the old Hobbit Hole, that this was just a reuse of a name, not the same character. Isn't it true that Tolkien talks about this matter in his letters?
See the article here! For those who don't know, the Hugo is one of the most revered Science fiction/fantasy awards, last year's... wrongness notwithstanding. It is voted for every year by the attendees of the WorldCon - that's ordinary geeks, not weird actor types like the Oscars.
Oh, sorry, this is Tolkien related stuff, but Connie Willis is just such a great author... go read her To Say Nothing of the Dog. Trust me, if you have a working sense of humor and like well written stories, you'll like it.
Anyway, LotR is probably a shoo-in for best movie.... the competition is Harry Potter, Monsters Inc, Shrek, and Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Although Harry Potter 4 did win for best novel last year, that was because of a very weak field, in which the other four nominees were A. books no one had ever heard of or B. books which are in the middle of a fantasy series and should have won anyway but I think the Hugo people are afraid of Robert Jordan syndrome.
So, check it out if you feel like it... this makes my day, it's so much better than the Oscars because this is fan stuff, not snooty Hollywood people stuff.
Yes it was in the old Hole, I remember it well. Caused some trouble when I suggested that Tolkien screwed up and had to write himself out of a corner :) I'll see what I can find out in The Letters about this.
I was wrong...I wasn't around for a while. I forgot about the department appreciation luncheon. Then they gave us the rest of the afternoon off. I'm off to trim the verge before the neighbors start squawking!
But then Legolas says "AIR-agorn, son of AIR-athorn...you owe him your allegiance."
I've always said "AIR-agorn...what about you?
I have no idea, but I like it!
Thank you for your excellent recommendations. I am copying and pasting them into an Email to myself so I'll have them at hand (same for HairoftheDog's suggestions). Interestingly, I figured that Silmarillion should be next, but didn't want to go with my uneducated guess. I came to that conclusion after reading Sam and Frodo's discussion at the end of The Two Towers about the tales and adventures of the Silmarillion, how they were darker and more desperate adventures than what Frodo and Sam were experiencing, and yet they got through their "tale" and in doing so, passed on the light of Earendil for Sam and Frodo to use in the dark places.
Thanks. You folks are the best.
Anyway, LotR was a shoo-in for nominee, but even so, it says something. The award doesn't get chosen until July or August, but I'll let you know whether it wins...
The only real resource we have to answer this question is in The Peoples of Middle-earth (The History of Middle-earth Vol. 12): XIII Last Writings, Glorfindel. Christopher Tolkien dates the notes he gives here at 1972, the year before his father's death.I don't have that book...sorry :(
Basically, in the middle of everything else that has been going on, my printer started p*ssing me off this morning and I couldn't print one page without it jamming. I wanted to huck it through the window. So I went to Office Depot and ordered the best office-grade all-in one printer-fax-scanner-copier they had. $500. It is too big and too nice for the little rinky-dink stand I had my old printer on, so I bought a new credenza to put it on. Which meant I had to move my desk and my computer, which meant I had to disconnect everything. I just got it all cleaned behind and moved and put back together. I still can't print, because the printer wont be here till the 23rd, but when it gets here I will be ready!
Hope you all had fun.
I am so glad LOTR got Hugo nominations--although it doesn't surprise me. If they hadn't, there might have been war, lol. ;)
Thought you all might be interested in this article from Cinematographer Magazine, about the different methods they used in the movie. I thought the discussion about lighting was particularly interesting, and they even mention the lights in Galadriel's eyes that we were talking about the other day:
American Cinematographer Magazine
Here's the bit about Galadriel's eyes:
To achieve a glowing, luminescent quality for the Elvish Queen Galadriel (Cate Blanchett), Lesnie used soft light exposed at key. Lesnie also extended Jackson's predilection for eyelights. "Peter likes to see eyelights, and to create that effect we usually used 'wands,' which were two 2-foot Kino Flo tubes taped together. In close quarters, these wands are ideal and virtually instantaneous tools; they have four intensity levels, they're cool and very flexible, and they're perfect for handholding. For the character of Galadriel, however, I wanted to create a special eyelight, because Tolkien describes her by saying 'no sign of age was upon her, unless it were in the depths of her eyes; for these were keen as lances in the starlight and yet profound, the wells of deep memory.' In order to achieve that quality, we created the 'Galadrilight,' which was simply a rig of hundreds of Christmas-tree lights mounted next to the camera. This technique placed many reflections in Cate's eyes, creating a wonderful otherworldliness. Her skin is so luminescent that sometimes I didn't have to use any fill, because the Galadrilight was doing the work."
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.