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To: SunkenCiv; null and void
Now's here's an odd thing to start off the day.

The 82-foot-tall arch was constructed to celebrate the victory of Constantine the Great over Maxentius at the Battle of the Milvian Bridge in A.D. 312.

Only a couple of minutes before I saw this thread/news, I had been thinking about Constantine. Not exactly someone who comes to mind very often, yet here he was, again, mere seconds later. 🤔

The context of the thoughts had to do with the Nicene Creed, now in its 1700th year. Here's that and the above date, all rolled together in one place:

Although Constantine lived much of his life as a pagan and later as a catechumen, he began to favour Christianity beginning in 312, finally becoming a Christian and being baptised by Eusebius of Nicomedia, an Arian bishop, although the Catholic Church and the Coptic Orthodox Church maintain that he was baptised by Pope Sylvester I. He played an influential role in the proclamation of the Edict of Milan in 313, which declared tolerance for Christianity in the Roman Empire. He convoked the First Council of Nicaea in 325 which produced the statement of Christian belief known as the Nicene Creed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constantine_the_Great

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Milvian_Bridge#Vision_of_Constantine

The thought was more of a passing question, as in what would have to happen to upend literally 1700 years of settled doctrine. Doctrinal debates certainly don't accomplish anything useful, or they would have done so already. Therefore, nobody but nobody is going to battle 1700 years-worth of established beliefs (much less anything more ancient than that) by using the doctrinal debate methodology, because every debater already knows everything already. They're only there to make other people see the light.

Anyway, I then sat down to peruse the news, and discovered that

Rome's triumphal Arch of Constantine was struck by lightning during a storm that also felled trees and flooded streets, as more than two inches of rain fell in less than an hour.


8 posted on 09/06/2024 4:02:10 AM PDT by Ezekiel (🆘️ "Come fly with US". 🔴 Ingenuity -- because the Son of David begins with MARS ♂️, aka every man)
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To: Ezekiel

Constantine was in trouble at the Milvian bridge and sought the God of the Christians for mercy.

Smart move—it worked out swimmingly.


9 posted on 09/06/2024 4:13:20 AM PDT by one guy in new jersey
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To: Ezekiel
Amazing that the arch could survive nearly 1712 years before being struck by lightning. I assume from the story that this was the first time this has happened.

The Nicene Creed in use today does not date from the First Council of Nicaea in 325 but from the First Council of Constantinople in 381. They are similar but there are a number of differences. The Western churches made a later insertion into the 381 creed, adding Filioque ("and from the Son") to the original text.

15 posted on 09/06/2024 10:38:30 AM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: Ezekiel

Constantine was baptised an ARIAN, not a Catholic-Orthodox Christian - his belief system (the Arian) was opposed to the Nicene creed.

Although Constantine deserves credit for ceasing persecution of the Church by the Roman state, and although his mother St Helena was a lifelong devout Catholic, he was certainly no friend of the Catholic Church. He himself followed his father Constantus worshipping the many pagan gods, and became a sun-worshipper.

He favored Arianism in opposition to Catholicism - seeing Arianism as more tractable to influence by the emperor.

He used State funds to pay the travel expenses for all the bishops to travel to Nicea for a Council at which he hoped they would embrace Arianism. Instead they roundly condemned it and reiterated traditional Catholic doctrines, with only two dissenters. Expressing this by writing the Nicene Creed.

Constantine continued to favour Arians against Catholics, and eventually just before his death, he was baptised a Christian, but an Arian, not a Catholic.

Constantine’s grandson and successor as Emperor Julian the Apostate did everything he could, short of outright persecution, to suppress Christianity and promote paganism, and even tried to rebuild the Jewish Temple to restart Temple Judaism, not out of love for Judaism but just hatred of Christianity.

The historical reality is that the Church first called itself Catholic around c110AD (Ignatius of Antioch). The usage is almost certainly older - Ignatius gives no hint that his use of the term is either novel or controversial.


19 posted on 02/05/2025 7:26:21 AM PST by Cronos
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